My female M. Balfouri dropped a sac.

[Arachnopotamus Rex]

What are the room humidity needs of the eggs? Same as the mom?
Do I feed the mom now since she wouldn't eat last weekend or wait until saturday like normal?
Any other advice on things i should do or not do?

Asking everyone I can so I don't make any mistakes or forget anything.

Also she anchored the web hammock her eggs are in to the enclosure ceiling and corkbark/substrate floor, its not in her burrow, so its like between 2 web pillars in the middle of the enclosure, but i think i can still open it just enough to add pre-killed crickets in when needed without effecting the sac.

 

[Arachnophobphile]

What are the room humidity needs of the eggs? Same as the mom?
Do I feed the mom now since she wouldn't eat last weekend or wait until saturday like normal?
Any other advice on things i should do or not do?

Asking everyone I can so I don't make any mistakes or forget anything.

Also she anchored the web hammock her eggs are in to the enclosure ceiling and corkbark/substrate floor, its not in her burrow, so its like between 2 web pillars in the middle of the enclosure, but i think i can still open it just enough to add pre-killed crickets in when needed without effecting the sac.

Here's a link I found. Scroll to first reply down by @Liquifin it should help you. Also the reply from @cold blood

Eggsac care

Hey everyone, I recently got my first two breeding pairs and I think I'm ready to attempt. I was able to find quite a bit of information on the breeding process itself, but I'm having trouble finding reliable egg/sac care information. I have a few questions: 1. When pulling the sac at 30...

arachnoboards.com

 

[Arachnopotamus Rex]

Here's a link I found. Scroll to first reply down by @Liquifin it should help you. Also the reply from @cold blood

Eggsac care

Hey everyone, I recently got my first two breeding pairs and I think I'm ready to attempt. I was able to find quite a bit of information on the breeding process itself, but I'm having trouble finding reliable egg/sac care information. I have a few questions: 1. When pulling the sac at 30...

arachnoboards.com

Hmm... A lot of this info is about when to pull and turn the sac and what to do with it, I thought for M. Balfouri you leave it in since she will care for them and they are communal. They are also an arid species so is 70% humidity really needed for eggs?, and they don't make traditional round sacs that they can carry, but rather a sort of hammocked "egg packet" thats fixed to a surface by webbing like with jumping spiders, not sure that can even be turned normally...? I've seen her making a sort of petting motion on it, perhaps to shuffle them arouund in the sac?

 

[Arachnophobphile]

Hmm... A lot of this info is about when to pull and turn the sac and what to do with it, I thought for M. Balfouri you leave it in since she will care for them and they are communal. They are also an arid species so is 70% humidity really needed for eggs?, and they don't make traditional round sacs that they can carry, but rather a sort of hammocked "egg packet" thats fixed to a surface by webbing like with jumping spiders, not sure that can even be turned normally...? I've seen her making a sort of petting motion on it, perhaps to shuffle them arouund in the sac?

I don't know I never paired T's nor am I interested in doing so anytime soon.

I tried to provide a good link to help.

Give it a little while the experienced breeders will reply to you.

 

[viper69]

Hmm... A lot of this info is about when to pull and turn the sac and what to do with it, I thought for M. Balfouri you leave it in since she will care for them and they are communal. They are also an arid species so is 70% humidity really needed for eggs?, and they don't make traditional round sacs that they can carry, but rather a sort of hammocked "egg packet" thats fixed to a surface by webbing like with jumping spiders, not sure that can even be turned normally...? I've seen her making a sort of petting motion on it, perhaps to shuffle them arouund in the sac?

1. I personally know a breeder who had 3 generations in the same tank- not necessary to my knowledge to do so

2. Yes the island is arid. The trees get moisture from clouda if I recall.
However humidity in the burrow could likely be different than ground level.

 

[Arachnopotamus Rex]

1. I personally know a breeder who had 3 generations in the same tank- not necessary to my knowledge to do so

2. Yes the island is arid. The trees get moisture from clouda if I recall.
However humidity in the burrow could likely be different than ground level.

1. 3 Generations? Are tarantulas really uneffected by inbreeding? (I never did get a consensus on that before).

2. From what i could research, the average humidity in socotra is 66%, dipping to 58% and maxing at 73% during winter, which is confusing, because the area in photos or video looks bone dry, and 73% is very humid.
I wonder if the ground is just too rocky/calcified to hold the moisture, so its mostly airborne / in trees?
I tried to figure out which season they breed in, so i could match that humidity level for the air, but the enclosure's dirt is dry either way, and if it ever got damp, the copius amount of webbing covering the entire surface of the substrate would just wick it dry anyway.

I have to be doing something right if she dropped a sac though. Currently its dry in the tank but 80 degrees in the room and 63-68 humidity in the air, which is also what it was when she decided to lay eggs.

Source: https://weather-and-climate.com/average-monthly-Humidity-perc,Socotra-ye,Yemen

I don't know I never paired T's nor am I interested in doing so anytime soon.

I tried to provide a good link to help.

Give it a little while the experienced breeders will reply to you.

Appreciated.

 

[viper69]

1. 3 Generations? Are tarantulas really uneffected by inbreeding? (I never did get a consensus on that before).

2. From what i could research, the average humidity in socotra is 66%, dipping to 58% and maxing at 73% during winter, which is confusing, because the area in photos or video looks bone dry, and 73% is very humid.
I wonder if the ground is just too rocky/calcified to hold the moisture, so its mostly airborne / in trees?
I tried to figure out which season they breed in, so i could match that humidity level for the air, but the enclosure's dirt is dry either way, and if it ever got damp, the copius amount of webbing covering the entire surface of the substrate would just wick it dry anyway.

I have to be doing something right if she dropped a sac though. Currently its dry in the tank but 80 degrees in the room and 63-68 humidity in the air, which is also what it was when she decided to lay eggs.

Source: https://weather-and-climate.com/average-monthly-Humidity-perc,Socotra-ye,Yemen

1. I do not endorse inbreeding
2. Never been there

 

[cold blood]

Your focus on humidity numbers is misguided....simply keep an area damp.

I think you missed some points from that thread.....but you are right in your assumption that balfouri is uniquely different....the slings do in fact grow better when left with the mother...ideally for several instars....the best balfouri breeder I know, leaves them with the mother till 1.5" before selling a single one.

NEVER OPEN A BURROW TO INTRODUCE LIVE FOOD, ESPECIALLY WITH AN EGGSAC PRESENT!!

If mom is sealed in, she's OBVIOUSLY not looking for food.

Also important to note, hammock type sacs like this, do not need to be rotated, this should be obvious as they are pinned down by web and not carried.

 

[Arachnopotamus Rex]

Your focus on humidity numbers is misguided....simply keep an area damp.

I think you missed some points from that thread.....but you are right in your assumption that balfouri is uniquely different....the slings do in fact grow better when left with the mother...ideally for several instars....the best balfouri breeder I know, leaves them with the mother till 1.5" before selling a single one.

NEVER OPEN A BURROW TO INTRODUCE LIVE FOOD, ESPECIALLY WITH AN EGGSAC PRESENT!!

If mom is sealed in, she's OBVIOUSLY not looking for food.

Also important to note, hammock type sacs like this, do not need to be rotated, this should be obvious as they are pinned down by web and not carried.

As I mentioned earlier, she isnt actually in her burrow, she made the sac outside of her burrow in a random spot in the enclosure and is guarding it out in the open.
The sac webbing kind of looks like a stargate with how its attached to the ceiling and floor, with the sac at the base of it. I'm also aware the sac can't be turned, I pointed that out earlier.

Here is the current plan I'm going with, as per breeder instructions + climate records for socotra:
No feeding, no refilling water dish, no interacting, keep the room dark, no sounds or other vibrations until they hatch, which should be in about 44 more days from now. Once they hatch, feed the mother and she will share her food with them, leave them with mom for 3 months, keep room air at 80F and 65 humidity but keep soil dry.

 

[TheraMygale]

I really like Daves litte Beasties and he breeds a lot of M balfouris.

You might have already watched his videos but just in case you missed, im putting it here.

you recieved a lot of good advice. Daves will be similar and insightful. You can’t go wrong with his advice on this species.

the communal of M balfouris, is a result of breeding attempts. It was observed to be more successful. I have posted a link on a certain paper about this somewhere on the board.

it has not been observed in the wild, in Yemen yet, for obvious reasons.

is it possible? We can not say its not because it has not been possible to study. Its a captive thing.

https://ag.purdue.edu/department/entm/_docs/493_capstone/nicolas-cazzaniga.pdf

 

[Arachnopotamus Rex]

I really like Daves litte Beasties and he breeds a lot of M balfouris.

You might have already watched his videos but just in case you missed, im putting it here.

you recieved a lot of good advice. Daves will be similar and insightful. You can’t go wrong with his advice on this species.

the communal of M balfouris, is a result of breeding attempts. It was observed to be more successful. I have posted a link on a certain paper about this somewhere on the board.

it has not been observed in the wild, in Yemen yet, for obvious reasons.

is it possible? We can not say its not because it has not been possible to study. Its a captive thing.

https://ag.purdue.edu/department/entm/_docs/493_capstone/nicolas-cazzaniga.pdf

Yep, I have watched it already, just yesterday actually , and several other vids from Dave's channel (heating options vid, substrate depth debate vid, the vid with the sand spider, wolf spider, and japanese funnel web, the t. selidonia breeding guide, and a p metallica vid.

He gets very in-depth with care, breeding, housing, heating, and preventative measures, as well as hacks/ work arounds for setups, (one of his vids is the reason why all my Ts are always spending lots of time outside their burrows/corkbarks, even my fossorials).

Definitely a great info source.

I'd imagine that wild communals, if they happen, would be webbed tunnel networks underground or in trees. But we may just be expanding the mother/babies communal relationship into adulthood by having them in an enclosure for all I know.

 

[TheraMygale]

Yep, I have watched it already, just yesterday actually , and several other vids from Dave's channel (heating options vid, substrate depth debate vid, the vid with the sand spider, wolf spider, and japanese funnel web, the t. selidonia breeding guide, and a p metallica vid.

He gets very in-depth with care, breeding, housing, heating, and preventative measures, as well as hacks/ work arounds for setups, (one of his vids is the reason why all my Ts are always spending lots of time outside their burrows/corkbarks, even my fossorials).

Definitely a great info source.

I'd imagine that wild communals, if they happen, would be webbed tunnel networks underground or in trees. But we may just be expanding the mother/babies communal relationship into adulthood by having them in an enclosure for all I know.

if it works with one species, but not the others…

i think its something. A predisposition for survival adaptation. And survival can also be thriving.

 

[Arachnopotamus Rex]

if it works with one species, but not the others…

i think its something. A predisposition for survival adaptation. And survival can also be thriving.

I think its either a defense adaption or parental tendancies resulting in siblings being used to cohabitation because mom feeds them.
I'm leaning on the latter, most Ts do not feed their young like balfouris do, and i've noticed communals are more successful when they are siblings.

 

[Arachnopotamus Rex]

Update:

She ate the sac...

I'm not sure if its do to possibly bad instructions, or the eggs being duds, or the socotra island average humidity reports being wrong, or her not being great at parenting, or having to quietly maintain my other spiders once a week being too much disturbance (I only have the 1 extra bedroom to put the arthropods in, as my own bedroom needs to be cold or I can't sleep), or just because it "just happens sometimes", but either way it sucks.

The lack of certainty is bothering me almost as much as the loss, and I guess I'll never actually know until I eventually get a successful hatching and see what works for me, which also sucks but there isnt much I can do about that.

I knew this was a risk whenever breeding tarantulas, but being prepared for the worst doesn't really take away the stress from when it happens...