Long-Term Waxworm Breeding and Mold Prevention

[richard22]

I have been breeding wax worms for a few months now, after it took two generations for the wax moths to be all fertile probably because they were almost all redered infertile. Now I use a large pretzel jug for my hundred or so moths and many larva in my hot attic for fast breeding. I never considered using netting as ventilation or mold inhibiting chemicals, so now I have a mold outbreak on the frass layer. I have heard mold inhibitor might do the trick, so if I were to add potassium sorbate to the bedding mix, how much should I use or can I use too much? Are mold inhibitor chemicals toxic to these insects, or insects in general, because I could see myself using mold inhibiting chemicals in my ecoearth substrates in my vivariums so mold doesn’t grow over cricket eggs, because it is growing at the bottom of my cricket culture and might reach the eggs.

As you can see, mold, olive gray and even yellow, has followed through the frass layers. Also, peculiarly, many of the moths have caramel wings and a red thorax behind their head. I have been unable to find any info on wax moths that look like this. Could this be some sort of natural selection of evironmental adaptation in play?

Large scale waxworm breeding seems to be a bit uncommon, and complicated. I am on track to a huge number and eventually I’ll have to keep it from spiraling. I am struggling thinking of how you would end up replacing bedding after it has been consumed when there are hundreds of moths on top of it and hundreds of larva all in it too. Would I need some sort of hole in the side to grab material out of the bin, or should I empty all the moths into a big fish tank and filter out the frass from the worms and pupa cocoons somehow. I’ll have to do the latter to get rid of the moldy frass though, ASAP. I need some long-term waxworm farming tips if anyone knows from experience.

This is a repost from the same poster from http://www.openbugfarm.com/forum.ht...ong-term-waxworm-breeding-and-mold-prevention

 

[Mirandarachnid]

I am struggling thinking of how you would end up replacing bedding after it has been consumed when there are hundreds of moths on top of it and hundreds of larva all in it too.

I waited for all the moths to die, then I separated as much larva from the medium as I possibly could. I'd place new medium into the jar then add the old medium on top with the knowledge that there were still larva and eggs in it I hadn't found, I'd also put a handful of large larva back in, then put the rest in the feeder fridge to keep them from pupating. If you can't really wait for the moths to die off, you could try cooling them then shaking the moths out into an enclosure they can't get out of while you sort out the larva. Don't get them too cold or they will die. You want to keep them over 50f. I modified a mini fridge to stay over 50 for my waxies, although I sort of fell off of that project. I'll probably start up again sometime soon as it's a great "fix and forget" way to breed feeders.

I don't know what to tell you about the mold. I never had an issue because I live in a dry climate and had fabric on the top of my big plastic jar.

You probably already know this, but DO NOT let moths escape. They are highly invasive and parasitise bee hives. If you decide to throw away the old medium for whatever reason, freeze it for a week before you throw it out.

 

[richard22]

I believe the mold should be prevented by good ventilation and mold inhibitor in the bedding. Other preservatives could probably also be used. I don’t know if the life cycles are in sync, so I might always have moths at any time, so cooling them seems to be a smart idea to get the larva. I’m going to see what I can do with what’s left, I’ll trash the dead moths (store maybe, I might be able to use them?) and larva of course.

The old medium I guess will need to be scrapped if it’s covered in mold unless I can salvage it with heavy mold killer, but in the future I’ll have to move the frass layers to another very well ventilated bin with some normal substrate to hatch the eggs from elsewhere.

Oh, lastly, do you know of a vendor of lesser waxworms, Achroia Grisella, Wormman.com doesn’t have them in stock, so I don’t know.

 

[The Mantis Menagerie]

Oh, lastly, do you know of a vendor of lesser waxworms, Achroia Grisella, Wormman.com doesn’t have them in stock, so I don’t know.

I think this species is USDA-regulated. G. mellonella has been deregulated for pet food.

 

[richard22]

The mold is occuring again in the frass only. I can’t really open the container and mess with the bedding and remove stuff, many moths would get out and larva would be near the moldy frass. This is going to require a much more elaborate setup, with a glove insert and hatch to move bedding and take frass out. If anyone knows how I could design something like this that would be nice, otherwise I’ll figure it out at some point. Biggest question is the enclosure, a clear ucket might work and I could try to design some inserts. Maybe even a glass terrarium, but that would be much harder to design inserts into. Maybe the moths need to automatically disperse into another area where they can lay the eggs so I won’t have to deal with them when harvesting the larva.

 

[richard22]

I waited for all the moths to die, then I separated as much larva from the medium as I possibly could. I'd place new medium into the jar then add the old medium on top with the knowledge that there were still larva and eggs in it I hadn't found, I'd also put a handful of large larva back in, then put the rest in the feeder fridge to keep them from pupating. If you can't really wait for the moths to die off, you could try cooling them then shaking the moths out into an enclosure they can't get out of while you sort out the larva. Don't get them too cold or they will die. You want to keep them over 50f. I modified a mini fridge to stay over 50 for my waxies, although I sort of fell off of that project. I'll probably start up again sometime soon as it's a great "fix and forget" way to breed feeders.

I don't know what to tell you about the mold. I never had an issue because I live in a dry climate and had fabric on the top of my big plastic jar.

You probably already know this, but DO NOT let moths escape. They are highly invasive and parasitise bee hives. If you decide to throw away the old medium for whatever reason, freeze it for a week before you throw it out.

Another attempt in a larger container with good ventilation, at first it was good with hundreds of moths and larva but the baby worms seemed to disappear and months later only a dozen or so moths and maybe 2 dozen worms remain after I sieved it all (carefully). I failed to realize how easily the babies could escape and the specific bin had holes in the hinges and sides. I was a lazy ass so I did nothing about it for months and just avoided the problem. I also think the high heat high ventilation medium humidity probably contributed to the substrate’s desiccation and colony collapse, all I know is not all of the bran was eaten and the entire bin was bone dry afterwards. I of course left it unattended for ~3 months with no added honey or potassium sorbate so that part is on me.

I now am in a situation where I need inspiration because I don’t know how this can work anymore. Good ventilation + high heat = dessication of substrate and colony collapse. Poor ventilation + high heat = mold outbreak and likely colony collapse. Even if I attend to the colony’s maintenance more often like I should I will be adding copious amounts of honey, making it seem unsustainable. I can’t seem to find any info on large-scale farming procedures for waxworms, presumably since the demand for such info would be low and the info may put a business in risk of competition, timberline fresh is an example. Additionally I doubt many people have ANY info on large scale waxworm breeding, so I am now considering abandoning the project altogether unless I come to some revelation or receive useful information.
I read somewhere corn syrup can be used with honey, and if so that would allow me to easily keep pouring more liquid into the substrate and additionally I could add potassium sorbate to the frass to keep it from molding if I could conveniently do such a thing, I still don’t know of a good way to extract the frass without letting moths free while also not messing the entire culture up and how to effectively seperate the worms from the frass since I can’t just trash it with the worms in it. I guess I could use cheese cloth for ventilation, providing it can’t be eaten.

 

[Introvertebrate]

A fellow on YouTube uses about 80% high fructose corn syrup and 20% honey. I'd be tempted to try 100% cheap generic pancake syrup. I don't have an answer for your frass problem. The fruit fly folks periodically seed a new culture with adult flies (moths in your case) and just discard the old medium and whatever remaining larvae might be in it.