Self cleaning dubia newbie questions

[biggus dickus]

I need a large feeder, so dubias are a natural choice. Never kept roaches of any kind before. I have millipedes, isopods, and mealworms though.

I dont want to clean out their dry frass. I used to do this with superworms and dont want to go back. So I wanna try a wet deep substrate self cleaning set up like I do with my millipedes and isopods. Can they live like that indefinately on their own, or do I need to add a second critter to clean up after them? I have backyard isopods, mealworms, mites, springtails. Which one would work best?

I was thinking bin with mesh top, 4 inches of compost, 2+ inches of oak leaves, and stacked bark/egg carton/branches for surface area. put food directly on the substrate. Thats the set up ive been using for the isopods and millipedes and its been running for over 5 years. Will this work for dubias?

 

[Dry Desert]

I need a large feeder, so dubias are a natural choice. Never kept roaches of any kind before. I have millipedes, isopods, and mealworms though.

I dont want to clean out their dry frass. I used to do this with superworms and dont want to go back. So I wanna try a wet deep substrate self cleaning set up like I do with my millipedes and isopods. Can they live like that indefinately on their own, or do I need to add a second critter to clean up after them? I have backyard isopods, mealworms, mites, springtails. Which one would work best?

I was thinking bin with mesh top, 4 inches of compost, 2+ inches of oak leaves, and stacked bark/egg carton/branches for surface area. put food directly on the substrate. Thats the set up ive been using for the isopods and millipedes and its been running for over 5 years. Will this work for dubias?

Unless you have only Dwarf White isopods in with your millipedes, they will be definitely be self cleaning, as that will include any eggs or young molting millipedes.

Any creature kept in captivity will need cleaning, the more in a single enclosure the more cleaning.

Unless you can teach your cat to use the toilet , then you still need to flush afterwards.

 

[kadupul]

I think that there are benefits to keeping some of these in with one or a few bugs, but in a feeder colony there's just too much waste for them to possibly keep a handle on. I think it's best to keep things as dry as the dubias will take.

I'd be very careful using isopods from the outdoors as they may have parasites on or within them that may be transmitted to your other inverts. And as Dry Desert said, most isopods can't be trusted around other invertebrates.

 

[l4nsky]

Unfortunately, no it won't work with dubia that are produced as feeders (setup as pets in low population densities and maintained at low densities might work, but that's another topic). I've tried a similar setup with my lateralis in the past and it failed. As @kadupul stated, a self sustaining feeder colony of any size will produce too much waste for a Clean Up Crew (CUC) to stay on top of. Eventually, it will need to be cleaned and you'll be tossing out a good portion of your CUC when you change subs.

 

[biggus dickus]

thank you all for the advice. @l4nsky how exactly did it fail?

Just how much waste do dubias produce? Scooping out half the substrate 2 twice a year wouldent be so bad, but once a month would be annoying.

Also cant I just move them away from heat / feed less protein once the colony is at the size I want? I dont need 1000s of them

 

[Salmonsaladsandwich]

If you don't have that many things to feed I think a large setup where you keep temperatures moderate and don't feed them too much nutrient-dense food (e.g, make the bulk of their diet stuff like leaf litter and vegetables and feed them grains and protein in moderation) could be sustainable and useful as a feeder colony.

 

[l4nsky]

thank you all for the advice. @l4nsky how exactly did it fail?

The failure was just that, a failure. The colony produced too much waste too quickly, which led to a very unpleasant odor that forced semi-frequent sub changes. I think I managed to keep it going for 2 months before I got sick of it and switched things up.

Also cant I just move them away from heat / feed less protein once the colony is at the size I want? I dont need 1000s of them

IME, it's very hard to pull off such a balancing act with a prolific feeder species like dubia, lateralis etc, especially if they're being used as a feeder and being harvested perpetually. You're much more likely to hit either extreme (too many dubia or not enough to feed off) than you are to keep everything "just right" IMO.