Red Knee Eye Injury

[BertWright]

Anyone who has had this experience, please reply - one of my Brachypelma smithi Mexican Redknee Tarantulas, a sub-adult, seemingly has gotten its eyes torn off - it was eating crickets a day or so ago and didn't apparently have any problem then - I really don't know about the eyes at the time because I didn't get a look. It molted a couple or three months ago and seemed ok, since then. But when I tossed in a cricket last night, I noticed it didn't even seem interested. No big deal, I mean Red knees will go long periods, as will most tarantulas, without eating. Anyway, since it wasn't going o eat, I thought I would take a look at I noticed a glistening, I don't want to say hemoglyph because it seemed clear, right over the light band between the carapace and the chilicera, it almost looked like dirt with some goo at first - I looked close it appears that something had knocked my redknee's eyes off from its ocular turbuckle (or whatever). It is terribly skittish and probably blind. Any suggestions, questions, comments. I have had tarantulas for years, but I have never noticed one of my larger tarantulas actually losing its eyes. My anticipatiion and expectation is that everything will be ok in a few months when it molts - anyone.

Bert Wright
Fellow Tarantula Keeper/Enthusiast

 

[cacoseraph]

Anyone who has had this experience, please reply - one of my Brachypelma smithi Mexican Redknee Tarantulas, a sub-adult, seemingly has gotten its eyes torn off - it was eating crickets a day or so ago and didn't apparently have any problem then - I really don't know about the eyes at the time because I didn't get a look. It molted a couple or three months ago and seemed ok, since then. But when I tossed in a cricket last night, I noticed it didn't even seem interested. No big deal, I mean Red knees will go long periods, as will most tarantulas, without eating. Anyway, since it wasn't going o eat, I thought I would take a look at I noticed a glistening, I don't want to say hemoglyph because it seemed clear, right over the light band between the carapace and the chilicera, it almost looked like dirt with some goo at first - I looked close it appears that something had knocked my redknee's eyes off from its ocular turbuckle (or whatever). It is terribly skittish and probably blind. Any suggestions, questions, comments. I have had tarantulas for years, but I have never noticed one of my larger tarantulas actually losing its eyes. My anticipatiion and expectation is that everything will be ok in a few months when it molts - anyone.

Bert Wright
Fellow Tarantula Keeper/Enthusiast

hemolymph can appear clear, slightly bluish, or i think slightly yellowish, but don't quote me on the yellow one

having no eyes should NOT impact it's hunting ability too much, as most of the targetting data comes from their earth and air tremble/vibration sense

i would be willing to bet 1 euro (the money, not the people) that tarantulas will not regen eye parts like that, but i hope i am wrong. it seems to me arachnids mainly regerate limbs: legs, pedipalps, and spinnerets, but not "body parts". again, i hope i am wrong

i do not believe tarantulas have the physical equipment to close their eyes

 

[YouLosePayUp]

i would be willing to bet 1 euro (the money, not the people) that tarantulas will not regen eye parts like that, but i hope i am wrong.

Interesting bet I have no euros but I could scrounge one up in Toronto (the people not the money)lol

I am not certain but I believe they have to regenerate everything on the outside in order to grow "proportionally" bad choice because the eyes are tiny compared to the rest of the body but what I meant was legs grow 1.25 times what they were before the moult then the eyes should grow 1.25 times what they were before the moult. Don't qoute me on this though

 

[cacoseraph]

Interesting bet I have no euros but I could scrounge one up in Toronto (the people not the money)lol

I am not certain but I believe they have to regenerate everything on the outside in order to grow "proportionally" bad choice because the eyes are tiny compared to the rest of the body but what I meant was legs grow 1.25 times what they were before the moult then the eyes should grow 1.25 times what they were before the moult. Don't qoute me on this though

i think there is like a germanitive (those euros, again) layer of cells that must remain undamaged to like, perpetuate a bodypart through a molt, but that is my sort of "synopsis" from all the stuff i've read and thought about

hmm, i think i'll do a search in a bit and see if we can't find evidence of important body parts being regen'ed or not.

empiricism is pretty hard to argue with

 

[AfterTheAsylum]

Ts are virtually blind. It won't affect them. All hemolymph I have seen has been clear. I haven't had a lot of bleeders... I am fairly certain that eyes will also regenerate; however, it is useless, because like I said, they are virtually blind. Hmmm... I will not end the streak of Euro comments... wait, yes I will - I can't think of any.

Cheers

The Sickness

 

[kosh]

not to doubt your story but, a T having it's eye "turret" ripped off by a cricket??
I want to see pics......

 

[BertWright]

Interesting response, euros and all that rot. I did not say nor did I imply that a cricket riped off the top of its carapace, ocular turbuckle or whatever. I was merely stating that the eye area was where it presumably came from. I mentioned hemoglyph and I followed that I did not want to say hemoglyph but I can tell you if you have ever witnessed a gross rupture, the goo is by no means clear - it was pus colored, almost Boston creme colored for a common reference of color. At any rate, my presumption is that it may have rubbed it off either going under something or perhaps from a short fall from the side of its enclosure - I really did not want to speculate as to how it happened - I was merely trying to convey that it DID happen. I am aware that these guys are virtually blind, but take it from someone who is legally blind - being neraly blind and being totally blind are two different things all together. I know my tarantula and it has always seemed a bit skittish for a red knee, but he is ridiculously jumpy and apparently scared (or seemingly scared). Also, to those who responded on eyes being regenerated after a molt: I can't say that I understand why someone would think that they would have to have a part to regenerate a part - I mean, they LOSE a leg and regenerate the leg. Granted the legs were there, but then again, so were the eyes. Also, I am holding out hope because each molt exuvium that I look at appears to have a set of eyes with it - yes? no? I am only concerned about the potential 'outlook' (no pun intended) for my red knee - Euros, Torontos and all other kidding aside. I am looking for a serious reply to this concern. Thank you and thanks for the feedback in advance.

 

[cacoseraph]

I mentioned hemoglyph and I followed that I did not want to say hemoglyph but I can tell you if you have ever witnessed a gross rupture, the goo is by no means clear - it was pus colored, almost Boston creme colored for a common reference of color.



I can't say that I understand why someone would think that they would have to have a part to regenerate a part - I mean, they LOSE a leg and regenerate the leg. Granted the legs were there, but then again, so were the eyes.

Also, I am holding out hope because each molt exuvium that I look at appears to have a set of eyes with it - yes? no? I am only concerned about the potential 'outlook' (no pun intended) for my red knee - Euros, Torontos and all other kidding aside. I am looking for a serious reply to this concern. Thank you and thanks for the feedback in advance.

on gross rupture there is a lot of fat cells and other stuff that is mixing together and rushing out. hemolymph, by virtue of what it is contructed of, is clearish, with a slight blue cast to it. i would venture a guess it is fat bodies that give the boston cream look

i didn't say they had to have a body part to regen it. i said they probably must retain a germanative layer of cells.

when tarantulas shed, all that is contained in the exuvium is their old cuticle. this is a layer that surrounds the entire tarantula, and is only perforate at the mouth, anus, book lung openings, genital operculum and maybe a few other areas i forget.
when you see "eyes" on a shed skin you are actually only seeing the cuticle layer that covers and protects them. that is, in part, why i have doubts that a tarantula can regen them. when they shed they aren't growing a set of eyes each time, they are only growing a very simple, clear covering for them

edit, added:
also, i didn't say being blind wouldn't affect the tara, i said it would likely not impact hunting very much. i expect being blind would affect how they percieve the seasons (length of day and night is thought to be a possible indicator to them). it might also mess up their nocturnal-ness, but that could just as easily be tied to temp and humidity... i dont know

 

[AussieTkeeper]

Ts are virtually blind. It won't affect them. All hemolymph I have seen has been clear. I haven't had a lot of bleeders... I am fairly certain that eyes will also regenerate; however, it is useless, because like I said, they are virtually blind. Hmmm... I will not end the streak of Euro comments... wait, yes I will - I can't think of any.

Cheers

The Sickness

T's have eyes for a reason so im sure that missing them would affect them in some way

 

[BertWright]

Thanks for the response. For what it's worth, I have heard similar descriptions of the hemoglyph being clear with a possible blue or green tinge. Also, I tend to agree with your assessment of the hemoglph and gross rupture - that the pus or cream color is indicative of other 'cells' and internal 'material' - that is, your assessment seems to be more consistent with any text that I've read on the color. Back to my red knee's particular eye injury. Indeed the appearance of this goo along wih the 'eye material' is clear and now, at closer inspection, there seems to be at least one of the eye-sets being still connected to the 'socket' via a small thread of tissue or something - nonetheless, this remaining eye set is positioned on the band between the chilecera and the carapace (between the fangs and the prosoma there is a light band - this is where it appears that one of the eye-sets may be resting - I am not sure). But, I still hold out some hope that the red knee will have some eyes after its next molt. I am not overly concerned about the potential loss of vision (though my hope is that it is temporary) as it is understood that their vision is poor under normal circumstances. I would provide a picture but my camera doesn't get the detail that I would like to show - I have a couple of cameras that take decent pictures of my tarantulas but closeups are blurred. Thanks again and I will share any and all updates to this condition as changes become manifest.

Bert Wright
Fellow Tarantula Keeper/Enthusiast

 

[Darwinsdad]

Interesting response, euros and all that rot. I did not say nor did I imply that a cricket riped off the top of its carapace, ocular turbuckle or whatever. I was merely stating that the eye area was where it presumably came from. I mentioned hemoglyph and I followed that I did not want to say hemoglyph but I can tell you if you have ever witnessed a gross rupture, the goo is by no means clear - it was pus colored, almost Boston creme colored for a common reference of color. At any rate, my presumption is that it may have rubbed it off either going under something or perhaps from a short fall from the side of its enclosure - I really did not want to speculate as to how it happened - I was merely trying to convey that it DID happen. I am aware that these guys are virtually blind, but take it from someone who is legally blind - being neraly blind and being totally blind are two different things all together. I know my tarantula and it has always seemed a bit skittish for a red knee, but he is ridiculously jumpy and apparently scared (or seemingly scared). Also, to those who responded on eyes being regenerated after a molt: I can't say that I understand why someone would think that they would have to have a part to regenerate a part - I mean, they LOSE a leg and regenerate the leg. Granted the legs were there, but then again, so were the eyes. Also, I am holding out hope because each molt exuvium that I look at appears to have a set of eyes with it - yes? no? I am only concerned about the potential 'outlook' (no pun intended) for my red knee - Euros, Torontos and all other kidding aside. I am looking for a serious reply to this concern. Thank you and thanks for the feedback in advance.

There goes my donut enjoyment for at least a week