Is this a good way of transferring nutrients?

[Bryan91901]

I've been trying to search this on the boards but can't seem to find anything related. If I gutload verts to feed my adult T.Blondi will he get sufficient nutrition from them? I dont want to buy adult crickets anymore because I find it a hassle to only throw in a few when the T's hungry, and then have the rest in a critter cage while they make that damn noise all night long. So i figured if I just feed him an adult mouse every week which has been preloaded with ummm hamster food or something, i don't know, will that be a sufficient source of nutrients for the Blondi? And if this method works what should I preload the mice with, any suggestions?:?

 

[Talkenlate04]

where to begin.

Feeding mice on a regular basis, just to let you know that seems to be something that is suspected for causing things like fangs breaking from being to brittle from to much calcium..........

That being said I feed my T's a tree frog every now and then, but you have to vary their diet to keep them healthy.
Thats all I am going to touch on because I am sure there is going to be tons more to follow.

 

[Whiskeypunk]

another user (Soulsick) uses crickets, dogfood and a variety of other stuff to gutload his mice. Try PMing him.

A thread on the calcium debate.

 

[Thoth]

There is some anectdotal evidence and a source of debate that feeding you ts a diet of vertebrates will cause serious health issues namely the loss of the fangs, because of the high calcium nature of such a diet. Also all meat diets have been implicated with various other health issues. Occasional mouse or lizard now and then is fine but a steady.

Most people will suggest switching to roaches.

 

[Bryan91901]

Yeah i've read the whole fang falling off issue but there is no hard scientific evidience backing that up, so please refrain from that argument. All I want to know is if gutloading mice would be an effective way to transfer nutrients.

 

[Bryan91901]

Also i dont know if i want to have roaches at my house.... my parents are already giving me a hard time with scorpions and this new T i just got...

 

[Spiderface]

I don't personally feed verts to my T's anymore but I would say aside from the big calcium debate, a healthy well fed mouse would be a good source of nutrients. I don't know if it is a balanced diet for a tarantula but the nutrients would be present.

 

[Thoth]

Chances are its not necessary to gutload mice, its not necessary to gut load them when feeding them to herps. Then again not much is known about t metabolism.

 

[Bryan91901]

powerfed mice it is.. I don't believe in anectdotal debate, thats just ridiculous. Anectdotal is defined as: "Based on casual observations or indications rather than rigorous or scientific analysis." Now if we all based our invert care practices on that then by golly I could say my scorpion will live shorter when I play Yo MTV raps since he hides in his little burrow.. ;P

 

[scottyk]

A suggestion from my studio apartment dwelling days.......

Only the fully adult crix make a lot of noise. You can buy 3/4 grown ones, and they won't drive you crazy all night.

 

[Thoth]

Though there is a lot of hard evidence to the drawbacks of powerfeeding. The calcium debate needs more study. In my professional world anecdotal evidence is any non-publishbed data, though it may be derived from rigorous scientific study.

Ultimately you're free to do what you will.

 

[Bryan91901]

A suggestion from my studio apartment dwelling days.......

Only the fully adult crix make a lot of noise. You can buy 3/4 grown ones, and they won't drive you crazy all night.

The place I have doesn't carry so called "medium sized ones" ... only smalls and large! As far as powerfeeding goes, someone with years of experience (10+) with many many many Blondi's tells me that they have no problems at all... Nevertheless thanks everyone for the insight!

 

[metallica2501]

Though there is a lot of hard evidence to the drawbacks of powerfeeding. The calcium debate needs more study. In my professional world anecdotal evidence is any non-publishbed data, though it may be derived from rigorous scientific study.

Ultimately you're free to do what you will.

I completly agree with thoth,

the best thing that u can do is feed ur t's insects that u now come from a reliable source and that are well kept and maintained. if the insects themselves are healthy they posses the necessary nutrients that are reguired by the t. another way to ensure a nutritious diet is to feed a variety of insects. ex superworms crics and roaches collectivly they probably cover all ur t's needs.

as far as feeding mice to a blondi there have been many posts on this forum stating than when the blondi ate the mouse it cracked a fang. another concern is that warm blooded mammals can carry parasites that may be mortal to a t. thats my two cents

 

[Whiskeypunk]

as far as feeding mice to a blondi there have been many posts on this forum stating than when the blondi ate the mouse it cracked a fang.

no.

Tarantulas can and have chewed through metal cage screen covers. A tarantula is not going to break a fang biting a mouse. Tarantulas in nature defend themselves quite well from mice and rodents. See pages 145 and 146 of the Tarantula Keepers Guide.

The breaking of a fang does NOT happen due to feeding mice. The debate is that too much calcium from the mouse's bones MAY block other minerals necessary for the fangs to form. SO when the tarantula molts, it molts without fangs. Thus fang loss. Now, I'd love someone to cite an actual source on this, besides previous debates on AB, or some guy gave a speech at some conference about this hypothesis, and was attempting to test it.

BTW, anyone know if that guy ever got the molts examined for mineral composition? I remember this was supposed to be done a while back.

another concern is that warm blooded mammals can carry parasites that may be mortal to a t. thats my two cents

Cite sources. Now, a mouse food bolus left unnatended for too long may attract bacteria or mites that could be harmful for a T. But so can roach boluses or cricket boluses.

 

[secretstash187]

I completly agree with thoth,

the best thing that u can do is feed ur t's insects that u now come from a reliable source and that are well kept and maintained. if the insects themselves are healthy they posses the necessary nutrients that are reguired by the t. another way to ensure a nutritious diet is to feed a variety of insects. ex superworms crics and roaches collectivly they probably cover all ur t's needs.

as far as feeding mice to a blondi there have been many posts on this forum stating than when the blondi ate the mouse it cracked a fang. another concern is that warm blooded mammals can carry parasites that may be mortal to a t. thats my two cents

I am going to say that I disagree with this statement completely.. Who are we to determine that insects are "the best thing" to feed our Blondi's. Do we really know that? If an adult Blondi is capable enough to subdue larger prey being mice or whatever then it shouldn't be a problem. As far as in the wild they live in the rainforests, where they eat insects, lizards, snakes, and any other possible small prey it can subdue INCLUDING verts and small rodents also. Therefore meaning that a diet strictly of crickets and roaches is NOT the best thing to do, BUT simply what some people are more comfortable with feeding their tarantulas. And the whole calcium debate is not a sufficient argument to use because there is no HARD SCIENTIFIC RESEARCH citing proof that calcium will lead to the loss of fangs during molts. If someone can link me this please do as I am tired of hearing about a simple conference and speculation from a few assumptions. Please cite credible resources when stating an argument, thats all.

 

[metzgerzoo]

I just love it when people ask a question then don't want an answer.
If the invert hobby was so widely excepted and endorsed as the keeping of other "exotic" animals is, then there *would* be "published scientific studies" of a million different things. *If* you *really* want to know what is *best* and *healthiest* for your spider and *if* you *really* care about giving your spider a healthy, balanced diet then you *would* care about the debates and would not take a 12 year old, whaa whaa, deaf ear attitude.
The feeding of vertebrate prey as a *staple* diet is frowned upon for reasons. No, those reasons have not been published in the veterinary journals but they have been "observed", "studied" and "researched" by those who know tarantulas the best....us....the ones who keep them.
You're going to do as you will and don't want to hear what others have to say...this thread was a waste of time.

 

[Whiskeypunk]

I just love it when people ask a question then don't want an answer.
If the invert hobby was so widely excepted and endorsed as the keeping of other "exotic" animals is, then there *would* be "published scientific studies" of a million different things. *If* you *really* want to know what is *best* and *healthiest* for your spider and *if* you *really* care about giving your spider a healthy, balanced diet then you *would* care about the debates and would not take a 12 year old, whaa whaa, deaf ear attitude.
The feeding of vertebrate prey as a *staple* diet is frowned upon for reasons. No, those reasons have not been published in the veterinary journals but they have been "observed", "studied" and "researched" by those who know tarantulas the best....us....the ones who keep them.
You're going to do as you will and don't want to hear what others have to say...this thread was a waste of time.

well there are at least 2 users (Soulsick and BLS Blondi) who have kept in excess of 20 T. Blondi for multiple years. These users feed mice, especially when the T is full grown, and haven't seen problems. There is also this post. This is why I want to see what the research says.

 

[secretstash187]

I just love it when people ask a question then don't want an answer.
If the invert hobby was so widely excepted and endorsed as the keeping of other "exotic" animals is, then there *would* be "published scientific studies" of a million different things. *If* you *really* want to know what is *best* and *healthiest* for your spider and *if* you *really* care about giving your spider a healthy, balanced diet then you *would* care about the debates and would not take a 12 year old, whaa whaa, deaf ear attitude.
The feeding of vertebrate prey as a *staple* diet is frowned upon for reasons. No, those reasons have not been published in the veterinary journals but they have been "observed", "studied" and "researched" by those who know tarantulas the best....us....the ones who keep them.
You're going to do as you will and don't want to hear what others have to say...this thread was a waste of time.

It seems as if your the one with a deaf ear attitude. Maybe he is choosing to do what others on this board have been doing like the above poster said about those two EXPERIENCED Blondi keepers who have had no problems with feeding verts to T's. Not everyone has the same practices as you do, be more open minded and grow up.

 

[secretstash187]

And besides Metzgerzoo, his question wasn't about a calcium debate or if feeding verts is good...If you would take the time to read the first post he asked IF GUTLOADING mice for feeding would transfer nutrients... get it right please