desert spider

[Fender Bender]

Hey guys,

I was wondering if you could help me. A while ago I saw a picture of a desert spider (I think they are from africa) which was almost white in color. Could anyone give me a possible scientific name for these? I know it's a vague description, but I'm sure some of you can help me out! Also, I'd like to know about care requirements for them if possible and if they're hot considering their venom. Much appreciated!

 

[Raikiri]

Hi,

These comes to my mind:
Carparachne sp.
Cerbalus sp.
Leucorchestris sp.

 

[crpy]

you might be thinking about sicariidae, if so very potent venom.

lota good threads on them.

Venom

They are far, FAR beyond the widow / recluse spiders in toxicity, and probably more toxic than the funnelwebs ( Atrax and Hadronyche ) as well. These are absolutely at the top of arachnid toxins, and they can very easily kill a human, none of this "dangerous for children/ elderly" stuff.

As for the specifics, the genus Sicarius is in Sicariidae along with the recluse spiders, their close relatives. They therefore share the same toxic compound: Sphingomyelinase D, an enzyme which acts to dissolve tissues. In otherwords, it is a cytotoxic venom: it acts by "popping" all kinds of cells, bursting them like balloons. However, in the Sicarius venom, this toxin is far more concentrated than in recluse venom, which, coupled with the Sicarius' large size ( 3+ inches ), means this species injects both more venom, and a much more toxic venom than our native L. reclusa. This has a number of wide-ranging effects. First of all, like the recluse spiders, it causes a spreading wound of tissue death: a necrotic sore. Unlike the typical recluse bite, this very easily can become enormous, and cause the loss of a limb (a documented occurrence). Massive local tissue loss is expected to be typical, rather than the exception.

Secondly, the venom of Sicarius, like that of Loxosceles, bears the possibility of leaching out into the bloodstream, where it attacks red blood cells. ( only, again, on a more massive level than L.reclusa ). This first causes a loss of red blood cells to carry oxygen, but no problem, these can be replaced by the spleen and bone marrow. The problem comes in with what happens to the dead blood cells: they become so numerous, as more blood cells are "popped," then replaced, and the replacements "popped," that the bloodstream ends up carrying more skins of blood cells than the kidneys can filter or the liver can absorb. This sheer overload of dead cell membranes in the blood shuts down the kidneys.

However, the death of blood cells is not the only cardiovascular problem to occur. The arteries and veins are also composed of soft cells, and so are vulnerable to the venom, which attacks them also, wearing away the integrity of your blood vessels ( it's an equal-opportunity destroyer, rupturing every cell-based tissue it contacts ). This results in hemorrhages throughout the body, as blood vessels become weakened from the action of the venom, and begin rupturing here and there ( aneurysms ).

Clotting is also messed up, as the venom causes the blood, thickened with its own dead cells, to clot. This produces millions of tiny blood clots everywhere in the circulatory system, which lodge in vessels ( especially the narrow capillaries ), and cause occlusions, which cut off blood supply in random regions of the body, which results in more areas of necrotic tissue developing. This action of the venom can result in strokes, heart attacks, and other occlusion conditons, in addition to the aneurysm epidemic as weakened blood vessels lose integrity.


But wait, there's more. The venom also causes swelling of the liver, and heart damage, and leaves you open to massive infection of your gaping bite-area wound.

So there you have it: your kidneys shut down, the heart and liver are being damaged, heart attacks, strokes and aneurysms are going off all over. You have no blood flow to speak of, and tissue is dying right left and center, even far away from the bite site. You have the equivalent of accellerated leprosy, combined with Ebola. There is no antivenom. Have a nice day.


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Are they new to the hobby or have they been around for a bit?
Yes, extremely new. They have not been in the US hobby until last fall I believe. Even so, they are very scarce, and only a handful are available at a time.

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Can they climb glass?
Probably. Most true spiders can, and with the nearness of relation of Sicariidae to Sparassidae, I would expect the glass climbing ability to be present in Sicarius as well.

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I heard they are communal? If so thats pretty cool.
Hmm, haven't heard anything about this. I really doubt it though.

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Are they as fast as i hear, like P. murinus fast, or faster?
They are EXTREMELY quick, agile, and maneuverable. Just check out the videos on Youtube. Lightning quick, and strong feeding response.

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I am thinking of custom building a secure enclosure for one. It would be thick acrylic with locking lid, etc.
That would be an appropriate caution. You don't want this escaping, or anyone tampering with it. As always, though, count the cost. These things are risky, and the cost for a mistake is your life. This isn't a widow, where an "oops" is pretty much survival guaranteed, unless you're a kid, elderly or ill. These have a VERY high chance of fatality, and even if you survive, you have the (VERY STRONG ) possibility of heart, liver, kidney, muscle, and brain damage. Don't think I am exaggerating, these are at least as toxic as Atrax robustus, and far worse than Phoneutria in overall effect. You won't walk away unscathed. Or, I'll put it this way. I know of two documented bite cases from a Sicarius sp. One was fatal, and the other man lost his arm. That's 50% established fatality, and 100% morbidity so far in documented cases. Not statistics to be fooling with or taking lightly.

So please, consider whether you are ready for this kind of animal. They really ought to be an experts-only species.
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[Fender Bender]

lol, I'm not going to keep a Sicarius, I think I'll never muster the cajones for that

It's the Carparachne ssp! Thanks! Can anyone provide some more insight on these?

 

[crpy]

lol, I guess I should have found that out before posting

 

[melanie5]

The only white desert spider I know, is the Cerbalus sp White Lady. Also known as Sinai Desert Hunstman.