Cold-water 10-gallon aquarium stocking ideas? Goldfish are bad ideas?

[Wayfarin]

Hey, folks! I almost wasn't going to post this thread, but why not? After all, other people might find this useful. This is sort of more of a discussion than a question.
We purchased a 10-gallon aquarium with an LED light for growing plants. We aren't really sure what to do with it yet. I had initially considered turning it into a giant, self-sustaining heteropteran and coleopteran community aquarium, which I might still do. Then I considered adding a crayfish, but I was aware that it might not be able to survive a in natural, "bioactive" aquarium setup.
If only Argyroneta aquatica lived in North America! If it did, then I would probably turn the tank into a spider aquarium. I might still turn it into a planted terrestrial spider tank. I'm especially fond of Dysdera crocata, although it's apparently never available.
If we gave it a heater, along with a filter and air pump, it could easily be turned into a tropical community tank, and I initially thought about turning it into a freshwater or saltwater nano-tank. But we live in New Hampshire, so a power outage would be a death sentence to a tropical tank.
If it is possible to keep tropical fish alive during a power outage, then I would probably turn it into a goby/pistol shrimp tank. Who can resist such a cute combo?

But there are plenty of hardy, cold-tolerant freshwater fish, so choosing the ideal fish for a low-maintenance tank shouldn't be too hard. I personally favor goldfish and dojo loaches, due to their hardiness, and (minor) ammonia-tolerance, as well as their ability to cope with lower oxygen levels than other cold-water fish. And goldfish and dojo loaches would almost certainly survive a power outage, especially if we changed the water during that period. But apparently, keeping goldfish (and dojo loaches) in small aquariums has gone out of fashion.

Is it really cruel to keep goldfish and dojo loaches in small aquariums? Do they really need the swimming space, or do they just care about water quality? I'm aware that goldfish and apparently dojo loaches can "stay small" (4-6") in small aquariums, but is this really a bad thing? Do they need to grow over a foot long to be happy?
Also, would they thrive in a heavily planted aquarium? I'm very fond of plants, but I know that not all species have the same "cover" requirements.

And of course, if goldfish and dojo loaches are out, then what fish are the least demanding in a cold-water aquarium? Are shrimp easier?
White Cloud Mountain minnows and Amano shrimp? Just Amano shrimp, for maximum simplicity?
Japanese trapdoor snails?
Rosy red minnows?
Mosquitofish?
Ghost shrimp? Cherry shrimp?

I had also considered keeping a single sunfish, perhaps with a crayfish, in the tank. Would that work?
I'm not sure what species the sunfish are, but they are not fully-grown. I'd need a fishing license to capture them.

And this doesn't even cover the terrestrial creatures that I could use it for. Arachnids, insects, myriapods, or maybe even an amphibian. The only thing that I've really decided on was that it should have plants, although I'm pretty sure that it should be diverse, so no aggressive, single-species setups.
I'm aware that the opinions will vary, but I'm prepared. People can write their personal favorites below.
Thanks! God bless!

 

[Poonjab]

Shrimp

 

[me and my Ts]

White Cloud Mountain minnows or danios are good

 

[viper69]

Goldfish are horrible invasive species can be size of a football

in a tank- fine

 

[Pmurinushmacla]

If you're prepared to slaughter whatever you put in that tank, do what you want. However, dont go releasing the goldfish into nearby bodies of water when they get too big for your tank.

 

[Wayfarin]

If you're prepared to slaughter whatever you put in that tank, do what you want. However, dont go releasing the goldfish into nearby bodies of water when they get too big for your tank.

I've heard that goldfish sometimes won't outgrow their aquariums because they release hormones and pheromones into the water to intentionally stunt their growth.
And apparently, not all goldfish are alike, and some will grow to giant sizes purely based on their genetics.
I'm not sure if this applies to dojo loaches as well.
But anyways, I'm aware that goldfish and dojo loaches are native to China, so I certainly wouldn't intentionally release any of them, although I might put them in an outdoor pond constructed specifically for them.

 

[Frogdaddy]

Jordinella floridae, Florida flag fish.

 

[me and my Ts]

I've heard that goldfish sometimes won't outgrow their aquariums because they release hormones and pheromones into the water to intentionally stunt their growth.
And apparently, not all goldfish are alike, and some will grow to giant sizes purely based on their genetics.
I'm not sure if this applies to dojo loaches as well.
But anyways, I'm aware that goldfish and dojo loaches are native to China, so I certainly wouldn't intentionally release any of them, although I might put them in an outdoor pond constructed specifically for them.

Still shouldn’t keep them in a 10 gallon, if you don’t have the space or proper setup for them then don’t buy them

 

[Wayfarin]

Still shouldn’t keep them in a 10 gallon, if you don’t have the space or proper setup for them then don’t buy them

I do have a 30-gallon tank which is currently housing our red-eared slider. I wanted to move her to a 55-gallon tank, but I can't decide if she should go in a tank or a plastic tub.
But then again, we have to make the best decisions for our current pets. We have two basset hounds, a guinea pig, a bearded dragon, and a red-eared slider. We are also fostering a wild box turtle, and the birds and squirrels in our yard also depend on us to fill and clean their feeders. So, if we do decide to have fish, being low maintenance and hardy is a must.
The easiest way to keep fish seems to be to understock, that is, give them more space than they seem to need. So, I guess keeping goldfish and dojo loaches in a tank that's smaller than what would be recommended is a terrible idea.

Even still, I find it hard to believe that goldfish really need giant aquariums, since Tish the goldfish, one of the longest-lived goldfish, spent most of his decades in a bowl, a tank which even I don't approve of. I can't help but think that what goldfish really need is loving care, rather than swimming space.

 

[Dry Desert]

I do have a 30-gallon tank which is currently housing our red-eared slider. I wanted to move her to a 55-gallon tank, but I can't decide if she should go in a tank or a plastic tub.
But then again, we have to make the best decisions for our current pets. We have two basset hounds, a guinea pig, a bearded dragon, and a red-eared slider. We are also fostering a wild box turtle, and the birds and squirrels in our yard also depend on us to fill and clean their feeders. So, if we do decide to have fish, being low maintenance and hardy is a must.
The easiest way to keep fish seems to be to understock, that is, give them more space than they seem to need. So, I guess keeping goldfish and dojo loaches in a tank that's smaller than what would be recommended is a terrible idea.

Even still, I find it hard to believe that goldfish really need giant aquariums, since Tish the goldfish, one of the longest-lived goldfish, spent most of his decades in a bowl, a tank which even I don't approve of. I can't help but think that what goldfish really need is loving care, rather than swimming space.

If you do your research correctly, by simply typing in " cold water fish for aquariums " that will give you all recommended fish for your 10 gallon tank.
Simple really.
They will also tell you that Dojo loaches require a 55 gallon tank Minimum.

 

[CRX]

I do have a 30-gallon tank which is currently housing our red-eared slider. I wanted to move her to a 55-gallon tank, but I can't decide if she should go in a tank or a plastic tub.
But then again, we have to make the best decisions for our current pets. We have two basset hounds, a guinea pig, a bearded dragon, and a red-eared slider. We are also fostering a wild box turtle, and the birds and squirrels in our yard also depend on us to fill and clean their feeders. So, if we do decide to have fish, being low maintenance and hardy is a must.
The easiest way to keep fish seems to be to understock, that is, give them more space than they seem to need. So, I guess keeping goldfish and dojo loaches in a tank that's smaller than what would be recommended is a terrible idea.

Even still, I find it hard to believe that goldfish really need giant aquariums, since Tish the goldfish, one of the longest-lived goldfish, spent most of his decades in a bowl, a tank which even I don't approve of. I can't help but think that what goldfish really need is loving care, rather than swimming space.

30 gallon seems too small for a red eared slider. I kept one in a 55 gal for years and I ended up having it to give it away because that was too small.

 

[Wayfarin]

If you do your research correctly, by simply typing in " cold water fish for aquariums " that will give you all recommended fish for your 10 gallon tank.
Simple really.
They will also tell you that Dojo loaches require a 55 gallon tank Minimum.

I've actually been doing a lot of my research from the Aquarium Fish Eyewitness Handbook, which has a small selection of cold-water freshwater fish. For some reason, the dojo loach (Japanese weatherfish) is apparently placed in the "tropical freshwater" section, and the book considers 4" to be the normal size. The book also doesn't give tank size recommendations for any particular species. I'm well aware that dojo loaches grow larger than that, but I hadn't imagined that a 30-gallon tank would not be enough. I also heard that dojo loaches tend to stay at around 6" in average aquarium tank settings. Is there any basis for the idea that they need so much space?
I'm fond of how hardy goldfish and dojo loaches are. I'm not very interested in stream-dwelling species that need oxygen-rich, pristine water, or in "sort-of-cold-water-tropical" species.

Are the species listed below good candidates for a hardy, thriving cold-water aquarium?
. 3 or more least killifish or pygmy livebearers (Heterandria formosa)
. 1 or more bluefin killifish (Lucania goodei)
. 1 or more pygmy sunfish (Elassoma, probably zonatum or evergladei)
. 1 or more swamp darters (Etheostoma fusiforme)
. 1 or more dwarf crayfish (Cambarellus, probably shufeldtii)
With loads of plants, and perhaps some snails and/or ghost shrimp.

 

[ByMennen]

I have a 10 gal, a 29 gal, and a 75 gal.

The 10 has a few neon tetra and two Corydoras. I'd recommend getting rid of the red ear as he'll likely need 100+ gallons to live happily in. Then you'd have a 30 to stock.

My 75 is a pleco tank, and will probably need to be upgraded soon.

 

[Wayfarin]

Are least killifish, bluefin killifish, pygmy sunfish, swamp darters, and dwarf crayfish good for cold-water aquariums?
If so, then how should they be stocked for maximum thriving capacity?

I have a 10 gal, a 29 gal, and a 75 gal.

The 10 has a few neon tetra and two Corydoras. I'd recommend getting rid of the red ear as he'll likely need 100+ gallons to live happily in. Then you'd have a 30 to stock.

My 75 is a pleco tank, and will probably need to be upgraded soon.

Aren't neon tetras and Corydoras sort of tropical?

Also, we can't get rid of our turtle. There are already so many dumped and unwanted red-eared sliders that if someone wants one, they can take in one of those. If she absolutely needs 120 gallons, then we'll dig her a pond. However, I personally think that she'll be fine in a 55-gallon tank, because we allow her to exercise outside of her tank.

 

[ByMennen]

Aren't neon tetras and Corydoras sort of tropical?

Also, we can't get rid of our turtle. There are already so many dumped and unwanted red-eared sliders that if someone wants one, they can take in one of those. If she absolutely needs 120 gallons, then we'll dig her a pond. However, I personally think that she'll be fine in a 55-gallon tank, because we allow her to exercise outside of her tank.

They are considered tropical, but in a 10 gallon it requires *almost* no special attention.

I was planning on building a pond for my turtles as well, it all changed when they started trying to eat the sealant inside the aquarium. Beware the turtle trying to flood your house!
It's more of a turning around thing than exercise, a full grown red eared should easily be as wide as a 55 gal, making movement an issue.

Also, if you buy plants, beware of snails!

Edit: before I forget, I recommend a much higher capacity filter for your turtle if you don't already have it. When researching I read over filtration is good for them because they are messy. I bought a 400 gallon filter for my 75. Worth every penny. But I also had 3 at the time, I'd recommend at least double the dude of your tank, but entirely up to you.

 

[Wayfarin]

They are considered tropical, but in a 10 gallon it requires *almost* no special attention.

I was planning on building a pond for my turtles as well, it all changed when they started trying to eat the sealant inside the aquarium. Beware the turtle trying to flood your house!
It's more of a turning around thing than exercise, a full grown red eared should easily be as wide as a 55 gal, making movement an issue.

Also, if you buy plants, beware of snails!

Edit: before I forget, I recommend a much higher capacity filter for your turtle if you don't already have it. When researching I read over filtration is good for them because they are messy. I bought a 400 gallon filter for my 75. Worth every penny. But I also had 3 at the time, I'd recommend at least double the dude of your tank, but entirely up to you.

No special attention? What does that mean? No heater?
My favorite tropical fish are tiger barbs and kuhli loaches, but unfortunately even they can't be kept in a 10-gallon tank, which I found out after already keeping them in a 10-gallon tank with other tropical fish years ago. I never noticed the barbs being aggressive. Maybe they were just aggressive when I was not around?
I also had no idea that tiger barbs could grow to 3" and kuhli loaches to 4" long, and we also didn't follow the common "schooling fish guidelines" that are often given.

Our adult red-eared slider is a little clumsy in our 30-gallon tank, but I don't think she would not be able to turn around in a 55-gallon tank. I think it depends on the tank's dimensions, rather than the number of gallons.
I wanted to add hornwort and duckweed to our turtle's aquarium. If you search, you'll find that I already posted a thread about red-ears and bladder snails.

I wanted to give our turtle a 100-gallon filter for her 30-gallon tank, but we couldn't get the stupid thing to work, so she's still stuck with a pathetic 20-gallon filter.

 

[ByMennen]

No special attention? What does that mean? No heater?
My favorite tropical fish are tiger barbs and kuhli loaches, but unfortunately even they can't be kept in a 10-gallon tank, which I found out after already keeping them in a 10-gallon tank with other tropical fish years ago. I never noticed the barbs being aggressive. Maybe they were just aggressive when I was not around?
I also had no idea that tiger barbs could grow to 3" and kuhli loaches to 4" long, and we also didn't follow the common "schooling fish guidelines" that are often given.

Our adult red-eared slider is a little clumsy in our 30-gallon tank, but I don't think she would not be able to turn around in a 55-gallon tank. I think it depends on the tank's dimensions, rather than the number of gallons.
I wanted to add hornwort and duckweed to our turtle's aquarium. If you search, you'll find that I already posted a thread about red-ears and bladder snails.

I wanted to give our turtle a 100-gallon filter for her 30-gallon tank, but we couldn't get the stupid thing to work, so she's still stuck with a pathetic 20-gallon filter.

In NH, I'm sure they need a heater. I don't use a heater unless the water drops below 68, but that's me personally, I'm also in California where there's no such thing as winter though. They're just a active in the upper 60's as the mid 70's in my experience.

I had tiger barbs years ago, but you never know what you're gonna get. Friendly, or abusive. One was just over 2" and saw it going after my 18" Pleco so I decided time to separate.

What brand or model of filter do you currently have on your 30? Aqueon makes a decent submersible filter I believe it's the AT40. Though I'd recommend putting some protection (rubber hose, etc) around the power cable in case a turtle finds it.

 

[Wayfarin]

In NH, I'm sure they need a heater. I don't use a heater unless the water drops below 68, but that's me personally, I'm also in California where there's no such thing as winter though. They're just a active in the upper 60's as the mid 70's in my experience.

I had tiger barbs years ago, but you never know what you're gonna get. Friendly, or abusive. One was just over 2" and saw it going after my 18" Pleco so I decided time to separate.

What brand or model of filter do you currently have on your 30? Aqueon makes a decent submersible filter I believe it's the AT40. Though I'd recommend putting some protection (rubber hose, etc) around the power cable in case a turtle finds it.

Do least killifish, pygmy sunfish, bluefin killifish, and swamp darters need heaters? What about dwarf crayfish and ghost shrimp?

Also, I think it's a Penn Plax Cascade hang on, and it's supposed to filter 100 gallons an hour. It might actually not be as great as I thought.

 

[ByMennen]

I think it's a Penn Plax Cascade hang on, and it's supposed to filter 100 gallons an hour. It might actually not be as great as I thought.

I recommend keeping an eye on shops around you. Fluval FX series is amazing, for your 55 anyways.

Sorry I couldn't be more help on fish ideas! I went through the same thing with my 10 gal trying everything, moving them to larger aquariums once they outgrew it. For the past 3 years it's been 5 neon tetra, and 2 Corydoras. Plenty of activity. (2 of the neon tetra are gone now. Recently happened so I'm guessing age)

 

[Wayfarin]

I now have so many questions about pygmy sunfish, swamp darters, least killifish, and bluefin killifish that I think I need to create and account for the NANFA (North American Native Fishes Association) forum.