Tarantula venom causes paralysis in humans?

[Venom]

I think that's a very reasonable position, Venom.

Thank you

Incidentally, I'm again repeating that it's not likely, but possible.

I know you think it's unlikely. It was just that, since you were having to defend the possibility, it came out as if you were also defending the probability.

On a different note, Venom, there is a lot of stuff for you to respond to in the watering hole.

Yeah, I know. I'm out of energy and motivation however. There comes a time when it's not worth continuing the debate. If I kept this up indefinitely, I'd be doing nothing but research, and that's not the point of TWH debating. Don't worry, the subject will come up again before long.

 

[Crotalus]

But you use this same approach to rule out the possibility of a tarantula bite ever causing a death, even with extenuating factors involved. Since I disagree with your position on that subject, I don't think I can agree with your logic here either. I think it's a case of exaggeration on both sides: you are saying it's flat out impossible, and DrAce is saying it's definitely possible. His logic is based on evidence of chemistry, and yours on observation of non-occurrence of anaphylaxis.

As far as I can see no lifethreatening documented cases have been reported, only anecdotes (comatose cases that no one can provide details about etc) and third hand information or reports made by layman and not a doctor. So yes I rule out there is a tarantula in the hobby that are capable of inflicting a lethal envenomation. And no im not saying its "flat out impossible" - im looking at the facts we have and how the venom works and make my opinion based on that. If there are a unknown species with a potent venom out there - who knows - but for all we know today its unlikely or atleast unheard of.

All respect to Dr Ace, but I prefer to go on Bryan G Frys knowledge about venom over Dr Ace on a hobby forum

So in a way, I agree with both of you, but I'm not going to worry about an allergic reaction myself, and I'm not going to advise people to consider it among tarantula defense risks.

Scorpion venom can produce a allergic reaction such as anaphylaxis (that is documented) but all the knowledgable people say that is so unlikely to get it its not worth mention as a possible risk.
If thats the case with venom that are capable of inducing these reactions - then id say tarantula venom and allergic reactions are a nil risk.

What I do advise people to consider is their own health. I don't feel that a tarantula has the potency to kill a healthy human of non-tender years, at least not to any probability that we need to consider. What I do consider possible, after reading many bite reports from a range of species, is that tarantula bites can be "medically significant,"--not life-threatening in and of themselves, but potentially so when combined with other, already serious medical conditions. Body-wide muscle cramping isn't too dangerous...but if you have muscular dystrophy, it's a different story. A tight chest and some breathing strain isn't going to kill you, but if you have cystic fibrosis or COPD, it's not so clear what may happen. Same goes with S.calceata-induced heart irregularities and heart disease patients, or severe swelling from poecs and diabetes patients, or neurological effects with MS patients. The tarantula bite taken alone is not fatal, but it might, in some species, aggravate or contribute to a pre-existent condition to the degree that one's life could conceivably be in danger.

Of course, if im suffering from a lifethreatening disaese - been bitten by anything venomous doesnt do any good to me. But you cannot say its the acctual venom in it self that are dangerous then. Its that persons general health that are already declining. Then again, I havent read any report of people with MS or any other disase getting bitten so that reasoning is purely hypothetical. I could say that tarantula venom might do them good since there are components in the venom that are useful in medicine. Thats just as wrong without anything backing it up.

It's not a great leap of logic, and we have evidence both for the T bites causing certain effects ( bite reports, which ARE good sources of evidence ), and of certain diseases having effects along the same lines, or compromising systems in ways that leave a vulnerability to Tarantula bite effects. The only type of observed evidence we lack is what happens when diseases and T-bites interact, and with more and more people entering the hobby, it may not be long before we hear of this. Thus, I think common sense should compell us to advise novice hobbyists of the effects certain tarantulas can have, and the risks of interaction with similar diseases that they may pose.

Yes certain effects but far from life threatening. Keep that in mind. Bite reports written by "Joe, 21" with zero medicinal background is not so good in my opinion anyway. A increase in heartrate could easily be mistaken etc etc.
If im discouraging a novice to get poecs or stromatos its not because of the venom - its because they are a handful to control for a beginner.
if im discouraging a novice from getting Phoneutria its because they have a highly potent venom and are a nightmare to control for a beginner.

 

[DrAce]

I think we're done here. Both of us have articulated our positions in about as many ways as possible.

I think the conclusion from both of us is: forget about it.

 

[DrAce]

By the way

By the way, for the first 10 years of the HIV pandemic, there was no evidence of heterosexual transmission. It was thought to be impossible.

That ended well too.

Not all tarantula bites are reported in the medical literature, and certainly not all in English, where we'd get our hands on it.

 

[Stan Schultz]

I was reading a website which described possible symptoms that one could obtain from a tarantula bite and one of these was paralysis! The website does state that this would be temporary. ...

That website is fraught with all sorts of "mis-truths." It's another example of some one with more expertise in webpage development and much less in arachnoculture advertising their ignorance to the general public.

BTW, what is that wiggly thing in the upper left area supposed to be anyway?

 

[Stylopidae]

That website is fraught with all sorts of "mis-truths." It's another example of some one with more expertise in webpage development and much less in arachnoculture advertising their ignorance to the general public.

BTW, what is that wiggly thing in the upper left area supposed to be anyway?

I thought it was something NSFW at first, but then it turned out to be a rattlesnake's rattle.