Hadrurus arizonensis molt

[NocturnalSkies]

Haven’t posted here in a while, so figured I’d start with something that happened July 1st of last year. My ancient, geriatric H. Arizonensis, that I had had for about 6 years(7 now), molted! It had been refusing food and behaving very oddly for about a full year and a half, and the whole time I was thinking it was dying or had gone senile. Turns out it was probably in pre molt. I have multiple Hadrurus species, have had them all for years but this is my only molt. I actually don’t keep them with very deep substrate, I give them about the same level Id give any other scorp and then a little hide like a piece of cork bark or a plastic cup cut in half. I actually wonder if the half cup simulates some sort of molt chamber that they may make. In any case a very interesting occurrence that proves they can molt in captivity, we just have to figure out how to make it occur more often.

 

[CRX]

They almost never molt in captivity so this is crazy to hear.

 

[Diao]

That is a very long time for a Hadrurus to go between its penultimate molt and maturity. I don't have much experience with Hadrurus, having only had a few wild caught adults in the past. I always avoided keeping juveniles as they were notoriously difficult to successfully raise to maturity. It wasn't until in the last decade or so that the hobby had come up with a method to set up environmental conditions that replicated what is needed for consistently successful Hadrurus ecdysis.

Having said all of that, what are the conditions in which you keep your Hadrurus (temp, humidity, night/day fluctuations, etc)? It could very well be that your scorpion has been delaying molting if it's environment wasn't conducive to molting; holding out until better conditions presented themselves. Also, lower temperatures provide for much slower growing scorpions, by keeping their metabolism low and slow. Hadrurus natural environment provide for some very extreme conditions that can be difficult to recreate in captivity. The majority of the year the temperature highs are over 100 degrees F, with months at a time having 120+ degree highs.

In good news, it appears that the molt was successful! How is this individual fairing today?

 

[CRX]

That is a very long time for a Hadrurus to go between its penultimate molt and maturity. I don't have much experience with Hadrurus, having only had a few wild caught adults in the past. I always avoided keeping juveniles as they were notoriously difficult to successfully raise to maturity. It wasn't until in the last decade or so that the hobby had come up with a method to set up environmental conditions that replicated what is needed for consistently successful Hadrurus ecdysis.

Having said all of that, what are the conditions in which you keep your Hadrurus (temp, humidity, night/day fluctuations, etc)? It could very well be that your scorpion has been delaying molting if it's environment wasn't conducive to molting; holding out until better conditions presented themselves. Also, lower temperatures provide for much slower growing scorpions, by keeping their metabolism low and slow. Hadrurus natural environment provide for some very extreme conditions that can be difficult to recreate in captivity. The majority of the year the temperature highs are over 100 degrees F, with months at a time having 120+ degree highs.

In good news, it appears that the molt was successful! How is this individual fairing today?

What is difficult to replicate is the underground root systems they are widely believed to inhabit. i.e. cactus root systems. They have access to a wide variety of humidity in that system, and so far that has been hard to replicate. Some people are apparently having success tho, one poster on here was talking about a kind of porous wood you could use to replicate a root system.

 

[MorbidArachnid]

7 years between what was likely subadult to adult molt is absolutely insane. did she burrow at all? or was it just a hide? whats your substrate and temps look like? I was the one that was talking about using excelsior to mimic a root system but it isnt fine enough to hold the substrate i was using, though it might be more successful on a clay based substrate that already holds its shape pretty well. Really interested in hearing more details, congratulations!

 

[gzophia]

Haven’t posted here in a while, so figured I’d start with something that happened July 1st of last year. My ancient, geriatric H. Arizonensis, that I had had for about 6 years(7 now), molted! It had been refusing food and behaving very oddly for about a full year and a half, and the whole time I was thinking it was dying or had gone senile. Turns out it was probably in pre molt. I have multiple Hadrurus species, have had them all for years but this is my only molt. I actually don’t keep them with very deep substrate, I give them about the same level Id give any other scorp and then a little hide like a piece of cork bark or a plastic cup cut in half. I actually wonder if the half cup simulates some sort of molt chamber that they may make. In any case a very interesting occurrence that proves they can molt in captivity, we just have to figure out how to make it occur more often.

How interesting! This case has several aspects that fascinate me greatly: a very old scorpion, a long fasting time, a very long duration between molts, and finally, the fact that a Hadrurus had a successful molt in captivity!
This is one of the most interesting cases I've seen in the scorpion hobby; thank you for sharing it. All the best to your H. arizonensis; I hope it has a nice long life ahead as an adult!

 

[NocturnalSkies]

Sorry for the late reply! I lost my phone and just got a new one! To reply to everyone, the hadrurus is doing great! She’s still alive and well I just fed her recently actually. She never burrowed, she just stays inside her hide and comes out to explore or get food and water. Humidity is practically none, I keep her completely dry with the only moisture being a water bowl that I keep filled. Temps are my room temp, which fluctuate between like 65 to 80 degrees, most of my inverts seem comfortable at this range and some of them that need cooler I just keep by any part that has a draft.

about the root/burrowing systems, I’ve had pretty bad luck with Excavator clay and don’t use it anymore. For trapdoors or camel spiders, I just make a soil and sand mix, wet it and then they borrow and it holds its shape when dry and is pliable enough for them to make new tunnels too. I think the differing factors with my Arizonensis compared to how I see most other people keep them is, mine doesn’t burrow at all, it lived inside a spacious yet snug hide(it’s a solo cup cup in half), and always has water available. I think it may have accepted the hide as a sort of replacement molting chamber, and the constant access to water allows her to drink and adjust internal hydration to what she needed for molting. Just a guess, who really knows

 

[MorbidArachnid]

Sorry for the late reply! I lost my phone and just got a new one! To reply to everyone, the hadrurus is doing great! She’s still alive and well I just fed her recently actually. She never burrowed, she just stays inside her hide and comes out to explore or get food and water. Humidity is practically none, I keep her completely dry with the only moisture being a water bowl that I keep filled. Temps are my room temp, which fluctuate between like 65 to 80 degrees, most of my inverts seem comfortable at this range and some of them that need cooler I just keep by any part that has a draft.

about the root/burrowing systems, I’ve had pretty bad luck with Excavator clay and don’t use it anymore. For trapdoors or camel spiders, I just make a soil and sand mix, wet it and then they borrow and it holds its shape when dry and is pliable enough for them to make new tunnels too. I think the differing factors with my Arizonensis compared to how I see most other people keep them is, mine doesn’t burrow at all, it lived inside a spacious yet snug hide(it’s a solo cup cup in half), and always has water available. I think it may have accepted the hide as a sort of replacement molting chamber, and the constant access to water allows her to drink and adjust internal hydration to what she needed for molting. Just a guess, who really knows

Fascinating! This suggests we're going about their care completely wrong. I had suspected it was internal hydration that mattered moreso than ambient humidity, theoretically deeper burrows have more humidity in the wild because in the wild they'd be within roots and closer to groundwater, but we don't replicate these conditions well enough in captivity. The closest people get is using a false bottom and soaking the substrate from below to simulate the moister environment deeper underground, but people also tend to not do this too much because the risk of mycosis is so great. That's why generally, I think the way most people set up their enclosures now, there isn't a significant difference in humidity between burrows and simpler hides. I also generally don't like clay, I think moisture causes it to stick onto the tarsi of scorpions and cake on and that puts them at much higher risk for mycosis, and I think because most people use clay to simulate burrowing behavior they also then provide way less water than someone who is using sand and soil would. I've long been an advocate of spraying or providing a water dish more often than most people do with arid scorpions, even in the desert there is moisture and many desert scorpions seek out humid microclimates. Obviously these are more just thoughts I've had than anything with concrete evidence behind it, but if internal hydration is more important for molting than external humidity then providing constant access to water is more crucial than providing burrowing space.

 

[NocturnalSkies]

Yeah it’s worth looking into! I could be wrong but it’s a hunch. I actually 2nd the tarsi thing because I stopped playing around with excavator when I had 2 camel spiders get their tarsi stuck in the drying clay and die. I also dislike that it becomes a rock and doesn’t allow the invert to create new burrows and pathways, or makes them get stuck if they don’t make a viable burrow quick enough. I water arid small scorps and some T slings with a little piece of paper that I wet and replace every week so that bacteria doesn’t grow or mold. A lot of people dislike the paper thing but I’ve never had a scorp get mycosis(only 2 centipedes due to inadequate ventilation) unless they came with it already. I think some of these scorpions get water in dry locales from sucking plant roots and the paper simulates that. Hadrurus and large ones get a small water dish.
Ive also had a camel spider molt once, and it also molted above ground. Unfortunately it died a few months after molt though.

 

[darkness975]

My oldest Hadrurus is close to 20.

 

[Dry Desert]

Yeah it’s worth looking into! I could be wrong but it’s a hunch. I actually 2nd the tarsi thing because I stopped playing around with excavator when I had 2 camel spiders get their tarsi stuck in the drying clay and die. I also dislike that it becomes a rock and doesn’t allow the invert to create new burrows and pathways, or makes them get stuck if they don’t make a viable burrow quick enough. I water arid small scorps and some T slings with a little piece of paper that I wet and replace every week so that bacteria doesn’t grow or mold. A lot of people dislike the paper thing but I’ve never had a scorp get mycosis(only 2 centipedes due to inadequate ventilation) unless they came with it already. I think some of these scorpions get water in dry locales from sucking plant roots and the paper simulates that. Hadrurus and large ones get a small water dish.
Ive also had a camel spider molt once, and it also molted above ground. Unfortunately it died a few months after molt though.

I've also seen arid scorpions obtaining moisture from sucking dampened sand, on more than one occasion.