Latrodectus sp. found in Ontario, Canada. Need Id

[Snakeman4life]

Hi guys,

So L. variolus is a native species here in Ontario. They have scattered populations throughout southern Ontario. I reside in Kingston, Ontario and received a prime example of L. variolus several months ago. This female has the distinct broken hourglass and spotting up the dorsal side of the abdomen.

Today I received a very large gravid female, found a bit further north in around Verona. This spider was found under a deck behind a large box and had a massive web with two eggsacs. The owner of the house contacted me and brought it to me. This spider has a full hourglass.

Now all my research I have done says that L. mactans and L. hesperus have full hourglasses and I have kept both in captivity but what I am wondering is can some populations of L. variolus have complete hourglasses? I know L. mactans comes up in stowaway sometimes but just wanted your opinions on what you think it may be.

 

[Venom1080]

How far do they extend south?

 

[Snakeman4life]

How far do they extend south?

What species are you referring to?

 

[Venom1080]

What species are you referring to?

Just Lactrodectus in general.

 

[Snakeman4life]

Just Lactrodectus in general.

Do you mean how far north they occur? Ontario is the northern part of the range. Latrodectus range all throughout the U.S all the way down to South America.

 

[Richard McJimsey]

Purely based on range, and no other photos, probably variolus. Any photos from above?

 

[Venom1080]

Do you mean how far north they occur? Ontario is the northern part of the range. Latrodectus range all throughout the U.S all the way down to South America.

Just curious as I've never seen any where I am. (Windsor area)

 

[Sergic]

Just curious as I've never seen any where I am. (Windsor area)

I dont know about your area, but L. variolus has recently been found in Wisconsin. http://www.fox21online.com/2017/06/14/wisconsin-couple-finds-black-widow-property/

I also saw one in person at Peninsula State Park, which is about 50 miles NE of Green Bay. It was found by a maintenance worker at the park, who put it in a container and gave it to the nature center to display. It had the characteristic dorsal markings of variolus, so I'm confident about the ID.

Finally, I was told by a labmate that there is a breeding population of variolus in the area around Green Bay, but I can't find the article he referred to to confirm.

 

[spotropaicsav]

Hi guys,

So L. variolus is a native species here in Ontario. They have scattered populations throughout southern Ontario. I reside in Kingston, Ontario and received a prime example of L. variolus several months ago. This female has the distinct broken hourglass and spotting up the dorsal side of the abdomen.

Today I received a very large gravid female, found a bit further north in around Verona. This spider was found under a deck behind a large box and had a massive web with two eggsacs. The owner of the house contacted me and brought it to me. This spider has a full hourglass.

View attachment 247333 Now all my research I have done says that L. mactans and L. hesperus have full hourglasses and I have kept both in captivity but what I am wondering is can some populations of L. variolus have complete hourglasses? I know L. mactans comes up in stowaway sometimes but just wanted your opinions on what you think it may be.

This specimen looks about ready to burst, this one has no spotting up the dorsal side of the abdomen?

 

[Snakeman4life]

This specimen looks about ready to burst, this one has no spotting up the dorsal side of the abdomen?

Yes. She is definitely gravid, she had two eggsacs in her web. There is no spotting on the dorsal, she looks very much like L. mactans or L. hesperus but not sure how that is possible.

 

[Snakeman4life]

I dont know about your area, but L. variolus has recently been found in Wisconsin. http://www.fox21online.com/2017/06/14/wisconsin-couple-finds-black-widow-property/

I also saw one in person at Peninsula State Park, which is about 50 miles NE of Green Bay. It was found by a maintenance worker at the park, who put it in a container and gave it to the nature center to display. It had the characteristic dorsal markings of variolus, so I'm confident about the ID.

Finally, I was told by a labmate that there is a breeding population of variolus in the area around Green Bay, but I can't find the article he referred to to confirm.

Yes I am much further north in Ontario. L variolus is a definitely a native species as they have been found in my area. This specimen however has no dorsal spotting and a complete hourglass.

 

[Snakeman4life]

Just curious as I've never seen any where I am. (Windsor area)

I have heard of them occurring in Sarnia.

 

[Richard McJimsey]

100% not mactans, and I agree it looks a lot like hesperus, but that's very far east for them to be found.

 

[Venom1080]

I have heard of them occurring in Sarnia.

I'm still further south.

 

[Widowman10]

Could you post a few good pictures of the eggsac? That might help as hesperus and variolus have fairly different eggsacs both in shape and color.

Also: pictures of the slings might be helpful as well. Variolus differ from mactans in both patterning and color (not that I think it's a mactans, mind you).

 

[Snakeman4life]

Could you post a few good pictures of the eggsac? That might help as hesperus and variolus have fairly different eggsacs both in shape and color.

Also: pictures of the slings might be helpful as well. Variolus differ from mactans in both patterning and color (not that I think it's a mactans, mind you).

Egg sacs were unfortunately destroyed by the owner of the house but she is clearly due to pop out more soon. I will take pics of any egg sacs she lays in my care.