Chaerilus under UV light

[Vixvy]

I have observed that most scorpions glow in UV lights but chaerilus sp in particular does not glow in UV light even if they are already adults. these are only some of my observations that i want to share. i hope i can find some one who has the same observation with me.

 

[kahoy]

was your UV weak or your chaerilus is a unique one?
i wanna see pics!!!

 

[skinheaddave]

If there is a species that does not fluoresce at all, then this is something I've been hunting for. There are rumours of cave dwelling specimens that do not fluoresce, but so far all the people I've talked to with direct contact with said species have reported fluorescence. How many specimens do you have and what type of UV light are you using?

Cheers,
Dave

 

[Vixvy]

I am using a UV lamp and also UV penlight. I keep a good numbers of chaerilus at least 40+(scorpling and adult mix) i was wondering why it doesn't fluoresce. that is why I am pretty sure that they have some features that other scorpions have . Unluckily I do not have any digi cam to get some pics. but will try to have it posted soon.

 

[fusion121]

Hi
Really interesting observation, I'll have to check my adult later today. If it’s the case that they do not glow then it could really help in understanding why other scorpions have this trait. Especially since Chaerilus sp. are probably quite a derived genus it means that the fluorescence must have been selectively removed for some reason.

 

[Thiscordia]

Wow Vixvy that's some good informtion... I always though every single scorpion glowed in the dark.
Hope i get one of this guys sometime.

-.Raul

 

[skinheaddave]

Hi
it means that the fluorescence must have been selectively removed for some reason.

I wonder if it was the fluorescence itself which was the selective factor, or if it was lost as a secondary result of some other change. Perhaps the removal of a constraint?

One interesting thing to examine would be fluorescence accros the genus, as well as checking if the original material for C.celebensis fluoresce. According to the catalogue, you have some of the material in your own neck of the woods (BMNH). Perhaps you should raid the collections with a UV light.

Cheers,
Dave

 

[fusion121]

Good point I'm supposed to be getting some pictures of the Chaerilus material for Alex so I will investigate, although I do know that the fluorescence does seem to sometimes dissipate quickly in preserved specimens (the B-carbolines are soluble in ethanol)


There are numerous explanations for why the fluorescence could disappear (Chaerilus sp. Are very pigmented, the fluorescence could still be there but perhaps covered by a novel way in which pigmentation is laid down in the Chaerilus cuticle ). As you say lose due to related change could be a sensible explanation especially since the fluorescence is tied to the biochemistry of the cuticle and any adaptation thereof.

 

[Gigas]

How much of the spectrum does UV light take up? I notice some scorpions fluoress differently under different UV light sources, like the few UV LED's my school has will create a much less green hued arizonensis than that caused by the UV lights that come with those wierd pens my sister buys* I realise that the scorpion may completely lack UV reactive "stuff" but could it not be in a different part of the spectrum?



*May have something to do with power output but it doesn't appear brighter etc, both run off same battery.

 

[skinheaddave]

There is definitely a peak wavelength at which the scorpion will fluoresce. Usually, however, neighbouring frequencies will provide a similar effect. To date it seems that anything in the 390-410 range should give a result. It is possible that they are reacting to a different range of the spectrum, in which case using a fluorescent UV tube should produce a result, since they produce UV in a much broader range than the LEDs.

It is also possible that they are emmitting light at a non-visible frequency, but I am skeptical of this. The nature of fluorescence dictates that the emmited spectrum be of lower energy (longer wavelength) than the exciting light. So a fluorescent compound exposed to UV light should fluoresce at a longer wavelength. There are, therefore, two possible ways in which it could emit light in the non-visible spectrum. The first would be a very small drop in the energy. UV goes in, longer wave UV comes out. This would, however, indicate a very small energy difference between excitation states. I can't remember my physics very well -- but this strikes me as unlikley/impossible. Perhaps someone who has done this more recently can comment?

The other possibility is that they are putting out such a small amount of energy that they are emmitting light in the infrared or beyond. Once again, this seems like it would be without prescedent. It seems far more likely, therefore, that they are either lacking the compounds responsible for fluorescence or they have been somehow masked as suggested by Oliver.

Cheers,
Dave

 

[Vixvy]

hmmm..nice observation guys! BTW i have different instars of chaerilus hope you guys don't get me wrong i would like to show you that all instars of my chaerilus batch doesn't glow in UV light even up close i even used UV lamp in order to get much higher spectrum of that UV but the sad thing is that i do not have cam to get photo of them. what i suspect is that their hairs might have some effect with their being fluoresce. I will also conduct some experiments with my dead specimens I will check if they glow also.

@thiscordia
you will surely get some of them soon.

 

[What]

here is a thread with some pics from ATSHQ:

http://atshq.org/forum/showthread.php?t=5185

 

[G. Carnell]

ive got a last instar excuvium from Chaerilus variegatus (captive bred) borneo,
anyone want it?

 

[quiz]

Scott-land have some pics on http://venomlist.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=14043&view=findpost&p=164570

 

[skinheaddave]

ive got a last instar excuvium from Chaerilus variegatus (captive bred) borneo,
anyone want it?

Does it fluoresce?

Cheers,
Dave

 

[Vixvy]

Guess what i found out that even the exsuvium does not fluoresce at all!

 

[kahoy]

outstanding discovery vixvy!!!
:clap: :clap: :clap:

 

[G. Carnell]

Does it fluoresce?

Cheers,
Dave

guess....

so it seems to be the whole genus

hopefully Alex tietz can tell us if the adults of C.rectimanus flouresce

 

[Vixvy]

My adult C.celebensis does not glow at all.

 

[EAD063]

I wonder if a study comparing those to a highly flourecent species is in order... It may shed some light on what the glow is used for... This would have to be done with a species in the same family though I would assume.... I also question that maybe that trait evolved out of this species because it was unnecessary?