Mold in black widow enclosure? What to do? Can springtails/isopods be added?

[alex666]

Hi guys.

We have our black widow in a regular 5 gallon tank with a screen lid. Recently a piece of wood in there developed mold so we had to take her out and put her in a temporary little enclosure

Moving the black widow is not my favorite thing to do lol. Is there anything that can be done to reduce the chances of this happening again?

The tank has a small layer of eco earth at the bottom, a large piece of spiderwood, and some rocks. I figure we might replace the soil with black aquarium gravel or something but aesthically the dirt looks nice. She gets her tank misted but its not really wet in there ever

Would adding something like isopods or springtails be good? I dont figure they would ever interact but I havent kept isopods or springtails before so I would need to do some more research, if they require very different temps/humidities

 

[The Snark]

live up to your pseudonym, oh Boojum...

A therididae gets placed in a completely empty containment of virtually any size larger that a matchbox. It looks around. "Hmm. Not bad. I can live here."
A human asks, "Do you need anything else?"
The spider replies, "Nope. You could toss in a stick for an anchor point or two, but this is fine."
Human asks, "How about a small layer of eco earth at the bottom, a large piece of spiderwood, and some rocks?
Spider, taken aback, asks, "Why? Are you planning on moving in with me?"

 

[alex666]

live up to your pseudonym, oh Boojum...

A therididae gets placed in a completely empty containment of virtually any size larger that a matchbox. It looks around. "Hmm. Not bad. I can live here."
A human asks, "Do you need anything else?"
The spider replies, "Nope. You could toss in a stick for an anchor point or two, but this is fine."
Human asks, "How about a small layer of eco earth at the bottom, a large piece of spiderwood, and some rocks?
Spider, taken aback, asks, "Why? Are you planning on moving in with me?"

Appreciate your advice very helpful thank you.. I know we could keep her in something small and empty but like you said, the spider doesn't care. I know of course the spider doesn't need these things the rocks are just there to make the tank pretty to look at and its not like she ever interacts with them so whether they are there or not doesn't matter.

I had read that some substrate can help with humidity levels but whether its completely necessary or not I dont know if it matters. Lots of black widow set ups i saw had substrate but not certain if it was just to anchor a stick in

 

[Poffypoffa]

How do you even see her in a 5 gallon enclosure? I've never seen a widow in something that big.

That aside, you're using a very humid substrate and I'm guessing misting it quite a bit, far more than needed. That's why mold developed. But I would have suggested just pulling out the spiderwood, washing off the mold and baking it, and putting it back. I would not have bothered rehoming her. But they're just not that defensive--it should be fine to move her again. I grew up with black widows in my pool and not one person ever got bit in a decade.

Spiders like this are meant to be kept in moderate, sparse enclosures, pretty dry, maybe misting the web every so often. That's it. Anything more and you're creating complications that can hurt the spider. You are making housing choices for your benefit, rather than hers--and that's why people get prickly.

If you have mold, it's because it's too wet, and she doesn't need that kind of moisture. Don't start adding other insects to counteract the moisture-related mold from moisture she didn't need in the first place. Just keep it dry and the mold will not come back. Generally speaking mold requires heat, darkness and moisture to grow. Remove any of those things and it doesn't.

 

[alex666]

How do you even see her in a 5 gallon enclosure? I've never seen a widow in something that big.

That aside, you're using a very humid substrate and I'm guessing misting it quite a bit, far more than needed. That's why mold developed. But I would have suggested just pulling out the spiderwood, washing off the mold and baking it, and putting it back. I would not have bothered rehoming her. But they're just not that defensive--it should be fine to move her again. I grew up with black widows in my pool and not one person ever got bit in a decade.

Spiders like this are meant to be kept in moderate, sparse enclosures, pretty dry, maybe misting the web every so often. That's it. Anything more and you're creating complications that can hurt the spider. You are making housing choices for your benefit, rather than hers--and that's why people get prickly.

If you have mold, it's because it's too wet, and she doesn't need that kind of moisture. Don't start adding other insects to counteract the moisture-related mold from moisture she didn't need in the first place. Just keep it dry and the mold will not come back. Generally speaking mold requires heat, darkness and moisture to grow. Remove any of those things and it doesn't.

I fully understand not keeping an animal in an improper enclosure just for your own amusement I 100% agree.

I apologize if the question was dumb, I know more about keeping reptiles and with bioactive set ups people will have springtails, I didn't realize this maybe wasn't done with invertebrates.

The widow is my partner's spider so I didnt have much say in setting up the tank. The breeder we got her from said the 5 gallon was not you know, necessary, but there was nothing wrong with that. He said cross ventilation might be an issue but with the mesh lid it should have enough. Her tanks is misted once a week, 1 spray. The breeder told us to spray the substrate. So I know the substrate definitely wasn't wet in retrospect it might just be that area of our house is kind of humid. But if its just going to cause problems we can take it out. Pictures of widow tanks I've seen most of them had substrate at the bottom and from reading about them it didn't seem like a negative

It's otherwise fine she is in the 5 gallon? We had no problems seeing her in the tank, she is always out in the open. The spiderwood has a large base which takes up like a 3rd of the tank space anyway. She had all the branches coming off of it webbed up and seemed comfortable in the setup

Again I sincirely apologize if my post came across as me being really stupid, I wouldn't want to do anything that would be detrimental to the spider, and to my current understanding the way her tank was set up was fine for her. If it's not I would much rather know and be able to fix it

 

[fcat]

Was the wood boiled to be sanitized? It can be more prone to molding, especially if you don't let it dry out all the way (and it can hold moisture for a while).

 

[Poffypoffa]

I fully understand not keeping an animal in an improper enclosure just for your own amusement I 100% agree.

I apologize if the question was dumb, I know more about keeping reptiles and with bioactive set ups people will have springtails, I didn't realize this maybe wasn't done with invertebrates.

The widow is my partner's spider so I didnt have much say in setting up the tank. The breeder we got her from said the 5 gallon was not you know, necessary, but there was nothing wrong with that. He said cross ventilation might be an issue but with the mesh lid it should have enough. Her tanks is misted once a week, 1 spray. The breeder told us to spray the substrate. So I know the substrate definitely wasn't wet in retrospect it might just be that area of our house is kind of humid. But if its just going to cause problems we can take it out. Pictures of widow tanks I've seen most of them had substrate at the bottom and from reading about them it didn't seem like a negative

It's otherwise fine she is in the 5 gallon? We had no problems seeing her in the tank, she is always out in the open. The spiderwood has a large base which takes up like a 3rd of the tank space anyway. She had all the branches coming off of it webbed up and seemed comfortable in the setup

Again I sincirely apologize if my post came across as me being really stupid, I wouldn't want to do anything that would be detrimental to the spider, and to my current understanding the way her tank was set up was fine for her. If it's not I would much rather know and be able to fix it

You don't have to apologize--ultimately simple is better. I find that coco fiber, even bone dry, holds humidity. I recently added some to my roach bin on the suggestion of my roach dealer and the humidity went from 55% to 90+% within an hour with no other change (and it was bone dry out of the bag coco fiber). Unless that's what you're going for, I would get rid of it--and you don't need it with a widow. But if you want some substrate for appearance use a mix of topsoil and sand (or even coco and sand, which dries it out substantially). But it's not needed.

It's highly unlikely that a piece of spiderwood would get moldy from the air inside your home unless you live in the tropics and don't use AC, or the wood was wet. It had to be some residual moisture/humidity in the enclosure, and my guess is that either the wood was wet for some reason, or the coco was holding ambient humidity at an elevated level (although I would have expected some mold on the coco in that circumstance). Cook the wood, get rid of the coco, should fix it.

And yes, people keeping bioactives do use springtails and sometimes isopods as a clean up crew--which is needed to clean the mold that develops from the high humidity those reptile and amphibian species need, as well as (and even more so) the copious poop. With spiders, there's little reason to go bioactive other than for the pleasure of having a beautiful planted tank, which is legitimate--but it greatly complicates spider care, and you have to be prepared for that. I am currently setting up a bioactive enclosure for an arboreal tarantula, but it's more of a temperate setup with humidity in the 65-70% range, and I'm only doing it for fun. The spider certainly is doing just fine in its current enclosure with plastic monstera vines. I'm also setting it up and getting it balanced and active long before introducing the spider.

 

[jbooth]

Yeah too moist if molding. I'm sure they won't hate some humidity but definitely not a requirement. I have seen webs in the wild that will fill a 5 gallon, or more, but I wouldn't say it's common. Last one I saw in here was living in a plastic cup under my spider shelf at 12% humidity and plump as a melon and I'm glad to say it has never rained once in here, or misted.

 

[jbooth]

Ugh, delete me please,duplicate post

 

[alex666]

You don't have to apologize--ultimately simple is better. I find that coco fiber, even bone dry, holds humidity. I recently added some to my roach bin on the suggestion of my roach dealer and the humidity went from 55% to 90+% within an hour with no other change (and it was bone dry out of the bag coco fiber). Unless that's what you're going for, I would get rid of it--and you don't need it with a widow. But if you want some substrate for appearance use a mix of topsoil and sand (or even coco and sand, which dries it out substantially). But it's not needed.

It's highly unlikely that a piece of spiderwood would get moldy from the air inside your home unless you live in the tropics and don't use AC, or the wood was wet. It had to be some residual moisture/humidity in the enclosure, and my guess is that either the wood was wet for some reason, or the coco was holding ambient humidity at an elevated level (although I would have expected some mold on the coco in that circumstance). Cook the wood, get rid of the coco, should fix it.

And yes, people keeping bioactives do use springtails and sometimes isopods as a clean up crew--which is needed to clean the mold that develops from the high humidity those reptile and amphibian species need, as well as (and even more so) the copious poop. With spiders, there's little reason to go bioactive other than for the pleasure of having a beautiful planted tank, which is legitimate--but it greatly complicates spider care, and you have to be prepared for that. I am currently setting up a bioactive enclosure for an arboreal tarantula, but it's more of a temperate setup with humidity in the 65-70% range, and I'm only doing it for fun. The spider certainly is doing just fine in its current enclosure with plastic monstera vines. I'm also setting it up and getting it balanced and active long before introducing the spider.

Good to know thank you so much. We live in CA so its pretty dry most of the time. The soil mix you suggested sounds good I'll cook the wood and ditch the old substrate.

Yeah bioactives seem really cool I have watched a ton of videos but haven't ever tried to set one up. I saw someone had isopods in with a jumping spider and jumpers and widows are both native here so I didnt know if they could live in the same conditions. But definitely sounds way more complicated than I would want to be dealing with. Good luck with getting yours set up! They are super beautiful

Thank you again for the advice!

 

[The Snark]

If you want a stable heat and moisture regulator, just add a nice large porous rock. Or even a chunk of well washed concrete. Dripping water on the rock every other day will establish a stable humidity. Want high humidity, soak it in water for 24 hours once every few days. Want more stable heat and higher humidity, place the rock on the area above or beside a heat mat.
Porous rock = thermal and moisture battery.

 

[Dry Desert]

Good to know thank you so much. We live in CA so its pretty dry most of the time. The soil mix you suggested sounds good I'll cook the wood and ditch the old substrate.

Yeah bioactives seem really cool I have watched a ton of videos but haven't ever tried to set one up. I saw someone had isopods in with a jumping spider and jumpers and widows are both native here so I didnt know if they could live in the same conditions. But definitely sounds way more complicated than I would want to be dealing with. Good luck with getting yours set up! They are super beautiful

Thank you again for the advice!

Lack of adequate ventilation plus too moist = Mold.

Substrate = Organic Topsoil,
(No chemicals)
Don't sterilize anything, sterile soil etc. are a virgin environment for all manner of organism to colinise.