Advice for first time ownership of an Old World T (+ how to know if you're ready)

[deviousdiatom]

Hi,

Long time lurker, first time poster

My partner and I have gotten into the hobby a little over a year ago, and currently own 4 T's: Honduran Curly Hair (T. albopilosus), Guatemalan Tiger Rump (D. pentaloris), Green Bottle Blue (C. cyanopubescens), and Antilles Pinktoe (C. versicolor).

The curly hair was our very first and she is the easiest, most chill pet we have ever had --and what made me fall in love with Tarantulas! The versicolor we got as a half-inch sling ~4 months ago and had absolutely zero issues with him/her since, and I've absolutely adored watching the little dude grow. We recently got the GBB and Tiger Rump as larger juveniles, and they have also been easy to feed, rehouse, and generally care for.

We really want to get the Togo Starburst Baboon (H. maculata) and Gooty Sapphire (P. metallica) next, but want to make sure we're ready for the leap into Old World T's! We have watched countless YouTube videos on the aforementioned species, as well as Old World tarantulas in general, and have read care guides and posts from prominent keepers.

Some reasons I think we're ready (please feel free to dispute!):

1. I have a B.S. in Biology and worked in animal husbandry at my college for 2 years (primarily reptile and amphibian care)
2. We both have for over 5 years, and still do, own reptiles, amphibians, and invertebrates at home
3. We don’t handle our Ts and have no expectation of handling unless absolutely necessary for rehousing/emergencies etc
4. From the majority of what we've read/watched, the primary concern with H. maculata and P. metallica is speed rather than the bite, as they won't bite unless provoked/feeling defensive
5. We plan to get both as slings, so we can observe their behavior and be better accustomed as to what we should expect from them as adults!

That being said, I'd love to hear some anecdotal evidence/advice from this forum as well:
How did you know you were ready for an old world T, and do you have any wisdom for ownership of the H. maculata or P. metallica?? Is one a better intro to Old World than the other..?

Thanks

 

[worldsparadox]

Maybe read up on some bite reports for H. maculata, they would not be a species that I recommend for a first old world. I started my old world adventure with a poecilotheria and starting with a sling is a good idea.
I am sure others will have much more advice then I

 

[NMTs]

As far as your experience with your current T's goes, jumping to an H. mac or Poecilotheria as your first OW species would be like going from the bunny slope to the double black diamond on the ski hill. Generally speaking, you want to work your way up to dealing with animals that have the potential for "blink-of-an-eye teleportation" and much more potent venom by starting with some slightly more challenging species and getting used to them before moving onto the next level. There are some NW species that would offer a good introduction into speedier arboreal T's, like Psalmopoeus and Tapinauchenius, which are fast, have some attitude, and a bite would ruin your day, but wouldn't send you to the hospital like a bite from an H. mac or Pokie likely would. You might also start with some OW's that are known for being easier to work with, like Ceratogyrus, Harpactira, Pterinochilus, or Monocentropus (not arboreal species, but will help you get used to speed and defensiveness).

Ultimately, it's up to you - if you're the type that jumps into the deep end of the pool before you've learned to swim and you don't end up drowning, then going straight for an H. mac, S. cal, or Pokie might be fine. The fact that you made this post looking for assurance and advice, though, indicates to me that you might not really be that type, so you should probably consider starting with some species that are easier to learn with first.

 

[Gilligan]

Personally I would start with a fast and defensive new world before somthing like a P.met or H.mac. Like the others have said, get the feel of a fast T first. At the end of the day you don't have much to loose with a Psalmopoeus compared to a H.mac. My first old worlds were a P. regalis and S. crassipes, I was prepared for the speed but unless you've experienced it first hand, reading and watching videos does not do it justice. Any nerves or jitters you are experiencing now will be intensified when confronted with a fast old world.
As someone who started out with some of the more significant old worlds like you are wanting to, take my advice and start slow with the new worlds. No one can prepare you for the real creature.

 

[Andrea82]

Those are the worst OW species to start out with, actually. Something that should have come up in your research as well. While running will always be their first defense, neither species hesitate to bite either when cornered enough.

Unless you've kept true spider species, experience with other invertebrates doesn't help much, nor does experience with reptiles or other exotics.

Since you're looking to get into OW arboreals, and like others here suggested, a good NW genus to help you get a feeling for them is Psalmopoeus. Looking at your current collection it looks like you and your partner like colorful spiders, P.victorii has lovely colors and has a bit of a temper here and there. Speedy and agile enough to give you a run for your money if you don't pay attention enough.

Tapinauchenius spp are good NW practice as well, they're considered the fastest arboreals across the board for a reason, and come in pretty purples and oranges.

If you're okay with practice with an OW that isn't arboreal, M.balfouri is a beautiful species. Packs a punch venomwise but isn't as zappy as the arboreals are and, for an old world, not as defensive.

Hope this helps!

Edit:
If you're looking for an OW that has the same dorsal markings as H.maculata has and is a lovely golden color but doesn't have the temper then I can recommend Augacephalus ezendami as well!

 

[Stylopidae]

I agree that Psalmopeus is a good bridge between OW and NW. Monocentropus isn't a species I have any experience with, but it seems like it's quite expensive for a bridge species. Not saying it wouldn't work out...but it might break your budget.

My first OW was P. regalis, and it worked out just fine. If you really want to do Poecilotheria, starting with a sling might not be a bad idea.

Just echoing what others have said, but the advice here is really solid.

 

[Cmac2111]

As others have said, I'd personally get some more experience with some faster and potentially more defensive NW species first, but it's up to you at the end of the day. Many new keepers underestimate the Psalmopeus genus because of the 'New World' tag attached to them, but they can be VERY fast and often aren't friendly... I concur that they are a good steppingstone towards keeping OW arboreals.

You might also start with some OW's that are known for being easier to work with, like Ceratogyrus, Harpactira, Pterinochilus, or Monocentropus (not arboreal species, but will help you get used to speed and defensiveness)

If you are set on getting an OW, then I second this advice from NMT's. I have a C darlingi and M balfouri, and whilst the former is cranky and the latter is bolty, both are reasonable to manage when delt with respectfully. I would take dealing with them over some Phormictopus species any day of the week...

 

[deviousdiatom]

Wow, thank you SO much for the detailed feedback and suggestions! It definitely sounds like we shouldn't jump in with the H. maculata or P. metallica. I did look up bite reports and month long cramping definitely isn't something either of us want to risk

I definitely do lean toward the more vibrant colors --the white/grey is super striking to me on substrate/bark, and then the blues are just insanely stunning. M. balfouri and P. regalis are definitely ones that we both have considered, so we might try one of those as our first OW!

Psalmopoeus victorii is one of which i've never heard but is definitely one i might have to get just because of how cool the color contrast is!
Harpactira pulchripes is also a really cool one; love the metallic legs!

Pterinochilus

So we actually both are REALLY interested in the OBT! Would you say that's a better beginner option for an OW?? I thought those were very well known for their teleportation and aggression. Or did you mean another species under the Pterinochulus genus?

 

[Gilligan]

In my experience the OBT’s reputation as being aggressive is very overdrawn. They may be defensive but no where near what their reputation says. They are quite fast. Not sure I would recommend to a beginner old world keeper however.

 

[NMTs]

So we actually both are REALLY interested in the OBT! Would you say that's a better beginner option for an OW?? I thought those were very well known for their teleportation and aggression. Or did you mean another species under the Pterinochulus genus?

I agree that OBT's have been given a reputation they don't really deserve - when you house them properly and treat them with respect they're not so bad. They can be pretty temperamental, though, and they're fast as all get out, so shouldn't be taken lightly and I can understand why some people would hesitate to suggest them as a first OW. I was thinking more along the lines of P. lugardi or P. chordatus.

Harpactira pulchripes is a great first OW, and they're beautiful:

0.0.1 - Harpactira pulchripes - 08.30.22

• NMTs
• Sep 2, 2022
• 2
• baboon golden blue leg baboon harpactira harpactira pulchripes pulchripes

Gold and blue at the end of the tunnel... Pretty thing.

Harpactira baviana, H. chrysogaster, and several of the others in the genus are shades of gold that are very striking, and I've found them to be relatively chill for OW species.

Psalmopoeus victori is an awesome species, and mine has been a sweetheart, but she's fast:

0.1 Psalmopoeus victori (Mars)

• NMTs
• Oct 14, 2022
• darth maul tarantula juvenile female psalmopoeus psalmopoeus victori psalmos victori

Rehoused this girl yesterday, so I was able to get a couple decent pics. She's just a hair over...

Let us know what you decide!

 

[arthurliuyz]

So we actually both are REALLY interested in the OBT! Would you say that's a better beginner option for an OW?? I thought those were very well known for their teleportation and aggression. Or did you mean another species under the Pterinochulus genus?

OBTs are definitely not an ideal beginner species, but IME as long as you can handle bolts in rehouses (which can be learned from getting a flighty NW first) and have a proper setup, it won't be much of a problem. But this really varies between people. I've heard some that jump into OWs get bit or have an escaped t, but others (including me) that has jumped into OWs a little earlier than ideal won't have any problems. If you want to be safe with it, though, I would suggest starting with a bolty NW or "beginner" OW.

 

[viper69]

You aren’t ready; you picked the wrong species too.

 

[The Grym Reaper]

How did you know you were ready for an old world T? "-" Is one a better intro to Old World than the other..?

I didn't, someone thought it was a great idea to send me (who'd been keeping for 3 months at the time) a Chilobrachys huahini (basically a bigger, moisture dependent OBT for lack of a better description) as a surprise freebie with my B. emilia so I kinda got thrown into the Asian fossorial deep end and just had to deal with it, it's not something I would recommend.

Poecilotheria metallica is the least bad out of those two but isn't a good intro to OW species (hell, they're not even a good introduction to Poecilotheria IMO). The best introductions to OWs are actually NW species from the Psalmopoeinae subfamily. Psalmopoeus have similar care/speed/temperaments to Poecilotheria but a bite won't result in a trip to the ER so if you can keep these without issue then you're good to keep OW arboreals. Likewise, Ephebopus have similar care/speed/temperaments to Asian fossorials but without the venom potency so you would want to get one of these first if you were looking to go down that route.

So we actually both are REALLY interested in the OBT! Would you say that's a better beginner option for an OW??

No.

In my experience the OBT’s reputation as being aggressive is very overdrawn. They may be defensive but no where near what their reputation says. They are quite fast. Not sure I would recommend to a beginner old world keeper however.

Yeah, it's mostly because people read "semi-arboreal" on some nonsense care sheet, try to house them in a heavy-webbing terrestrial setup (like you would for a GBB), and then wonder why they have an ultra skittish/defensive jack in the box for a tarantula. If housed properly they're more likely to duck into their burrows than bolt out of the enclosure or stand and fight.

 

[l4nsky]

Some reasons I think we're ready (please feel free to dispute!):

1. I have a B.S. in Biology and worked in animal husbandry at my college for 2 years (primarily reptile and amphibian care)
2. We both have for over 5 years, and still do, own reptiles, amphibians, and invertebrates at home

What reptiles do you work with?

I'm a bit of an outlier in that I started with OW species (I didn't get a NW until my 3rd or 4th invertebrate and it was a Psalmopoeus sp at that). I'm also one of the few who believe that some experience with other animals can crossover and lessen the learning curve. IMO, the practiced ability to accurately handle equipment (tongs, hemostats, etc) as an extension of the arm when working with and around animals with less than stellar dispositions is a transferable skill to this hobby, as is the ability to remain calm when necessary, react quickly when necessary, monitor and interpret body language/positioning, know how to research a species and set it up to feel safe, etc. I've been field herping since I was very young and have had more than my fair share of irritated reptile encounters over the years. I leveraged that experience when I first started, and while there were some small bumps along the path, starting with OW's was entirely manageable.

Also, for what it's worth, I keep Psalmopoeus sp, Phormingochilus sp, Poecilotheria sp, Lampropelma sp, Ornithoctoninae sp, and Tapinauchenius sp in my collection. All are more or less known for quick turns of speed, but I can attest that the Tapinauchenius are the S-tier genus for tarantula speed. I just got into Tappy's this year, after ~5 years of keeping Psalmo's, Pokies, and Phormingochilus ssp and even I wasn't prepared for it. If you want to go the ladder route to OW's, they would be a good challenge.

 

[zachmanton]

My first Old World was an H. Gigas and P. Rufilata. We got the Gigas as a freebie sling and was given the Rufilata by a friend. We have done well with them, but we also had experience with Psalmopoeus and Tapinauechenius before taking the Rufilata. Would definitely consider trying one of the species I just mentioned first.

 

[MyDadHasTarantulas]

I agree with people saying to work the ladder system. Pslamopeus are a great start. I really just want to point out that I fancy myself an experienced keeper, and I have a BS in Bio also. Just want to say that 1 thing has nothing to do with the other. My biology degree offered no help in learning how to care for tarantulas. Maybe some basic anatomy and taxonomy stuff, but nothing practical is going to translate from your degree to tarantula keeping. Dont let that make you over eager.

One thing I didnt see mentioned. If you're going to go the ladder route, rehousing is where 99% of problems arise. With only a handful of ts currently, you do not have the rehousing experience under your belt. Raise up a handful of pslamo slings to adulthood. Dont see them through a couple molts and think you're ready.

 

[gabrieldezzi]

OBTs are definitely not an ideal beginner species, but IME as long as you can handle bolts in rehouses (which can be learned from getting a flighty NW first) and have a proper setup, it won't be much of a problem. But this really varies between people. I've heard some that jump into OWs get bit or have an escaped t, but others (including me) that has jumped into OWs a little earlier than ideal won't have any problems. If you want to be safe with it, though, I would suggest starting with a bolty NW or "beginner" OW.

I personally agree with this a lot, I found (as you mentioned) it's much easier to deal with these spiders when you are confident in rehousing, have a spotter, and respect for the animal is never replaced by fear.

I did learn (the hard way albeit) there's a pretty specific way you should set up a lot OBT enclosures specifically (finding the right balance between substrate and enough air room for the T to web properly) this pretty much negated anything like webbing the lid of the enclosure and whatnot.

TL: DR; I agree, Old Worlds are definitely not for beginner keepers, and as someone (I forgot who!) said, "You shouldn't place yourself in a situation where you're seeing all 'handle-able' and docile A. chalcodes and A. avicularia's, and then you're suddenly faced with a fast, defensive, and worst of all, unpredictable Old World. If the idea of rehousing an OW gets you anxious, most likely not time yet."

Though of course we shouldn't demonize Old Worlds to the point that keepers never want to make that jump; there's a happy medium.

 

[Denn]

First post on the boards in years, couldn’t even remember my previous log in details

As others have suggested, Psalmopoeus sp would be a great intermediate between NW/OW, P. victori is a lovely T, very beautiful! My personal favourites are P. irminia and P. pulcher, with irminia being one of my top favourites in the entire hobby. All members of the sp I have tend to spend a fair bit of time behind their dirt curtains, but when they are out it’s a joy to behold. Absolute stunning tarantulas.