Can water with lower ph help inhibit mold growth?

[Fins]

I have a friend with a water filter that can alter the ph level of his water as well as remove impurities and chemicals.
He said that a ph level around 2.0 can inhibit mold growth. I realize using a different substrate would help as well. I just wondered if the lower ph water would be safe for Ts and if there might be some benefit.

 

[Introvertebrate]

I looked around and peat moss has a pH of 3. Lemon juice is 2. Not sure how that would effect a T, if at all.

 

[jam5906]

I get mold in my cages sometime too pick up some Methylparaben (or Methyl paraben) put 2 teaspoons in a gallon of water and mist away all mold will be gone in a day and will not return. Ive used it for 10 years with no ill effects. just google Methylparaben for sale you should be able to find it for under $20 and it will last for a long time. FYI it is naturally occurring in nature (blueberries) and is food grade and completely biodegradable. it dos not dissolve very well in water so shake it well.

 

[zonbonzovi]

I get mold in my cages sometime too pick up some Methylparaben (or Methyl paraben) put 2 teaspoons in a gallon of water and mist away all mold will be gone in a day and will not return. Ive used it for 10 years with no ill effects. just google Methylparaben for sale you should be able to find it for under $20 and it will last for a long time. FYI it is naturally occurring in nature (blueberries) and is food grade and completely biodegradable. it dos not dissolve very well in water so shake it well.

Interesting. I've used too much in FF cultures before and the cultures never developed. I was stumped but then read that not only does it inhibit mold growth but can bring larvae production to a halt. How much do you use per culture to ensure that it thrives?

 

[jam5906]

a pinch literally per 1 to 1 1/2 cups hot water mixed as well as it can and then add the media, i mix it further with my hands (until uniform) and press it in to the bottom of 16 oz cups with domed lids plugged with quilting batting for easy dispensing. this makes about 5 to 6 cultures at a time it should be a slightly on the dry side once the maggot hatch it will get wetter. it is trial and error to be honest i don't really measure i just know the consistency i'm looking for. I just posted a bit ago if you have a problem with them getting too soupy boil the water add the meth p and add a dash of Flax seed, (buy it bulk from a health food store) Flax has a gel in it that forms when it is gently boiled. when using it to mist for mold prevention you can start small and add more a few days later if it didn't work, but I'm sure even a tiny amount will work.

 

[Fins]

Thanks for the tips. Will definitely look into getting some Methyl Paraben. Although don't think I'll be trying FF. Hate those more than crickets.

 

[DaveM]

Also, on the original question: Perfectly pure water has a pH of 7 of course, but barely any buffering capacity. Water filters do remove tap water carbonate which buffers water best at a pH higher than 8, so filtering water typically lowers pH. If the pH does get as low as 2 while still being nearly pure, the water probably has extremely little buffering capacity -- meaning that any tiny future contamination (substrate, mold spores,etc.) can easily change the pH way back up to harmless levels in which mold could thrive. So both in terms of killing mold or your tarantula, it is not actually the pH that matters, but the pH x buffering capacity. The filtered water is unlikely to prevent mold or harm your T,
It's kinda like how you can touch aluminum foil while it's baking at 400 degrees F without getting burned -- it's not the temperature that burns you, but the amount of heat transferred, and aluminum has so little heat capacity that you're fine.
As an aside, though, if you had a water solution that was strongly buffered at a pH of 2, only very specialized organisms could survive in it, it would likely give you acid burns if you left it on your skin, and it would probably dissolve your T.

 

[jim777]

When I used to do some gardening, I found my tap water was about 6.7 and my plants needed 6.0 (optimally). I found 3 drops of white vinegar in a gallon of water would get me that drop. A ph of 2.0 is super low though; not sure where you would find that as ground moisture anywhere.

 

[Fins]

The tap water in Memphis is actually around 7.2. I believe that is higher than most, which may explain why I am constantly picking mold from my sling's Eco Earth. The water here is from an artesian well below the city.

I see why peat is better now. I like the methyl paraben idea too. I use a few drops of GSE (grapefruit seed extract) in my birds water to avoid bacteria growth. If it'll fit in the water bowl they will stick it in there, including themselves. I don't think it would be good got the Ts though.

 

[Bill S]

...Water filters do remove tap water carbonate which buffers water best at a pH higher than 8, so filtering water typically lowers pH. If the pH does get as low as 2 while still being nearly pure, .....

As an aside, though, if you had a water solution that was strongly buffered at a pH of 2, only very specialized organisms could survive in it, it would likely give you acid burns if you left it on your skin, and it would probably dissolve your T.

Filtration only removes particulate matter - not chemicals dissolved in the water. That includes carbonates. Non-dissolved carbonate particles will not affect pH, dissolved carbonates cannot be filtered until they are forced out of solution. And the pH of water cannot get anywhere near 2 if the water is pure. If the water is pure, the pH will be about 7.0. For the pH to move away from 7 there MUST be other chemicals added to the water. But you are correct about only specialized organisms being able to survive in a pH of 2. That's a very harsh environmental condition.

 

[DaveM]

Filtration only removes particulate matter - not chemicals dissolved in the water. That includes carbonates. Non-dissolved carbonate particles will not affect pH, dissolved carbonates cannot be filtered until they are forced out of solution. And the pH of water cannot get anywhere near 2 if the water is pure. If the water is pure, the pH will be about 7.0. For the pH to move away from 7 there MUST be other chemicals added to the water. But you are correct about only specialized organisms being able to survive in a pH of 2. That's a very harsh environmental condition.

Wow, sorry Bill, but that is complete nonsense! You must be thinking only of mechanical filtration... like through a coffee filter? LOL.
There are so many filtration technologies specifically devoted to removing dissolved chemicals from water. Do some reading on 'reverse osmosis' or 'ion exchange filtration'.
Even cheap consumer filters remove dissolved chemicals. Brita filters, for example, use activated carbon -- the performance of these is assayed by iodine retention.
Here's a diagram from a typical home filtration system explaining how it removes carbonate from water.

 

[Bill S]

Dave, maybe you aren't clear on the difference between filtration (which is indeed mechanical - like with a coffee filter) and chemical systems which can remove chemicals by means other than filtration. Some of the solutes can be precipitated out of solution or chemically converted and removed without filtration. In the picture you posted note that the first phase is the chemical conversion of carbonates into a gas - which is not filtration. (You may have noticed also that their equation is not balanced, by the way.) In the second step they mention removing "hard mineral" from the water. It's not hard until it's precipitated out. Once that happens it can be mechanically removed. But even this removal may be through other means than filtration - such as binding ions to resins.

Actually, I think we are ALMOST on the same page - just differing as to the correct usage of the word "filtration". You are including other forms of removal as filtration, I'm differentiating filtration from those other forms of removal. In the end, we both agree that the chemicals can be removed from the water.

 

[DaveM]

Well, Bill, if you were motivated to correct me over terminology and not the actual science, then I am satisfied. I don't have any doubt that the word 'filtration' originally carried only the meaning you suggest, and I gladly concede that this may still be its most common usage. At the same time, it is simple fact that industry and academic researchers classify other means of separating solutions as 'chemical filtration' or 'biological filtration'. If Brita should label their water filters as 'adsorption/ion exchange columns' as well, then good. I'm sympathetic to your view; preserving the specificity of English words is a worthy cause. How it kills me that the word 'comprise' has become interchangeable with the word 'compose' – I shudder every time I hear “...is comprised of...”

As for the science and my first post in this thread, I was explaining why pH might be reduced by passing water through what is marketed as a water filter (which, in layman's terms, you must agree can reasonably be called 'filtering'). Carbonate and/or other solutes are removed. Whatever you'd like to call the process, there can be no questioning that. It would be also be wrong to say that no method of mechanical filtration removes dissolved molecules. Reverse osmosis does. Of course you're right that particle size matters; in this method the membrane pore size is small enough to exclude particles as tiny as dissolved ions. I also explained that the pH of filtered (or whatever) water may vary significantly if buffering salts have been removed – minute contamination or maybe a thin crust of calibration acid left on his pH meter's probe could cause unbuffered water to read as strongly acidic. I really can't see any fault with the science of what I wrote, admitting that it was conversational, and far removed from the technical language I would use when trying to publish my research.

But if you're up for restoring 'filtration' to its former narrowness of meaning, then I defect to your side. We'll have photographers asking us if it's filtration when lens filters exclude some light based on polarity or wavelength, med students challenging us on whether the blood-brain barrier filters out toxins based on hydrophobicity and confused over how to describe kidney nephron function, and concerned parents asking about whether they've been cheated having bought pornography filtering software... lots of irrelevance, could be tough, but I'm game for a quixotic crusade! I'm sending you a friend request.

 

[Bill S]

For about 40 years my father owned and managed a company that specialized in industrial filtration and fluid handling. Actually, the subject has become a bit more boring to me than it appears to be to you. But I have no problem with your perspectives. (And the friend request was accepted.)

 

[ImDeadly]

When I used to do some gardening, I found my tap water was about 6.7 and my plants needed 6.0 (optimally). I found 3 drops of white vinegar in a gallon of water would get me that drop. A ph of 2.0 is super low though; not sure where you would find that as ground moisture anywhere.

Vinegar is toxic to T's.

 

[Introvertebrate]

3 drops per gallon of water?

 

[ImDeadly]

Not sure about dilluted vinegar but why chance it? The fumes alone can kill a T. Just wanted to get that out there so nobody loses a T.