Millipede substrate base : peat, coir, or something else ?

[Zikoko]

When I first started keeping millipedes about a year ago,
I based the substrate on coco-peat (coir) untill I heard it doesn't have any nutritional value
and might be harmful in the long run.

Recently I started basing all my substrate on organic peat (turf), which is also used in paludaria, but now I'm wondering if turf might be too acidic for millipedes..

I've been asking around and reading into the subject,
but I keep getting mixed opinions and recommendations.
The most recent being, that both coir and peat might be harmful to some species
in the long run...

I'm currently keeping A. Gigas, P. Ligulatus, Coromus Diaphorus and M. Parilis Acuticonus.

I'd love to get some insight from long term keepers or experienced breeders on this subject.

Thanks for your time !

 

[XxSpiderQueenxX]

You could use creatures soil... has decaying wood and leaves and twigs mixed in!

 

[ErinM31]

What species are you keeping?

I use the complete millipede substrate from BugsInCyberspace (primarily composted wood and leaves) for most of mine. I mix coir into the substrate for some species and had not heard of it (not peat) being bad for millipedes in general. Only keep in mind that decaying wood and leaves are the most important substrate components for millipedes and other detrivores. Some species have more particular requirements.

 

[BuzzSwole]

I’ve been watching this thread. I just found a ton of wild millipedes and was wonder the leaf littter and rotting wood I found around them would be good enough scattered on top of plantation soil from eco earth would be fine

 

[Zikoko]

You could use creatures soil... has decaying wood and leaves and twigs mixed in!

Thanks I hadn't heard of that before. Just did a quick search but didn't find any sellers of this product in my country yet. I'll look into it some more.

 

[Zikoko]

What species are you keeping?

I use the complete millipede substrate from BugsInCyberspace (primarily composted wood and leaves) for most of mine. I mix coir into the substrate for some species and had not heard of it (not peat) being bad for millipedes in general. Only keep in mind that decaying wood and leaves are the most important substrate components for millipedes and other detrivores. Some species have more particular requirements.

I'm keeping A. gigas, P. Ligulatus pedelings, M. Parilis Acuticonus and C. Diaphorus.
Yeah I understand which nutrients they need, but people often recommend to base the substrate on +-50 % coir.

I've been thinking about just using the humus layer from the forest as a base,
and mix that up with the decaying leaves,wood,moss and calcium.

 

[Marika]

I have always used organic potting soil as a base. I also use it for my snails and roaches.

 

[Zikoko]

I have always used organic potting soil as a base. I also use it for my snails and roaches.

Thanks I've been looking into organic potting soil but I'm not sure about which ingredients it should or shouldn't contain.
Some have cow manure and animal remains in them for instance, is that safe for the millipedes ?
Peat and coir are also often main ingredients.

I'm starting to think that the safest thing to do is just using the humus/compost layer from the forest as a base
and mix that up with more wood, leaves and calcium. Maybe add a little coir for added mass

 

[Marika]

Thanks I've been looking into organic potting soil but I'm not sure about which ingredients it should or shouldn't contain.
Some have cow manure and animal remains in them for instance, is that safe for the millipedes ?
Peat and coir are also often main ingredients.

I'm starting to think that the safest thing to do is just using the humus/compost layer from the forest as a base
and mix that up with more wood, leaves and calcium. Maybe add a little coir for added mass

I haven't noticed any ill effects, although it's the only substrate I've used for my millipedes so I can't really compare it with anything. I did use peat for my snails at first, but it was too acidic and did some damage to their shells. Peat is the main ingredient in the potting soil I'm using, but the pH is 6.5. It contains limestone powder and is fertilized with compost. There is chicken manure in the compost mix, but...I mean, it's composted, not added fresh or anything. Anyway, I've been happy with it. I've used it for millipedes for about 5.5 years now and longer for other inverts.

 

[Vanisher]

I love peat, so i vote that!

 

[Zikoko]

I haven't noticed any ill effects, although it's the only substrate I've used for my millipedes so I can't really compare it with anything. I did use peat for my snails at first, but it was too acidic and did some damage to their shells. Peat is the main ingredient in the potting soil I'm using, but the pH is 6.5. It contains limestone powder and is fertilized with compost. There is chicken manure in the compost mix, but...I mean, it's composted, not added fresh or anything. Anyway, I've been happy with it. I've used it for millipedes for about 5.5 years now and longer for other inverts.

I've just been to the local gardening centre and all the organic potting soil had some added plant-nutrients or pokon in the mix.
Could you please provide the ingredients of the soil you are using just to be safe?

Yeah iirc pure organic peat has a PH value between 3 and 4 and it's located deeper into the earth than where the invertabrates are living.

 

[Marika]

I've just been to the local gardening centre and all the organic potting soil had some added plant-nutrients or pokon in the mix.
Could you please provide the ingredients of the soil you are using just to be safe?

Yeah iirc pure organic peat has a PH value between 3 and 4 and it's located deeper into the earth than where the invertabrates are living.

Dark peat, sand, compost mix (woodchip briquet, chicken manure, crushed bark, light peat), limestone powder with magnesium.

 

[Zikoko]

Dark peat, sand, compost mix (woodchip briquet, chicken manure, crushed bark, light peat), limestone powder with magnesium.

Thanks. The ones I was looking at all had some organic plant-fertilizer added in them which made me hesitate.

Is yours without added fertilizer ?

 

[ErinM31]

I’ve been watching this thread. I just found a ton of wild millipedes and was wonder the leaf littter and rotting wood I found around them would be good enough scattered on top of plantation soil from eco earth would be fine

I think that would be ideal! You may want to freeze the leaves and wood or bake them on low heat to eliminate any pests. I used to bake or freeze everything, but now I only do so if I know there are pests (some wood I’ve collected has contained termites) and just give other materials a visual inspection in case the microflora and fauna from the millipedes’ habitat might be healthier for them.

I'm keeping A. gigas, P. Ligulatus pedelings, M. Parilis Acuticonus and C. Diaphorus.
Yeah I understand which nutrients they need, but people often recommend to base the substrate on +-50 % coir.

I am not familiar with those species; I’ve mostly kept North American species. I know of no reason to use a base other than composting wood and leaves for these millipedes. How would it benefit them to use so much inedible/low nutritive value material? There may be exceptions which do better with less rich substrate; I do mix in about 50% coir and also sand into the substrate for Orthoporus millipedes but I am still trying to find the best set-up for them.

 

[Zikoko]

I think that would be ideal! You may want to freeze the leaves and wood or bake them on low heat to eliminate any pests. I used to bake/freeze everything, but now I only do so if I know there are bests there (some wood I’ve collected has contained termites) and just givebother materials a visual inspection in case k the microflora and fauna from the millipedes’ habitat might be healthier for them.



I am not familiar with those species; I’ve mostly kept North American species. I know of no reason to use a base other than composting wood and leaves for these millipedes. How would it benefit them to use so much inedible/low nutritive value material? There may be exceptions which do better with less rich substrate; I do mix in about 50% coir and also sand into the substrate for Orthoporus millipedes but I am still trying to find the right set-up for them.

I just realized I probably phrased it wrong because the 'base' is considered the nutritious part, coir etc is just a filler.

I've been trying to find shops here in Europe which sell homemade substrate, but so far only found one store, it's located in Belgium.

 

[bhgant]

I just picked up a bag of the Milli Mix from Josh's Frogs. This stuff is great. The only downside is it's pricey but it will be good to use as a reference to make my own in the future.

 

[BuzzSwole]

Ty for the info. Though I found a shelf fungi that the culture of isopods I gathered seem to be obsessed with. Curious how safe that is

 

[ErinM31]

Ty for the info. Though I found a shelf fungi that the culture of isopods I gathered seem to be obsessed with. Curious how safe that is

Some millipedes (such as Brachycybe species) specifically feed on fungi and I would think it quite possible that some isopods would have a similar diet, if not exclusively. If you found the isopods with it, then I would be surprised if it is not safe for them, but I confess that I have no experience in the matter.

 

[ErinM31]

I just realized I probably phrased it wrong because the 'base' is considered the nutritious part, coir etc is just a filler.

I've been trying to find shops here in Europe which sell homemade substrate, but so far only found one store, it's located in Belgium.

I would think that whatever component made up the majority of the substrate would be considered it’s base, no? I am only wondering whether +/-50% filler is best for the species you’re keeping. The millipedes that I’ve had do very well have been in highly nutritive substrate, mostly decaying wood, which in time was all turned into frass pellets.

 

[marionimacaroni]

I have a flame leg millipede at home which I just rescued. I live in a condo unit and don't have access to good soil. There's only a plant market nearby and I ended up with vermicast/worm casting for a temporary substrate mixed with some dried leaves, until I can get a proper one.

Is it going to be safe for the millipede for at least 1 week?