OBT in bad shape, and advice?

[betuana]

My 2"+ OBT molted 3.5-4 weeks ago, and hasn't been doing well since. I left it alone for a while to not stress it right after a molt, but it hadn't come out really at all from its burrow in that time. I can see in from the side of the tank, and its been mostly huddled in place, occasionally turning slightly. I figured I was just missing when it was out (though it was almost ALWAYS out pre-molt), and didn't worry too much. After 3 weeks (earlier this week) I offered it food, and it flat out ignored the food, didn't even react to it being in there. Today I used a small stick to clear a bit more of the webbing from the side to get a better view, and saw that it was sitting with its legs folded under it. The little guy would twitch its leg a bit if I touched it lightly, but otherwise ignored me completely, which is NOT normal at all for an OBT. Its not in a full death curl, but definitely heading that direction. The bottom joints of its legs are laying on the substrate, so that its toes are pointed in towards its center...

I'm going to put it in an ICU, since its so unresponsive and curled to that extent. But with OBTs being such a dry loving species, I do have some concern about the standard moist ICU that has served so well before. I would assume with a curl that does not seem to be at all mite induced that moist is still the way to go, not dry, but figured I'd put out the question to people here as it if there are other suggestions. P. Murius are supposed to be well neigh to indestructible, so I can't really figure out the problem. The only change recently was the molt several weeks ago, so I have to think something happened with that, since its when this seems to have started.

Any suggestions would be appreciated. Hopefully the ICU will do its magic again and help this one to recover!

 

[wedge07]

I would go ahead and put it in a standard ICU. My A. avic did something similar when I first got him but came right out of it after I put him in the ICU. Even though it is a dry loving species it probably still needs to be hydrated, make sure you have a bowl of water in the ICU also.

 

[betuana]

Pictures

I transfered the little one into an ICU - even while pulling apart its burrow webbing, and lifting it and gently nudging it into the container it didn't really react. It finally shakily (weak, not diskinetic shaky) tottered into the container and onto the damp towel. As soon as it stopped trying to move it curled its feet back under its legs (you can kinda see it in the pictures, they were taken as soon as it stopped moving into the container, so it had been walking a few seconds before hand). It seemed to faceplant onto the damp towels, so hopefully the water is something it wants and will help it. Very unlike an OBT to be so docile, extremely slow, etc. Its obviously not feeling so good. Still trying to hide a bit, even with its feet tucked under it. Poor little Loki...

Here's the pictures. Not sure they will help, but had them so I'm posting them.

 

[LeilaNami]

Had an A. seemani that did this. A guy at a show gave it to me for free because it was already going into a curl. Did an ICU and in 24hrs he was back to normal . Did you see any place she could have torn during a rough molt? Though 3 weeks is kinda long for that...

 

[c'est ma]

So sorry to hear about this, Betuana. Sure is a cute little guy. Hope he recovers for you.

 

[G. pulchra]

It sure looks like it's trying to drink, it's probably dehydrated.

 

[dotdman]

From personal experience with having this sort of issue with this same species in the past, I agree with the above. Offer it water and see if that improves its condition.

Kindest regards,

Kevin P.

 

[codykrr]

well im sorry to hear that..one of my favorite species....but ifit does die...let me know you adress and ill send you one for free ok...ive got plenty to spare...there at about 1.5 inches and voracious as ever.

 

[Pacmaster]

well im sorry to hear that..one of my favorite species....but ifit does die...let me know you adress and ill send you one for free ok...ive got plenty to spare...there at about 1.5 inches and voracious as ever.

That is MIGHTY nice of you Cody!
I mean it, good show!

 

[Pacmaster]

It sure looks like it's trying to drink, it's probably dehydrated.

From personal experience with having this sort of issue with this same species in the past, I agree with the above. Offer it water and see if that improves its condition.

Kindest regards,

Kevin P.

How so?
Please elaborate on this?
Thankyou!

 

[dotdman]

I've had two specimens of OBT that have exhibited the behaviour described by Betuana. In both cases, I moved the repsective OBT into a container (large vial) with wetted tissue paper (not sopping, but wet enough that water could easily be ingested from its surface by, say, a tarantula). Their condition improved almost immediately and, within 48 hours, both were taking food again.

I had the same thing happen more recently with an Avicularia avicularia who became dehydrated while I was on vacation for a couple of weeks. Those in charge of such things did not take care of my animals quite as they should have while I was away, though this was the only one seemingly to suffer from it. I employed the same intervention method with the same succesful end result.

Kindest regards,

Kevin P.

 

[codykrr]

haha..man...i just hate seeing people loose a T...i have lots of obts...seriously...to many. and i am a firm beliver in karma. so maybe one day someone may be curtious enough to do the same....

 

[codykrr]

oh and what does the term...."mighty white of you mean" thats a new one to me....

 

[Pacmaster]

Karma is a powerful force, and it does get back to everyone in the way they deserve . . .
You should get some good coming just for the offer . . .

 

[Pacmaster]

So the pictures are showing what you take to be a dehydrated tarantula?
What I am wondering is what indicates dehydration, is it the rolled-up kinda look or what?
More specifically, what in the pictures makes you think dehydration is the culprit?

I ask this because I dont keep waterdish in my T cages, but mist them 2x a week religiously, and only once did I think I saw one drink from droplets.

 

[dotdman]

It's a combination of the pictures and the written observations posted - they match my own earlier observations of tarantulas I suspected were dehydrated. In the case of the OBT, a typically lively and rather active tarantula becomes lethargic, seemingly has trouble moving, and rejects food. The not-quite death curl the original poster describes (and shows in the photos) looks and sounds just like what I observed myself.

My suspicions with regard to my own specimens were confirmed by their positive reaction to my introduction of water to them. I can't be 100% positive that what Betuana is experiencing is the same, but I would consider it the most likely culprit from the information divulged thus far.

I keep water dishes for some tarantulas and not for others - my terrestrials tend to get them while my arboreals receive regular mistings instead. I see the arboreals (Avicularia and Poecilotheria in my case) drinking from droplets in their webbing or on the walls of their tanks semi-regularly.

Kindest regards,

Kevin P.

 

[Pacmaster]

Exactly what I was looking for, a perfect explanation!
Thankyou!

I have actually seen some of the smallest slings I have act similar to what you described, and they did indeed "go back to normal" soon after a good misting.
They would sit kinda like that on the substrate(arboreal avics).
I guess its easy for a smaller spider to dehyrate.
Does the OP say how big this T is?

 

[betuana]

My OBT was about 2 inches in legspan premolt. I haven't actually seen it sitting in a measurable position since the molt, but presumably it s a bit bigger than it was before.

Thanks for the replies and words of support everyone! And for the generous offer Cody! Hopefully given that the T was still able to move by itself at all, and that it seemed to go for the paper towels once it felt them, it should recover. With the reputation for indestructibleness that these guys have, it seems like it should be able to recover. And then it will be pissed when it realizes I had to destroy its burrow/web to get it out! (And sheesh, that was some of the thickest webbing I've had to go through, it went over and over and over the same areas ALOT!!)

I've had slings in worse shape (couldn't really even move) after I've been gone several days, etc who have recovered with ICU, so I have some hope for this one...but its still sitting in a 'mostly' death curl position at the moment, although it has moved from where it was sitting when I put it in last night (now turned facing outwards). The ICU is in a dark warm place (I've found that terra cotta pots turned upside down fit nicely over and ICU, have a hole in the top for good air exchange, but keep it dark and less stressful for them), so now its just a waiting game for improvement...I'll get pictures tonight of how its doing.

It did have a water bowl in its cage, less than a legspan away from its burrow actually. I also would usually overflow it slightly (letting the substrate dry out inbetween overflows) on one side to make sure there was some damp substrate in case it couldn't figure out the water bowl. All terrestrial slings Ts over 1 inch have water bowls, the rest get dampened substrate with a dropper (a corner of their cage for most since they are desert Ts, the haplos get moist substrate all around!). I've seen almost all my Ts seem to drink from the wet corner after I use a dropper to add water. (B. vagans, emilia, bohemi, smithi, albo, G. aureo, pulchra, A. genic, GBB, C. elegans, L. para)I try to make sure to give them water 2-3 times a week, in addition to whatever moisture they get from weekly food (and I try to keep water bowls full - except my adult female rosie - her's got to dry out for a while to eliminate the stupid baby crickets!!! She didn't seem to mind at all). My arboreals get damp substrate and sprayed walls, I've seen them both sit on the spray on the walls apparently drinking, as well as going down to the substrate to drink (avic versi 1" slings and 2" P. Rufilata). I hadn't ever actually seen the OBT drink prior to this time, but its about the same position, the little guys faceplant into their dampened substrate.

Anyways, there's my little blurb on T's drinking. I think I'm going to look into getting a second humidifier for that room (there is already one going full time into the snake cage, and yet despite that running (and presumably defusing at least somewhat into the room), and the house humidifier being set higher, the humidity in that room reads only to be about 20%. My house is DRY. Odd being in the midwest. I crank open all the windows if its reasonably warm out and it rains just to try to get some humidity in...its kinda ridiculous.

I'll give an update tonight when I get home and check on the OBT again, hopefully its showing some improvement!

 

[betuana]

Not looking so good today. My OBT hasn't moved at all since this morning, and seems to be more or less in a full curl. Its also completely unresponsive to touch at this point. Its not totally stiff, so I'm going to keep trying until I'm sure it is dead (smells dead, turns to a stiff board, etc), but doesn't seem as hopeful as it did. I've gently turned it over after taking these and dropped water onto its mouth to try and help it drink, if it even can. I'll just have to wait and see if it recovers at all or not. I looked closely at it when I checked on it today and saw no signs of injury, on top or underneath. Everything looks perfectly fine, except that it seems a bit dehydrated, and is not moving. Poor Loki.

Anyways, here are a few pictures from today.

 

[ozy]

so sorry

I am so sad to hear this, I have water available for all my Ts, little containers with glass marbles inside so the Ts can't drown, I have observed all of them at times drinking. for the small Ts I use plastic bottlecaps.

Good luck, I hope your little guy recovers.