Questions regarding Phrixotrichus

[arthurliuyz]

I found some Phrixotrichus spp. and I'm wanting to acquire some soon.
The seller had two species for sale - P. vulpinus and P. scrofa.
My question is mostly related with the scrofa.
This is the pictures the seller provided me with:

The Tarantula Gallery - birdspidersCH

wonderful tarantula (Theraphosidae) images curated by arachnologist Rick C. West. Hundreds of tarantula pictures of well-known and incredibly rare species

www.birdspiders.com

The Tarantula Gallery - birdspidersCH

wonderful tarantula (Theraphosidae) images curated by arachnologist Rick C. West. Hundreds of tarantula pictures of well-known and incredibly rare species

www.birdspiders.com

I've heard some say that the P. scrofa is actually not a Phrixotrichus sp.. and looks like this:

Phrixotrichus scrofa - Theraphosidae

Phrixotrichus scrofa (Molina, 1788), ook wel de "Chilean Copper" of "Chilean violet" genoemd, is een eerder neutrale, maar heel mooie Chileense semi-dwergvogelspin met een doorgaans zachtaardig temperament. Officieel behoort ze nog steeds tot het Phrixotrichus-genus, zij het dat je haar...

www.theraphosidae.be

However, according to WSC, Phrixotrichus scrofa (Molina, 1782) is still a valid name.
Can anyone please clarify this for me? TIA.

TL;DR: What does P. scrofa actually look like and is it still a Phrixotrichus?

 

[TarantulaMel]

My P.scrofa looks like the 3rd picture.

 

[A guy]

My P.scrofa looks like the 3rd picture.

The ones the OP has on the link is NOT P. scrofa, so is yours. True P. scrofa has two urticating hair patches

 

[arthurliuyz]

The ones the OP has on the link is NOT P. scrofa, so is yours. True P. scrofa has two urticating hair patches

The Tarantula Gallery - birdspidersCH

wonderful tarantula (Theraphosidae) images curated by arachnologist Rick C. West. Hundreds of tarantula pictures of well-known and incredibly rare species

www.birdspiders.com

The Tarantula Gallery - birdspidersCH

wonderful tarantula (Theraphosidae) images curated by arachnologist Rick C. West. Hundreds of tarantula pictures of well-known and incredibly rare species

www.birdspiders.com

Aren't these the real ones?

 

[A guy]

The Tarantula Gallery - birdspidersCH

wonderful tarantula (Theraphosidae) images curated by arachnologist Rick C. West. Hundreds of tarantula pictures of well-known and incredibly rare species

www.birdspiders.com

The Tarantula Gallery - birdspidersCH

wonderful tarantula (Theraphosidae) images curated by arachnologist Rick C. West. Hundreds of tarantula pictures of well-known and incredibly rare species

www.birdspiders.com

Aren't these the real ones?

Yes, those ones are the real P. scrofa. The 3rd link is not even Phrixotrichus

 

[Jonathan6303]

Many Phrixotrichus have died in captivity so they may not be the best species to get, especially with there price tag.

 

[A guy]

Many Phrixotrichus have died in captivity so they may not be the best species to get, especially with there price tag.

Not many, majority of them lol

 

[arthurliuyz]

Many Phrixotrichus have died in captivity so they may not be the best species to get, especially with there price tag.

I have spoken with a few people in my area who had successfully kept them. I think I'm still gonna give it a shot.

 

[Jonathan6303]

I have spoken with a few people in my area who had successfully kept them. I think I'm still gonna give it a shot.

How long have they successfully kept them. Have they raised slings to adults. Not being a sceptic just genuinely curious.

 

[Marlana]

Well I assume people have bred them correctly if slings are for sale, especially since Chile isn’t exporting. So someone is keeping them correctly.

I have seen real P.scrofa slings for sale lately. I’d want actual pictures of the slings for sale. They should look like the first link. Not just a reference to a website. They have been mislabeled in the past with a species we now call Euathlus sp metropolitana. Both great spiders but I’m partial to Chilean species.

 

[arthurliuyz]

How long have they successfully kept them. Have they raised slings to adults. Not being a sceptic just genuinely curious.

He has a 1.5-2" female vulpinus that I believe was raised from a sling.

 

[Jonathan6303]

He has a 1.5-2" female vulpinus that I believe was raised from a sling.

Does the seller have the husbandry information he used to raise the sling.

 

[arthurliuyz]

Does the seller have the husbandry information he used to raise the sling.

I just spoke to two sellers - the first one raised his from a sling to a 2" female, and the other seller's specimens successfully molted multiple times with him.

The first seller, the one that raised his from a sling to a 2" female housed his in an enclosure with the height for an arboreal and and the floor space for a terrestrial. He also provided his with a large water dish. I tried asking him about substrate moisture but he believed that it doesn't matter (I personally am very skeptical about this) because although given the space to roam it acts like an arboreal and rarely stays on the ground. However, he also mentioned that he found it necessary to provide something like mantis climbing sheets (don't know what they are called in English - see pic) or he had found that when they climb high on the smooth walls they suddenly die for no reason (if that is indeed the case, my guess is that it fell, with makes me skeptical about the fact they are "arboreal", but according to his experience, they do have very arboreal tendencies which is strange IMO). His specimen grew from a tiny sling to 4cm (about 1.5") in about a year's time.
Pics he provided (used with the permission of the pic owner):



The second seller, the one that had specimens successfully molt a couple of times in his care, mentioned that he found that ventilation is important and one can provide a water dish if temps are higher than ideal. He kept 1/3 of the substrate moist and said that if housed without one, 1/2 of the substrate kept moist is more ideal. He also mentioned that his specimens are great eaters that were on cricket legs but changed to newborn mealworms, newborn red runner nymphs, and dubias cut in half.

PS If you are wondering, the first seller is from Beijing and the second is from Hohhot. You can check the temps and humidity there if you want.

 

[Paul Osullivan]

Phrixotrichus scrofa (Molina, 1782) is still a valid name.
Can anyone please clarify this for me? TIA.

From: The Andean tarantulas Euathlus Ausserer, 1875, Paraphysa Simon, 1892 and Phrixotrichus Simon, 1889 (Araneae: Theraphosidae): phylogenetic analysis, genera redefinition and new species descriptions Carlos Perafán* and Fernando Pérez-Miles

Based on the descriptions of P. scrofa holotype of Schiapelli and Gerschman de P. (1963) and Legendre and Calderon (1984), and our examination of the holotype of P. auratus (in the synonymy with P. scrofa), P. scrofa clearly differ from Paraphysa (sub Euathlus), in the characters indicated in the diagnosis. The generic names Aranea and Mygale used in early times for P. scrofa are pre-occupied, so Phrixotrichus should be used, and is here restored. In our phylogenetic analysis three species of Phrixotrichus were resolved as a monophyletic clade, sister group of Euathlus.

Diagnosis: Differs from other Theraphosinae genera by the presence of urticating setae type IV gathered on two lateral patches (Figure 10C). Male differs by the palpal organ morphology with two sub equal prolateral keels (PI and PS) and the tip directed retrolaterally (Figures 9A,B, 10A,B), tibial apophysis with only one apical spine on RB and absence of basal spine on PB (Figure 9D). Female differs by the presence of two spermathecal receptacles with a lateral spheroid chamber (Figure 10D,E) and two lateral patches of urticating setae.

 

[Jonathan6303]

I just spoke to two sellers - the first one raised his from a sling to a 2" female, and the other seller's specimens successfully molted multiple times with him.

The first seller, the one that raised his from a sling to a 2" female housed his in an enclosure with the height for an arboreal and and the floor space for a terrestrial. He also provided his with a large water dish. I tried asking him about substrate moisture but he believed that it doesn't matter (I personally am very skeptical about this) because although given the space to roam it acts like an arboreal and rarely stays on the ground. However, he also mentioned that he found it necessary to provide something like mantis climbing sheets (don't know what they are called in English - see pic) or he had found that when they climb high on the smooth walls they suddenly die for no reason (if that is indeed the case, my guess is that it fell, with makes me skeptical about the fact they are "arboreal", but according to his experience, they do have very arboreal tendencies which is strange IMO). His specimen grew from a tiny sling to 4cm (about 1.5") in about a year's time.
Pics he provided (used with the permission of the pic owner):

View attachment 428393 View attachment 428394 View attachment 428396

The second seller, the one that had specimens successfully molt a couple of times in his care, mentioned that he found that ventilation is important and one can provide a water dish if temps are higher than ideal. He kept 1/3 of the substrate moist and said that if housed without one, 1/2 of the substrate kept moist is more ideal. He also mentioned that his specimens are great eaters that were on cricket legs but changed to newborn mealworms, newborn red runner nymphs, and dubias cut in half.

PS If you are wondering, the first seller is from Beijing and the second is from Hohhot. You can check the temps and humidity there if you want.

Thank you. Hopefully a breeding project can get going down there

 

[Marlana]

Phrixotrichus scrofa (Molina, 1782) is still a valid name.
Can anyone please clarify this for me? TIA.

From: The Andean tarantulas Euathlus Ausserer, 1875, Paraphysa Simon, 1892 and Phrixotrichus Simon, 1889 (Araneae: Theraphosidae): phylogenetic analysis, genera redefinition and new species descriptions Carlos Perafán* and Fernando Pérez-Miles

Based on the descriptions of P. scrofa holotype of Schiapelli and Gerschman de P. (1963) and Legendre and Calderon (1984), and our examination of the holotype of P. auratus (in the synonymy with P. scrofa), P. scrofa clearly differ from Paraphysa (sub Euathlus), in the characters indicated in the diagnosis. The generic names Aranea and Mygale used in early times for P. scrofa are pre-occupied, so Phrixotrichus should be used, and is here restored. In our phylogenetic analysis three species of Phrixotrichus were resolved as a monophyletic clade, sister group of Euathlus.

Diagnosis: Differs from other Theraphosinae genera by the presence of urticating setae type IV gathered on two lateral patches (Figure 10C). Male differs by the palpal organ morphology with two sub equal prolateral keels (PI and PS) and the tip directed retrolaterally (Figures 9A,B, 10A,B), tibial apophysis with only one apical spine on RB and absence of basal spine on PB (Figure 9D). Female differs by the presence of two spermathecal receptacles with a lateral spheroid chamber (Figure 10D,E) and two lateral patches of urticating setae.

Yes still a valid name. People were selling Euathlus sp. metropolitana as scrofa for a long time. So now it’s confusing on which you’ll get.

 

[arthurliuyz]

Yes still a valid name. People were selling Euathlus sp. metropolitana as scrofa for a long time. So now it’s confusing on which you’ll get.

I think the seller is selling the real ones. There are two obvious urticating hair patches on the seller's pics of the ones he's selling.