DIY background with foam & Silicone.

[UniversalPhoenix]

Hi everyone!

My husband and I did some research for a DIY backgrounds with expanding foam & Silicone, bought 3 new terrariums for our M Balfouri, E Campestratus and our A Seemani and we did the backgrounds ourself with expanding foam and silicone and decorate it with wood, etc. We reseached which products were the best and such, but we cannot find when we can put our ladies in their new homes. There is still a smell, so of course (also out of fear because we lost our first G Pulchra to DKS) we haven't put them in their new homes because we are scared it is not dry yet. We made the enclosers on 16 January so I still think it is too early to put them in it.

Can someone help me with when it is the best we can put them safely in their new homes?

Thanks a lot!!

 

[SpookySpooder]

Provide information on what you used. SDS are available for most chemical products. Some products can take weeks before they are safe to use for this purpose.

Generally, if it stills smells like chemicals then it is still curing and you do not want to use that for your pets.

 

[The Snark]

Just an FYI. Industries have been moving away from isocyanates, expanding foam, due to toxic off gassing for extended periods of time after the application. Toxins are trapped in the foam and can be released in the foam is damaged or disturbed.

 

[UniversalPhoenix]

Provide information on what you used. SDS are available for most chemical products. Some products can take weeks before they are safe to use for this purpose.

Generally, if it stills smells like chemicals then it is still curing and you do not want to use that for your pets.

Thank you for your reply! We will make sure then to wait a few weeks before rehousing them! Better be safe than sorry!

Just an FYI. Industries have been moving away from isocyanates, expanding foam, due to toxic off gassing for extended periods of time after the application. Toxins are trapped in the foam and can be released in the foam is damaged or disturbed.

I see, I know that the expanding foam I used is safe for animals, and it was okay to leave it. But it is important that we need to let it dry completely and the same goes for airing out the silicone air we smell at the moment.

 

[SpookySpooder]

I would still post product information so someone can better advise you. Every chemical is different!

 

[The Snark]

I see, I know that the expanding foam I used is safe for animals, and it was okay to leave it. But it is important that we need to let it dry completely and the same goes for airing out the silicone air we smell at the moment.

Just keep in mind if the foam needs to be cut or otherwise shaped, or gets damaged or dented, the toxic gasses can be released months or even years down the road. Well ventilated areas and additional off gassing time outs are in order in such events.

 

[UniversalPhoenix]

Of course!

I would still post product information so someone can better advise you. Every chemical is different!

Of course! The products I used and which you can buy here in the Netherlands are;

Superfish Scaping foam
Super fish aqua Silicone black

Normally they use these for ponds, aquariums etc. But I read that these were also perfect for doing backgrounds for Terrariums/vivariums

Just keep in mind if the foam needs to be cut or otherwise shaped, or gets damaged or dented, the toxic gasses can be released months or even years down the road. Well ventilated areas and additional off gassing time outs are in order in such events.

I havent cut it or anything. We first placed a layer of silicone, then added the foam and we decorated the terrariums, sprinkled dirt, cocofiber and coco bark and later detailed it more on places with silicone and more cocofiber so we could create the perfect look.

 

[The Snark]

havent cut it or anything.

Should be safe as long as you or the inmates don't damage the fully cured foam.
I mention this as the medical world has been given notice of various vehicle components being serviced causing long term insidious lung damage.
The foam is chemically designed to trap gasses in inert media so the toxin can remain present for indefinite periods of time.

@HooahArmy Got any recent updates on isocyanates? My data is from 2021-2

 

[viper69]

Let it air out

 

[Mirandarachnid]

After you let it air out long enough that you smell nothing, seal it completely and then smell again in a few days. That will help you determine if it’s really done off gassing. And keep a sharp eye when they’re in the enclosure and check for damage regularly. I’m not sure how you would be able to make sure burrowing spiders haven’t scratched it under the surface of the substrate.

 

[UniversalPhoenix]

After you let it air out long enough that you smell nothing, seal it completely and then smell again in a few days. That will help you determine if it’s really done off gassing. And keep a sharp eye when they’re in the enclosure and check for damage regularly. I’m not sure how you would be able to make sure burrowing spiders haven’t scratched it under the surface of the substrate.

Thank you for your response! Sealing it off and smelling the enclosure again is a great tip, thanks for that, absolutely gonna do that!

 

[DonaldJ]

Are you talking about the foam that comes in cans (Great Stuff) with different colors for different applications? Years ago I was playing with the different types and if you apply it too thickly it takes a very long time to cure; a lot like a piece of candy with a gooey caramel center. Fun tip: you can clean the nylon nozzle with acetone and use it again, and also use acetone to retard the cure time and leave a more dense foam. Or you used to, maybe not anymore--product compositions change.

A superior product, in my opinion, is from these guys: https://uscomposites.com/. It's a 2-part expanding urethane foam, available in different densities (one as hard as a rock) but you have to move quickly; pour time is 45 seconds. Great stuff, but that was years ago and maybe today it's crap, I don't know, and toxicity factors are unknown to me. Time to do a little homework, but good luck and have fun.

 

[fcat]

Out of curiosity, did you ever figure out how your G pulchra was exposed to toxins? Was there a setup such as this?

Some glass enclosures (I forget which brand) include foam backgrounds in their terrariums. I throw them out immediately...not due to toxins...because tarantulas will tear it up. By the way, I remember watching a few builds, and I feel like I saw people sealing the foam with silicone or mortar afterwards. I don't see that step listed.

I'm sure you spent a lot of time on this but you are getting hit in the face with warning signs (the smells) that exposure will be a great risk...I can't think of an animal that I would put in there to test it's safety (because the only species I'd volunteer would need ~6' tall enclosure ). Just want to remind you how smells work...if you can smell them the particles are in your nose, entering your body. Empathize a little too, imagine if your whole house smelled like this, how long would you wait to live in there? And what if it were because some else like the way it looked (Ts can't see anything but light and shadows). Smells aside this is similar to having lead paint or asbestos tile in a child's playroom. Risk is low until you start digging at it, and the risk increases as the materials degrade or are exposed.

Don't let this investment of your time or material be a sunk cost fallacy...it sounds like your Ts will be at risk for as long as they are in that enclosure and have legs, claws and fangs. There are other creative options, (like organic ones and I don't mean bougie free range dirt, I mean keep it chemical free)...wood, dirt, moss, if you insist on making a beautiful home that our beloved Ts poop all over and bulldoze. Is this paranoid or excessive? Perhaps, but I consider everything I bring into my T room puts every specimen at risk. I could kill over 100 tarantulas and now ~51 spiders at once. And sadly I've heard of people losing their entire collection due to chemicals used in construction in another room, when they had new linoleum laid (and were even assured by the contractor that the adhesive was invertebrate safe). I hope you're doing all this outside (for your health too).

 

[SpookySpooder]

I can't think of an animal that I would put in there to test it's safety (because the only species I'd volunteer would need ~6' tall enclosure ).

That is one big lab rat

Can't you just stick the head into the enclosure? Reduce the footprint size to 1' square.

 

[fcat]

That is one big lab rat

Can't you just stick the head into the enclosure? Reduce the footprint size to 1' square.

Oh that wouldn't match my aesthetic

 

[SpookySpooder]

my aesthetic

 

[8 legged]

The material is ok, but tile adhesive and epoxy resin still need to be completed. Pretty much all construction foam is poisonous and you should not be used for your animals without appropriate protection.
The above finish can also be washed off perfectly!
Fish don't nibble on the background, spiders and their food do...