Euathlus pulcherrimaklaasi care sheet?

[bliss]

Keep in mind that many of Rick's photo's are not taken in the wild, but at his home.

Eric

what's up eric,

wow, i never knew they were out of his own home. interesting.

so now we do have the real one in the hobby, that's pretty cool

dan

 

[GoTerps]

wow, i never knew they were out of his own home. interesting.

Some of them are, yes

so now we do have the real one in the hobby, that's pretty cool

LOL, well, I didn't actually say that. Here's a few points to ponder, knowing that the current WC stock is being collected in Northern Chile.

If the same species can be found in Ecuador and Chile, why did none of them show up in the buttload of exports from Peru over the years?

Could this species be something different than what Schmidt described as E. pulcherrimaklaasi? Sure, someone would need to compare it to the type. This is why I would sell it as sp. "pulcherrimaklaasi" (why not? until you know for sure)... and certainly wouldn't be selling different "forms" of the same species at this point. I don't even want to get started on all the other "species" that are popping up from the Chile guys... flame, purple, yellow, violet bonfire. I will give myself an aneurysm if I get wound up on that topic.


Was the spider Schmidt described really from Ecuador? (I have the description, but am not at home right now to look at it to see if it mentions where he obtained the specimens).

Eric

 

[Brian S]

As for care for the sp (whatever it really is) coming from Northern Chile, I would say to keep it very dry like a GBB. I have been into extreme Southern Peru almost to Chile and that is the driest place I have ever seen! Not even a cactus will grow coz its so dry. Even once you get up a little ways into the Andes Mtns it is still just pretty darn dry although there is a little more vegetation. I know I am speaking from Southern Peru but I highly doubt that Northern Chile will be much different at all

 

[Brian S]

This may help for the spider coming out of Northern Chile. This is what the habitat looks like next to the coast in Southern Peru


Now up in the mountains it is a little more lush but still it is pretty dry. The only reason you see trees is that there is a small stream coming out of the mtns. I would about be willing to bet that the Chilean sp lives in a habitat like one of these pics. So this might help

 

[M.F.Bagaturov]

Hello Brian!

Thanks for pics!
The first one is looking like the Pochakamack I was near Lima - the real oceanic desert. But I found no any spider around the territory.

 

[Brian S]

Hi Mikhail,
Actually there is very little living in that oceanic desert except around human habitat. Humans dont even live there unless there is a small stream coming out of the mountains. It just doesnt rain there!
On a side note, the only tarantula I have ever found down there was under trash along the road and not under the many rocks!
The pics are located about 1-2 hours North of the Chilean border so as I said earlier, there is a really good chance that the Chilean habitat looks almost identicle to that in Peru

 

[jbrd]

And I thought Texas, New Mexico and Arizona was bad when I was out there.
Just goes to show you how resilient a Tarantula can be.

 

[jojobear]

Well all of this is about as clear as mud; I just got a two T's given to me tonight and one of them is labeled Euathlus pulcherrimuklaasi "Metallic Femur Blue". The guy that gave them to me gave me another spider that was labeled Aphnopelma sp "Metallic Femur Green" definately doesn't look like any Aphno I have ever see looks more like the one labeled Euathlus pulcherrimuklaasi but definately green highlight where the other one has blue highlights. Any suggestions?

 

[M.F.Bagaturov]

All this bull... names are pure unid'ed tarantulas!
The delaer who named his spiders from Chile and distribute them under such names around the world knows nothing about the identification of tarantulas (but he really think he knews ;()
That's all that "names"... nothing...
How do man known anything about tarantula taxonomy can label this theraphosine tarantula as Olygoxistre sp which belongs to totally different subfamily:
http://www.chilearacnidos.com/OligoxistreSpHembra.htm
It is definately another one Paraphysa sp.
All his proven ID'ed G. porteri, E. trunculentus etc are in fact as I told 99% wrongly ID'ed ;(
Follow my advice. You have only 2 ways - 1. sit and wait till someone officially ID'ed these and publish the appropriate data. or 2. find person like Eric (GoTerps) or anyone else close to You with the knowledge in theraphosid taxonomy and kindly ask for the identification of your tarantulas!

THere're no other way, believe me.

 

[Fossa]

Dragging up an old post here...has there actually been any concrete id on the Euathlus pulcherrimaklaasi? I have seen recently the spider shop selling WC juveniles stating they are found in a specific region of Chile close to the coast while the "green femur" were found further inland. Either way i'm not particularly keen on buying wild caught but if anyone could point me in the direction of CB slings I would be very tempted...especially if they are "true" Pichidangui Blue Beauty/Blue Femur.

 

[sjl197]

Just forget the name pulcherrimaklaasi..., and note that nowadays the spidershop sells as Euathlus sp blue.
If you would reread what the spidershop blurb says, it says the blue-femur one is found in the area around Pichidangui, while the green-femur has a much larger range on both Northern and Southern sides.

Yes, these are '"true" Pichidangui Blue Beauty/Blue Femur', whatever the heck use a name like that is.

No, they are not the same as Euathlus/Paraphysa pulcherrimaklaasi, if you want to see one of those, get a copy of the book by Klaas (1989) that shows a picture of what was in the hobby then as Ephebopus violaceus, which Schmidt 1991 refers to in the original description when he names the species after Klaas (though he says its on p98 when its actually p88, thats classic Schmidt not being peer reviewed for you...). The real species is indeed from Ecuador, not Chile.

IMO, these species are terrible ones for the hobby. They dont adapt well to captivity, and many die. I have seen almost no captive breeding, and the few eggsacs seem to come from WC eggsacs, or from WC mothers that birth in captivity. Then replaced by more WC imports, which i have seen nothing to suggest is sustainable.

 

[Storm76]

Just forget the name pulcherrimaklaasi..., and note that nowadays the spidershop sells as Euathlus sp blue.
If you would reread what the spidershop blurb says, it says the blue-femur one is found in the area around Pichidangui, while the green-femur has a much larger range on both Northern and Southern sides.

Yes, these are '"true" Pichidangui Blue Beauty/Blue Femur', whatever the heck use a name like that is.

No, they are not the same as Euathlus/Paraphysa pulcherrimaklaasi, if you want to see one of those, get a copy of the book by Klaas (1989) that shows a picture of what was in the hobby then as Ephebopus violaceus, which Schmidt 1991 refers to in the original description when he names the species after Klaas (though he says its on p98 when its actually p88, thats classic Schmidt not being peer reviewed for you...). The real species is indeed from Ecuador, not Chile.

I did quite some research on these over the course of this year in order to acquire one of these beauties. One thing, that I stumbled upon, was the fact that a certain person you mentioned on here was heavily discussed about his IDying of this species (if need be, I can provide a link to this subject, but have to look it up again first - PM me in case). I went further on and asked around, writing PMs to some knowledable people myself to get some more answers. One of them was Steven Nunn who pointed me into the direction of Dr. Bertani - who most likely would be the only person able to shed light on this really. So I went to write to this person, but the problem here is that the good Dr. obviously has very limited time and doesn't answer to mails from some hobbyist seeking info on a certain species. Bad luck - but understandable!

IMO, these species are terrible ones for the hobby. They dont adapt well to captivity, and many die. I have seen almost no captive breeding, and the few eggsacs seem to come from WC eggsacs, or from WC mothers that birth in captivity. Then replaced by more WC imports, which i have seen nothing to suggest is sustainable.

Terriböe for the hobby? I don't see why - they are generally curious, docile, extremely colorful terrestrials that are a joy to keep. It's true, that most of these originally imported have already died out in the hobby (in Europe), but certain people are still breeding them - though with very few success. The next huge problem (at least over here in Germany, maybe Europe even) is the fact, that a HUGE amount of people seem to be selling other species as the Euathlus pulcherrimaklaasi (or whatever you want to call them) - namingly Homoeomma sp. "blue" (Peru 1 or Peru 2 both are sold as those) and / or even Thrixopelma cyaneolum / lagunas. I wonder if due to this, that species might even got hybridized unknowingly by some people? Funnily enough is there are quite SOME differences between these species that even an amateur like I am can see with the naked eye - if done some research before! The spermathecae of the Euathlus even looks quite different!

Anyways, I'm aware of the statement on the spidershop.uk webpage and I'm not really sure what to think about it really...

Additionally, there are quite some people that breed these out there, though they are rare (Levi being one of them, I believe) - you'd have to ask them, but I think Spidershop-WSF did breed them, too? (Not sure if it was successfull, but the user fraxinus is registered on here, too)


Some links I found to be interesting regarding the subject:

1) This one suggests there were spiders imported from CHILE nearly identical to those described by Schmidt, 1991 from Ecuador: CLICK

2) Spiderfactory-WSF (tried / successful?) breeding these: CLICK

3) Read this one regarding the confusion with the species sold as E. pulcherrimaklaasi: CLICK

4) Breeding story (US): CLICK

5) Another successfull breeding: CLICK


Bottom line - it's hard to acquire the "real" ones, due to the fact that mostly other species are sold with their name wrongly. But I really don't see any reason why anyone would say they are a "terrible species" for the hobby? I'd always go for CB spiders and not WC anyways...


EDIT: Here's a pic of my female


This is what is often sold as them, but is in fact Homoeomma sp. "blue"

Sling


Adult female (picture courtesy of H. Manstein)

 

[RabidWombat]

You can get captive bred Eulathus sp "blue" from Joey Mugleston. I bought a sling from him about 3 months ago. Great little guy that's really active. Here's his link. As of 9/21 it looks like he still has some.

http://www.facebook.com/notes/j-mug...d-pricelist-21-september-2012/316862981746195

 

[sjl197]

Thanks for the great Info and the links.

Glad to see there was more successful captive breedings that i had realised, i'm just concerned in some cases are from wild-mated females, so captive born. However some of the examples are clearly mated in captivity and bred, so that's great.

My comments on 'terrible ones for the hobby' are based on my own poor experiences trying to captive breed these, and word-of-mouth reports of many others failures, plus hearing about so many of these WC dying in captivity, often not long after bought/traded.

Yes, you are right Storm76 of several species being sold as Euathlus pulcherrimaklaasi over the years, i've kept at least 3 likely different species that had been sold under that name, none of which look like the image in Klaas 1993 book.

Regarding the naming issue, i understand the argument given by the link 1), and i maintain my views that this Chilian species sold in the hobby is not E.pulcherrimaklaasi (i gladly will discuss this with them directly). Yet, thankyou for alerting me to that. This issue now needs published studies (preferably in peer reviewed journals) to resolve properly with official changes to nomenclature, but in the interim i am happy to hear people adopting the 'working name' for this as Euathlus sp 'blue' or 'blue-femur'.

FYI. It seem to me (and several others people who have well informed views i trust) that those various hobby Homoeomma's seemingly arn't Homoeomma, but that's another can-of-worms.

Yes, Dr Bertani is a great authority to consult, shame you did not get any reply. I also direct you to Dr. Fernando Perez-Miles in Uruguay, who i think maybe more upto date on the Southern ranging genera (Euathlus,Grammostola,etc), who has students working on these genera in Argentina and Chile.

 

[Storm76]

Thanks for the great Info and the links.

Anytime, glad it was of help

Glad to see there was more successful captive breedings that i had realised, i'm just concerned in some cases are from wild-mated females, so captive born. However some of the examples are clearly mated in captivity and bred, so that's great.

My comments on 'terrible ones for the hobby' are based on my own poor experiences trying to captive breed these, and word-of-mouth reports of many others failures, plus hearing about so many of these WC dying in captivity, often not long after bought/traded.

Well, no one can keep track of every species out there, but as far as I'm aware, these are still quite rare out there. Not many keep them and way less breed them sadly. Partly because of the problem of acquiring the opposite sex of the -correct - T, I figure. I'm having a hard time seeing ANY of the pulcherrimaklaasi (just gonna call them that for now) being sold really. And as mentioned before, spidershop.uk only seems to sell WC animals. Considering these can get to 5.5"- 6" and my female is only 4-4.5" so far, I'm at least waiting for one more molt.

My comments on 'terrible ones for the hobby' are based on my own poor experiences trying to captive breed these, and word-of-mouth reports of many others failures, plus hearing about so many of these WC dying in captivity, often not long after bought/traded.

Understood, was just a bit disappointed that someone would call them "terrible for the hobby" - I do really love this species. It's probably the most colorful terrestrial in the hobby (in terms of amount of different colors) - IMO.

Yes, you are right Storm76 of several species being sold as Euathlus pulcherrimaklaasi over the years, i've kept at least 3 likely different species that had been sold under that name, none of which look like the image in Klaas 1993 book.

Mainly it's those Homoeomma sp. "blue" (and both forms get actually sold as E. pulcherrimklaasi - Peru 1 or 2 doesn't matter...) I wouldn't be surprised if these species would've been hybridized even within the last years. I've also read/heard of cases in which Thrixopelma cyaneloum / lagunas were sold as Euahlus pulcherrimaklaasi even. But no one can tell and since I haven't been able to find ANY scientific paper on these species it's hard to ID them 100%.

Regarding the naming issue, i understand the argument given by the link 1), and i maintain my views that this Chilian species sold in the hobby is not E.pulcherrimaklaasi (i gladly will discuss this with them directly). Yet, thankyou for alerting me to that. This issue now needs published studies (preferably in peer reviewed journals) to resolve properly with official changes to nomenclature, but in the interim i am happy to hear people adopting the 'working name' for this as Euathlus sp 'blue' or 'blue-femur'.

Totally agreed - but this will take time and until then, people will still be confused about these. For example - if check on the pic of the one being said to be from Chile, they have reddish looking hairs around the carapace and on the joints of the legs. It might be nothing, it might be a color form, it might be one key to ID - I can't tell. But at least my female doesn't have one bit of red on her except for her flames on her knees

FYI. It seem to me (and several others people who have well informed views i trust) that those various hobby Homoeomma's seemingly arn't Homoeomma, but that's another can-of-worms.

I've heard of possible Lasiodorides spp. maybe? Can't tell.

Yes, Dr Bertani is a great authority to consult, shame you did not get any reply. I also direct you to Dr. Fernando Perez-Miles in Uruguay, who i think maybe more upto date on the Southern ranging genera (Euathlus,Grammostola,etc), who has students working on these genera in Argentina and Chile.

I'd be happy if you could PM me a valid Email where to contact Dr. Perez-Miles maybe? Would like to try and contact him on this subject.

 

[paassatt]

FYI. It seem to me (and several others people who have well informed views i trust) that those various hobby Homoeomma's seemingly arn't Homoeomma, but that's another can-of-worms.

Care to open up that can of worms and elaborate further? I'm curious to know what you mean.

 

[c.h.esteban]

I've heard of possible Lasiodorides spp. maybe? Can't tell.

if it true, it would be a little sensation - the first Lasiodorides without UH type I.


bye

 

[Brachypelmo]

Found this at my LPS labled "Unknown" Is it a Euathlus?

I just added this here because this thread is about Euathlus Sp. please feel free to move if it should be be in another place.

 

[Storm76]

View attachment 117874 I just added this here because this thread is about Euathlus Sp. please feel free to move if it should be be in another place.

Not too sure this is an Euathlus spp. but since pictures can be deceiving - can you take one from atop the T showing it completely? I'd be especially interested in seing any mirror patch and the coloration overall.

 

[Brachypelmo]

Here's a few more photos

Hopefully these are a little more helpful.