Carnivorous plants and millipedes?

[itstracc]

I've been browsing this form for months now in my free time without ever making an account, but due to some unexpected problems with my millipede tank (re: fungus gnat infestation), I've realized it's high time I make an account and reach out for help. I'm fully aware that fungus gnats can never be completely eradicated, but I keep my millipedes in my bedroom and I'd definitely prefer to not have so many gnats that they fly into my nose at night, thank you very much.

I have three chicobolus spinigerus, an orthoporus ornatus, and a narceus americanus along with a large population of springtails in an 11 gallon vertical Zilla tank. Their substrate is Bugs In Cyberspace's millipede substrate mix, and they have live rotting wood that I collected from the forest by my house (and sterilized before use). They get a heavy misting once a day or every other day depending on how low the humidity is, and I never let humidity drop below 65% (typically it's between 70% and 80%). Recently, I've had some mushrooms begin to sprout in my terrarium, and I love the look of them and would honestly prefer to not get rid of them unless that's the only way to curb the gnat population (counterintuitive, I know).

I saw someone mention once in another fungus gnat problem thread that they had great success with using carnivorous plants to control the gnat population, and the idea of a fully bioactive enclosure with a balanced ecosystem is extremely appealing to me. All of my millipedes are fairly large, with the smallest one being a young chicobolus at about 3 inches long. I assume most smaller carnivorous plants wouldn't be able to eat them, but would they be sticky enough that my pedes might get stuck on them and die? I also don't know if there are any carnivorous plants that will grow without UVB light (I use a ceramic heater during the day to keep the temps between 75°F and 80°F and I have an LED light on during the day for visibility), which I know is a very specific request so I'm not really expecting there to be any plants that would actually fit such specific requirements.

Has anyone tried mixing carnivorous plants with millipedes before? Would it be too dangerous to risk? If there's any possible danger to my millipedes I'm not going to chance it, but if it's completely harmless I wouldn't mind a bit of experimenting.

 

[PanzoN88]

I don't have any millipedes yet, but I probably wouldn't do it, because who knows if the millipedes will set off the traps or not. @basin79

 

[basin79]

Your pedes wouldn't get stuck in/on sundews. Also I doubt they'd be interested walking over them too unlike say a butterwort that's flat-ish.

The problem you might well have is sunlight. I grow mine on sunny windowsills. Perhaps get a sundew for a sunny windowsill and just pop it in their enclosure for an hour or so to trap any troublesome flies. Of course make sure the soil in the pot hasn't been treated with any kind of chemicals.

 

[SeaNettle]

I feel like pitcher plants may be an effective control method given their pretty well equipped to handle a sizeable amount of insects, though they require a good amount of sunlight. The other concern I would have is not knowing if the pitcher would be capable of taking down or at least injuring one of your millipedes.

 

[itstracc]

Thank you guys for your replies!

Your pedes wouldn't get stuck in/on sundews. Also I doubt they'd be interested walking over them too unlike say a butterwort that's flat-ish.

The problem you might well have is sunlight. I grow mine on sunny windowsills. Perhaps get a sundew for a sunny windowsill and just pop it in their enclosure for an hour or so to trap any troublesome flies. Of course make sure the soil in the pot hasn't been treated with any kind of chemicals.

Would adding a small UVB light above the terrarium be enough to grow a sundew? Or would it not be enough/have to be extremely high output to grow the sundew? I don't have experience with plants, so I would definitely need something that I can just stick in my bioactive set up with my pedes and leave alone for the most part besides watering.


If plants aren't exactly viable for me, would another predatory arthopod like harvestmen or predatory mites be a good pest control? I have a thriving springtail population that mostly stays hidden under things on the substrate, but I don't mind if a predator picks off a few of them as long as the gnat population is under control. Even better, are there any small spiders that could thrive in such a warm and humid environment and spin a web to catch gnats, or is that hoping for too much?

 

[itstracc]

Also-

I feel like pitcher plants may be an effective control method given their pretty well equipped to handle a sizeable amount of insects, though they require a good amount of sunlight. The other concern I would have is not knowing if the pitcher would be capable of taking down or at least injuring one of your millipedes.

My chicobolus millipedes are semi-arboreal and all of my pedes but my narceus climb constantly, so they would definitely get inside of a pitcher plant even if they're too big for it to eat. They've got a lot of climbing branches that they absolutely LOVE, and I'm sure they'd see a pitcher plant as a new opportunity to climb rather than a helpful pest control, haha.

 

[BepopCola]

If plants aren't exactly viable for me, would another predatory arthopod like harvestmen or predatory mites be a good pest control? I have a thriving springtail population that mostly stays hidden under things on the substrate, but I don't mind if a predator picks off a few of them as long as the gnat population is under control. Even better, are there any small spiders that could thrive in such a warm and humid environment and spin a web to catch gnats, or is that hoping for too much?

I use harvestmen in my tanks. In the tanks that I don't worry about losing a few baby millipedes in.
The juvenile harvestmen, more than the adults, will pick at just about anything they can carry-- mites, springtails, larva, very young millipedes.
From what I've seen, they'll avoid anything that's near the size of their body.

I also wanted to try cellar spiders, since I have some tall enclosures, but I've heard that they are very adaptable and can spread to other tanks and eat up all your pet spiders.

 

[basin79]

Thank you guys for your replies!



Would adding a small UVB light above the terrarium be enough to grow a sundew? Or would it not be enough/have to be extremely high output to grow the sundew? I don't have experience with plants, so I would definitely need something that I can just stick in my bioactive set up with my pedes and leave alone for the most part besides watering.


If plants aren't exactly viable for me, would another predatory arthopod like harvestmen or predatory mites be a good pest control? I have a thriving springtail population that mostly stays hidden under things on the substrate, but I don't mind if a predator picks off a few of them as long as the gnat population is under control. Even better, are there any small spiders that could thrive in such a warm and humid environment and spin a web to catch gnats, or is that hoping for too much?

Just give it a try. Worse case scenario is you have to take the plant out if it starts going downhill but you still get a plant out of it so there's no waste.

If the uv light works then great, you have a very effective and natural fly controller.

 

[itstracc]

Just give it a try. Worse case scenario is you have to take the plant out if it starts going downhill but you still get a plant out of it so there's no waste.

If the uv light works then great, you have a very effective and natural fly controller.

You're right, thank you! I've ordered a cape sundew from a carnivorous plant nursery and asked one of the employees if it would be safe for my millipedes just to confirm, so I'll definitely keep this thread updated in case anyone else wants to try going down the same route of pest control! If that doesn't work or if things go south I'll likely just end up taking out the plant and getting harvestmen since all of my millipedes are female and I won't be having any mini millis running around, LOL

 

[AuroraLights]

If you haven't done so already definitely add springtails, they won't get rid of gnats completely but they will compete with them and greatly reduce the numbers. What I also did was cover all my ventilation with very fine gnat proof mesh. Obviously that doesn't get rid of the gnats but it stops them getting out into your bedroom.
On the subject of mushrooms though, I have some bad news for you: millipedes love eating them! I had a tiny one growing in my viv and it was adorable, but after a few days one of my millipedes found it and ate the top of while I was watching. It was munched down to a stem in seconds. Actually, if my millipedes didn't eat a mushroom within a couple of weeks I'd worry it was poisonous and remove it. What we call a mushroom is actually just the fruiting body, most of the fungus grows underground. Usually it's a great addition to a millipede's diet, but I'd worry that if the fruiting body was toxic and they won't eat it then the hyphae (the underground bit) might be inedible as well. I'm not a mushroom expert so I don't know if fungi which produce poisonous mushrooms have toxins in the hyphae as well, but if they do and you let them release spores and make more then they could end up making your whole substrate inedible, or worse poisoning your millies. I could be worrying unnecessarily, but personally I would say that if the millipedes don't want to eat it you should remove it, and if they do then they will remove it for you. So either way, enjoy the mushrooms while they last but don't get too attached!

 

[itstracc]

If you haven't done so already definitely add springtails, they won't get rid of gnats completely but they will compete with them and greatly reduce the numbers. What I also did was cover all my ventilation with very fine gnat proof mesh. Obviously that doesn't get rid of the gnats but it stops them getting out into your bedroom.

Thanks for replying! I have a massive colony of springtails in with my millipedes, and the fungus gnats began to appear after the colony was already large - I assume due to the fact that it's a vertical tank with a lot of climbs and airspace that the springtails can't get to. I've also already covered all of the ventilation spots with super fine fiberglass mesh, but due to the build of the tank there's a gap along the door hinge big enough for the gnats to get in and out of that I can't cover or the door won't open. They mostly tend to stay inside the terrarium luckily, but my biggest issue is that whenever I open the door gnats get all in my face.

On the subject of mushrooms though, I have some bad news for you: millipedes love eating them! I had a tiny one growing in my viv and it was adorable, but after a few days one of my millipedes found it and ate the top of while I was watching. It was munched down to a stem in seconds. Actually, if my millipedes didn't eat a mushroom within a couple of weeks I'd worry it was poisonous and remove it. What we call a mushroom is actually just the fruiting body, most of the fungus grows underground. Usually it's a great addition to a millipede's diet, but I'd worry that if the fruiting body was toxic and they won't eat it then the hyphae (the underground bit) might be inedible as well. I'm not a mushroom expert so I don't know if fungi which produce poisonous mushrooms have toxins in the hyphae as well, but if they do and you let them release spores and make more then they could end up making your whole substrate inedible, or worse poisoning your millies. I could be worrying unnecessarily, but personally I would say that if the millipedes don't want to eat it you should remove it, and if they do then they will remove it for you. So either way, enjoy the mushrooms while they last but don't get too attached!

I haven't actually seen any of my pedes touching the mushrooms so far! Mostly it's been the springtails breaking them down from the base which causes the entire body to die and collapse which they then swarm and break down. It kinda sucks that the mushrooms don't last longer than a couple days at most, but it's certainly neat knowing that my springtails have a constant supply of food (which I assume is probably why they've been reproducing so much quicker lately than they used to, as I've never noticed any fungus in the terrarium before recently). Honestly, I'd actually be thrilled if I could catch my millipedes eating the mushrooms, because then they'd be getting an even more varied diet even if I had to leave them alone for a while. In any case, the mushrooms are certainly being used up by the inhabitants!

 

[AuroraLights]

I haven't actually seen any of my pedes touching the mushrooms so far!

Well, if the springtails are eating them I'm sure they're fine. Perhaps some millipedes just don't like mushrooms? Actually, come to think of it I seem to remember I saw my A.gigas walk over the little mushroom and ignore it, and I'm not sure if she's ever eaten the mushroom pieces I put in.

Honestly, I'd actually be thrilled if I could catch my millipedes eating the mushrooms, because then they'd be getting an even more varied diet even if I had to leave them alone for a while.

Yeah, it was actually pretty cool. It's amazing how millipedes let so little go to waste, they're such great recyclers!
I wish there was a way to get mushrooms to grow reliably in a viv. Actually, there's an idea, maybe I could look into getting one of those grow-your-own own mushroom logs and putting that in... and when they're done with the mushrooms they could eat the log!

 

[itstracc]

I wish there was a way to get mushrooms to grow reliably in a viv. Actually, there's an idea, maybe I could look into getting one of those grow-your-own own mushroom logs and putting that in... and when they're done with the mushrooms they could eat the log!

Oh wow, I've never even heard of those! You should definitely look into that more, and please let me know if you decide to try it! I'd LOVE to know if it works!

 

[AuroraLights]

Oh wow, I've never even heard of those! You should definitely look into that more, and please let me know if you decide to try it! I'd LOVE to know if it works!

Only problem is the one I found for sale so far was enormous, far too big for my viv! But I'll have a look for something smaller, and I'll let you know if I do get one. Or maybe I could even try making one myself, but I feel don't know how difficult that would be. I looked into making kinshi for my millipedes before but it seemed like you need proper sterilisation equipment like an autoclave and a HEPA filter to do that.