Known Genetic Issues

[iPocalyspe]

I am looking to find any known genetic disorders for tarantulas.

Recently a friend and I were talking about tarantula gene pools and we were trying to figure out if inbreeding(intentional or otherwise) has a negative impact on the gene pool. I figured that in the wild Ts breeding with sac mates would occur every so often, and inbreeding increases the chances of genetic disorders occurring(recessive genes become common). So are they any solely genetic disorders in Ts? I have heard of DKS and have heard there are possible genetic and environmental factors that cause these symptoms.

 

[Mjb30]

A great question that I would certainly love to hear opinions on. I was thinking the same thing the other day!

 

[viper69]

There are no known studies I'm aware of on this subject. 99.9% of the research dollars on arachnids are in 2 areas, taxonomy and venom research.

Inbreeding is never a good thing.

 

[Mjb30]

Inbreeding is never a good thing.

When breeding Ts is potential interbreeding actively avoided?

 

[viper69]

When breeding Ts is potential interbreeding actively avoided?

Interbreeding? as in hybrids with another species?? That's WRONG on so many levels.

W/out discussing why, use google to search AB on hybrid discussions. This has been discussed more times than I care to count, and the reasons are logical and common sense. I don't have the time to explain it, someone else will.

In short- No one wants FrankenTs in the hobby.

 

[Mjb30]

Interbreeding? as in hybrids with another species?? That's WRONG on so many levels.

Sorry, I meant inbreeding (with immediate or close relations)

 

[viper69]

Interbreeding? as in hybrids with another species?? That's WRONG on so many levels.

Sorry, I meant inbreeding (with immediate or close relations)

Never a good thing.

 

[Mjb30]

W/out discussing why, use google to search AB on hybrid discussions. This has been discussed more times than I care to count, and the reasons are logical and common sense. I don't have the time to explain it, someone else will.

In short- No one wants FrankenTs in the hobby.

Never a good thing.

I know it’s not a good thing which is why I asked it was actively avoided by breeders; that’s all.

I’ll have look back and see what discussions I can find.

 

[McSP1D8R]

A lot of rarer species that become available in hobby are made available through inbreeding with sac mates/parents. I have been informed from a few sources that Theraphosa blondi are so difficult to breed successfully, its almost the only way to insure the pair are genetically compatable. Not 100% sure but could be that the Theraphosidae have a more simple genome compared to mammals and such ruling out damaging mutations building up

 

[viper69]

I know it’s not a good thing which is why I asked it was actively avoided by breeders; that’s all.

I’ll have look back and see what discussions I can find.

Some breeders do avoid, but there are some who don't. Some admit to it, some don't etc

 

[viper69]

only way to insure the pair are genetically compatable.

What do you mean by this??

 

[iPocalyspe]

Are there any genetic issues that inbreeding has on Ts. I mean in humans there are many diseases and mental issues that occur but I don't think there are genetic issues present in Ts. Inbreeding can occur accidentally, people will buy pairs of Ts and who knows what sac they came from.

 

[McSP1D8R]

What do you mean by this??

Getting 2 "definite" French Guiana locale specimens isnt always going to be a dead cert that you will get viable offspring, possibly the cause isnt the keeper's shortcomings in providing correct husbandry but the animals being genetically incompatible..

 

[McSP1D8R]

Are there any genetic issues that inbreeding has on Ts. I mean in humans there are many diseases and mental issues that occur but I don't think there are genetic issues present in Ts. Inbreeding can occur accidentally, people will buy pairs of Ts and who knows what sac they came from.

You can rest assured a lot of available specimens in captivity will have an inbreed of some description in their lineage at one stage or another. I myself had a Psalmopoeus irminia mature male that was born with 1 pedipalp and out of morbid curiosity I bred him to see if it was perhaps recessive, but all his offspring had the full set of legs and appendages in tact.

 

[iPocalyspe]

You can rest assured a lot of available specimens in captivity will have an inbreed of some description in their lineage at one stage or another. I myself had a Psalmopoeus irminia mature male that was born with 1 pedipalp and out of morbid curiosity I bred him to see if it was perhaps recessive, but all his offspring had the full set of legs and appendages in tact.

I suppose all species are inbreed to an extent, like all humans are related to each other. Possibly 30th cousins or so but it works out. Although inbreeding isn't ideal for any species it won't destroy it, at least given that generation after generation isn't inbred

 

[viper69]

genetically incompatible

Again I don't understand what you mean. If two specimens are the same locality and that's known for a definite fact, as in you collected them, they are compatible for breeding, nothing more. I'm not sure what you are talking about?

 

[iPocalyspe]

Different species can breed. Like polar bears and grizzly bears. Hybrids are a totally different issue, the issue with them is that it ruins the genetic purity of both species. We this the with B. Albopilosum "hobby form" how they are only 98% similar to wild "pure" B. Albopilosum. Someone may have purposely or mistakenly bred a B. Albopilosum with a different Brachypelma sp. Some people ask why is it ok to have "mutt" dogs who are multiple dog breeds, but all dogs are the same species while Tarantulas have many different species and genre. Going back to dogs and inbreeding, pure bred dogs are mostly inbred. They suffer from severe genetic deformities which is why most have bone issues and genetic diseases. With Tarantulas unless genetic issues are apparent there doesn't appear to be any issue with inbreeding, 1 possibility is that Tarantulas don't suffer any genetic diseases and the other possibility is that there simply hasn't been enough inbreeding for any harmful genes to take over.

 

[Draketeeth]

Inbreeding is difficult to avoid because there's no lineage records kept on Tarantulas as far as I know. People get two of a species, pair them, and out go the offspring. Where it gets complicated is that a batch can go to one seller, a batch go to another, so a buyer thinks they're getting two from different sources, but they're really from the same sac.

I am looking to find any known genetic disorders for tarantulas.

As you're researching around, one thing I've always wondered is if certain species are more prone to cysts than others. If such a thing seems to occur, is it on species that have started in the hobby with a smaller breeding pool than something more common in the hobby with more wild collected individuals?

 

[iPocalyspe]

Inbreeding is difficult to avoid because there's no lineage records kept on Tarantulas as far as I know. People get two of a species, pair them, and out go the offspring. Where it gets complicated is that a batch can go to one seller, a batch go to another, so a buyer thinks they're getting two from different sources, but they're really from the same sac.



As you're researching around, one thing I've always wondered is if certain species are more prone to cysts than others. If such a thing seems to occur, is it on species that have started in the hobby with a smaller breeding pool than something more common in the hobby with more wild collected individuals?

And if there was a species that had genetic deformities we'd either have to bring wild caught Ts for breeding purposes (which is one reason why not all wild caught are bad, but I suppose that discussion is for a different day haha) or if that is not possible we either have to let the species become fully genetically deformed or make it into a hybrid in hopes of "curing" the genetic disorders. It definitely would mess up the species but it would be better than losing it all together. I mean even in humans there are very few, if any, people who are 100% Homo Sapian. I may have the stat wrong but I believe that roughly the average person has 4% Neanderthal DNA.

 

[Draketeeth]

And if there was a species that had genetic deformities we'd either have to bring wild caught Ts for breeding purposes (which is one reason why not all wild caught are bad, but I suppose that discussion is for a different day haha) or if that is not possible we either have to let the species become fully genetically deformed or make it into a hybrid in hopes of "curing" the genetic disorders. It definitely would mess up the species but it would be better than losing it all together.

Hybridization may not be the end all answer to that. Bringing in a limited number of wild individuals to help "refresh" the bloodlines would be a workable solution if it was done well, but getting those breeders to the people who would do the most good with them would be tricky to pick. Or, very strict breeding and culling standards keeping only the most true to form and vigorous individuals. The culling method would be quite difficult given how long some species live, but doable for the dedicated.