Cockroach Health Risk

[The_Monk]

I work with young children and in the classroom I had some Madagascan Hissing Roaches for the children to watch. I had them in the room for months, children and parents for they were ace, especially when they hissed! Now the EHO (Environmental Health Officer) got wind and has told me to remove them as the are a health risk. If one is found escaped he'll said, and I quote "i'll shut you down!" He commented that roaches live in the gutter and other horrid places and carry diseases and other health problems. I know there are "pest" roaches out there (usually the german ones) but I never imagined the Hissers were such a big health threat. I've looked on google and not a lot comes up! I live in the UK and just wondered if anyone could point me in some direction to perhaps believe this EHO or prepare my defense for getting them back in the classroom! The kids and parents will be really disappointed! The standard of hygiene is high, everywhere is cleaned with anti-bacterial sprays, hands are washed with anti-bacterial soap and the roaches are in an escape proof tank and a risk assessment done.

Im stuck! Any help?

 

[Mister Internet]

Simply ask for the published proof that Madagascan Hissing Cockroaches are a health risk. Certainly if it's such a dire threat, it would be well documented, and they would be illegal to sell...

 

[cacoseraph]

I work with young children and in the classroom I had some Madagascan Hissing Roaches for the children to watch. I had them in the room for months, children and parents for they were ace, especially when they hissed! Now the EHO (Environmental Health Officer) got wind and has told me to remove them as the are a health risk. If one is found escaped he'll said, and I quote "i'll shut you down!" He commented that roaches live in the gutter and other horrid places and carry diseases and other health problems. I know there are "pest" roaches out there (usually the german ones) but I never imagined the Hissers were such a big health threat. I've looked on google and not a lot comes up! I live in the UK and just wondered if anyone could point me in some direction to perhaps believe this EHO or prepare my defense for getting them back in the classroom! The kids and parents will be really disappointed! The standard of hygiene is high, everywhere is cleaned with anti-bacterial sprays, hands are washed with anti-bacterial soap and the roaches are in an escape proof tank and a risk assessment done.

Im stuck! Any help?

i'd advise you to find out what your laws say

ppl get funny when kids are involved, and sometimes laws exist that probably shouldn't

i reckon EHO can crush business that are "putting children at risk" so i'd tread carefully if i were you

also, it sounds like the EHO officer has some personal issues... that could be a HUGE problem for you

good luck, i love my hissers, i hope you can keep yours

 

[The_Monk]

problem is that food is served on site so a cockroach in the kitchen would be some what a hazard. Ive had them in the classroom for months and months and never an escape or problem! It was his attitude that all raoches are pests!

I've had some top people in the classroom from OFSTED and other top organisations and they liked them. The parents and kids think they are ace so no probs with them! If someone expressed a severe dislike then I would make suitable arrangements. I dont want to for a stuck up EHO tho!

 

[fantasticp]

He commented that roaches live in the gutter and other horrid places and carry diseases and other health problems.

This is the first problem. Hissers DON'T. Madagascar is pretty jungly if I recall, not chock full ofbustling cities. Another point: I would agree that some roaches like Blatta orientalis or Blattella germanica may aid in the spread of disease in some instances, but for yours to do that it would require that YOUR roaches were exposed to it first. A house cat can carry rabies, but only if exposed. You could potentially carry the flu or the black plague or scarlet fever, but only if you have been exposed to it. If your hissers are not kept in dirty conditions, and were CB, I don't see how he has a valid argument....now if he stomps on the legality issue...

 

[james]

Roaches

First, roaches do not carry diseases period. Second, there is no scientific proof that they can carry and pass a disease via their legs. Most states do have published lists of insects you can keep without a permit. For example hear in California some species like hissers are on the list. Otherwise you would need a permit from the State, and I've found the local food & agriculture people to be very freindly. Shipping roaches requires other permits that are far to in depth for this forum. Roaches are very miss-understood and the majority of the species in the world are non-pest species and pose no threat of infestation. I could tell a story of how clueless these people are, but the this forum is not the place.
James
www.blaberus.com

 

[reptillian]

my teacher keeps an axolotl , leopard gecko and whites tree frogs in her class and they can carry more bacteria than roaches i wuld of though

 

[The_Monk]

Im ringing the main enviromental health head office on Monday for some advice! There is no danger to the children, staff, parents and visitors! They are in a glass viv with sliding metal mesh lid which is lockable and the glass is strengthened. It is weighted down to avoid any possible tipping. I cant lift the tank so the children dont stand a chance, nor knocking it over! Full risk assessment done to which has been checked by all top dogs (except the EHO cos he didnt want to read it!). How do pet shops and zoos cope?

 

[Scythemantis]

The EHO is an idiot. Hissing cockroaches do not live in "gutters and horrid places", and even if they did, these particular ones clearly aren't living in such a place. What, does he think they're just BORN with "germs" on them?

 

[Dark Raptor]

I see you've got real problem here. I also work with children and prepare lessons about invertebrates, but I don't need to worry as much as you.
But you should remember that roaches are real "alergic bombs" and some children can react to their secretions.
My ex-girlfriend had to go to hospital after contact with Pycnoscelus surinamensis. She was feeding them while we were working in Warsaw ZOO. Her body was scattered with large blisters (that was ugly view).

And here are the pics of one of my friends who had closer contact with Blaberus:
http://www.echostar.pl/~rados105/fox/zwierzaki/bombel2.jpg
http://www.echostar.pl/~rados105/fox/zwierzaki/bombel1.jpg

 

[Wade]

Allergies are a real concern, although I suspect there's a greater risk if there's been prior exposure. I've developed such an allergy, and must where gloves and a dust mask when working with them!

James is 100% correct about disease, I'd challenge the EHO to produce a paper documenting ANY cockroach carrying disease! People have long assumed cockroaches were disease carriers, but it has never been proven despite tons of research into the subject. Any health problems associated with cockroach infestations are the result of allergies to the feces, and that wouldn't happen with hissers since you couldn't get an indoor infestation anyway.

Wade

 

[Ecilious]

He's an idiot, which means he's a little overqualified to be an EHO. I'd suggest running him over with your car next time he comes to visit or possibly borrowing some equiptment from the school lab and proving that there is no health risk.

I'd do something like, taking swabs from the door handle, 2 desk tops and a window handle from your class room and two others from seprate areas of the school. Grow these on in petri dishes in the school lab and then get someone to identify the bacteria/ get a book and have a go yourself. Then compare between the rooms. This should prove conclusivley that they're safe.

You could then present your results and ask them that they carry out the same tests if there is any doubt.Then run him over with your car.

 

[The_Monk]

I quite like the idea of running him over in my car. No matter wat happened to the roaches, running him over would still make me laugh! As with the allergies so far none of the children have shown any signs and since the parents don't know if they are allergic until the inevitable happens, then I would eaither say, right we just watch them no handling, or i'd take them out of the class. I've had them six months and everything has been great. I will be challenging his decision as he is an idiot. If the worse come to the worse I have a licence application form to register the premises as a zoo! lol! Altho the temptation to run him over is now quite strong!

 

[The_Monk]

Well I thought I'd give you an update. The EHO finally admitted he knew nothing on animals except if they were found in kitchens he'd be mad! So he spoke to an animal welfare officer (yeah I know!), well he told the officer all the other animals I keep and he came out with a list of infectious diseases the animals COULD carry and so he served an order to have me remove them immediately!! OK I argued! He said he didn't care, he knew nothing of animals and the animal welfare officer would be in next week to discuss things! (Oh, he couldn't come today he was in a car crash!? cant be that bad me thinks a weekend recovery?? I've had worse hangovers) Anyways he made me remove a boa, bearded dragon, cockroaches, snails, millipedes, stick insects and a praying mantid!! I'm so not impressed! Anyone want to give me some solid scientific links or direction so I can shove it where the sun don't shine when I see him??

 

[Scythemantis]

Noone has ever contracted a disease from snails, millipedes, cockroaches, or mantids. ESPECIALLY not mantids - wtf!?! Where is this "animal welfare" loser getting his information?

A cat, dog or hamster is hundreds of times more likely to make someone sick and with very dangerous diseases to boot. None of your animals are a hazard, period.

 

[Jesse607]

Actually some aquatic snails are an intermediate host of some parasites that may affect humans.......but I highly doubt you would have to worry about that with captive snails! Sounds like you just have bad luck, and got stuck with inspectors with power trips and with no or poor education. It's too bad this world is full of ignorant people like that, even worse when they have "important" jobs such as that.

 

[xelda]

Snails play an intermediate host for a TON of parasites. But while they are responsible for the spread of some diseases in humans, the transfer is more complicated than simply catching the disease just by handling a snail in a classroom. Paragonimus westermani is a lung fluke that's contracted by eating raw crab, Clonorchis sinensis is a liver fluke contracted by eating raw fish. Schistosoma mansoni, Schistosoma japonica, and Schistosoma haematobium are all blood flukes that spread when a certain stage of the parasites erupts from the snail and then wanders around the water, waiting for a host to penetrate through the skin of. Humans can be the definitive host for all of the parasites I just listed above.

As for diseases spread by roaches, I know the Surinam roach has been documented to spread Oxyspirura mansoni, which is a nematode eye worm that causes blindness in poultry. Roaches can have other parasites and diseases that they spread amongst themselves and to other inverts, but I'm not aware of any that can spread to humans. Then again, I haven't looked too far into it.

The boa and bearded dragon could also carry some parasites that are zoonotic, but if anything, it'll just teach the kids to wash their hands after handling reptiles. It's a good exercise in my opinion. I know my 3rd and 4th grade teachers would be proud to see what doors they opened up for me by keeping exotic pets in the classroom.

You should try to fight back by going to a local university or zoo and having professionals write arguments in your defense. Maybe even get the opinion of a vet or two. That, plus promising that you will bring all the children to the bathroom after each class exercise that involves handling the animals could be a strong case in your favor.

 

[The_Monk]

well today i've been busy preparing my argument! I've spoken to my own local vet and hopefully he is gonna pop something in writing. I've also tried to contact a vet who visits a couple of the big zoo's here in the UK but he has been in surgery so i'll catch up with him later. I'm speaking to the curator of the reptile house at one of the big zoo's tomorrow as well since he has had the day off. I rang a doctor and he said in all 35 years of working he has never come accross someone infected from the animals I keep, the guy has also written a really nice letter too!! Also my local doctor is doing one too! I've tracked down the Animal Welfare Officer who is coming out and i'll be ringing him monday to make sure he has the correct details on my animals and for copies of the evidence he is basing his decisions on. Also I'll be ringing the pest control services, I forgot to do that today! And I've contacted a few breeders for some information and advice.

To make things nasty I got an environmental health expert solicitor!!

:evil: :evil: War has officially begun!:evil: :evil:

 

[Scythemantis]

You're doing wonderfully, then. Definately take it as far as you can. It isn't just for you...it's a blow against that kind of ignorance as a whole, and would make ALL of us happy.

 

[juggalo69]

Keep us posted