Black Widow!

[Arianji]

Well the title describes the situation. I found a black widow spider today. It is a particularly beautiful individual with the red hour glass but also 4 red dots that run along the dorsal region of it's abdomen, I've never seen an specimen with that color pattern before, so I don't know if its a subspecies or individual trait. Regardless I found this individual outside the dorm of the college I go to, and knowing the fate of black widows in a highly populated area I captured it. I don't really believe in keeping wild caught animals, but this spider is too beautiful and misunderstood for me to release it back on campus. So now comes the questions:

1. What do I keep it in? (currently it is in a very large kritter keeper (for its size) with cocofiber bedding and naturally found sticks for web formation.)

2. How do I sex it? its not a very large individual roughly the size of a penny with its legs sprawled, but its coloration (other than the deep red hour glass and 4 dots) is solid black.

3. How long do they generally live? (male and female life span)

4. What do I feed it?

5. How do I water it?

6. Anything else I should provide for its enclosure?

Thank you for your responses in advance, I am most excited about this beautiful spider

 

[Irene B. Smithi]

I'd suggest that you don't keep it. Let it go. You have a female, which means odds are she'll have an egg sac. You really don't want to deal with hundreds of baby widows. Let it go and enjoy watching it run wild.

However if you do keep it (which I don't suggest you do), a pickle jar with small air holes and some sticks will do. After they eat, they drop their food to the ground. At some point you'll have to clean that (which increases your risk of getting a nasty bite. Refer to other post here on how to deal with that.) I've never given my widows water (not more then a drop on the web at least). They are very easy to maintain and enjoyable to have. HOWEVER, I will never keep one that I haven't caught as a baby. Doing that means I won't have to deal with egg sac and or a hundred little babies. ALSO, if she has a sac, plan on her docile nature to turn. She'll get aggressive, being the good mommy that she is, she won't let you get close to her babies(as in egg sac).

edit: not sure of age,

 

[Irene B. Smithi]

I'd like to offer a different opinion.

Arianji, if you are experienced with cobweb spiders, or similar true spiders, caring for this gal should not be a concern. I put my cobweb spiders in simple jars with sticks and substrate. I posted some pictures in this thread of my jar setups with a good explanation of what to do and not to do. http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/showthread.php?228165-Setups-for-web-spinning-spiders I will add I seldom use lids as I am experienced with keeping these spiders in jars, for you, I would recommend a lid with lots of holes punched in it.

I have several long term cobweb spiders that have been in jars for 3+ years and I have not cleaned them once. I feed them isopods which help clean the bottom while providing a food source for the spider.

You do not really need to give this particular spider water, however I mist all my spiders once a week.

In captivity this spider will live around 3 years. A couple things that impact the spiders lifespan are over feeding & keeping the spider to warm, which will have the spider metabolizing much faster, translating into a shorter life.

Feed it once every 2 weeks, a meal about 1/4 the size of the spider. This spider does not have a very long list of things it wont eat, size of the meal is more relevant.

As for egg sac concerns, Irene is very correct in this concern, however I find it is easily managed with the correct tools. I am able to remove eggsacs with minor damage to the web fairly easily using a fork, stabbing it straight down the the egg sac, giving it a twist then bringing it up. I always scare the spider into her hide first. I've never had any issues with egg sac removal using this method. Once it is removed and on the fork, you can hit with a lighter or stomp it.

My young widows take down crickets more then twice their size! Also, I've moved to using a large plastic kite box for my widows You can make a neater display, open the top and bottom for cleaning (crickets can smell really bad if left for a long time), so having a bottom opening is really nice and means you don't have to disturb the web

The only thing I'll add, is please do have a lid on the cage. I've had them attach webbing to a water spot on the jar. Heck, I've had scorpions climb glass using water spots. So if you do mist, you'll be taking a risk of it getting out and making a web some were in your dorm. They are very easy to maintain though. But remember, your taking on a potentially nasty little critter... Assume all risk, and if you keep it, spend some time reading up on how to deal with a bite.

Best of luck


EDIT: If you scroll down below our post, you'll see a link to other threads or post on widows. Take some some time and read all the great info there. It'll help you get started and maybe answer more questions, or

 

[Arianji]

Thank y'all for your good and honest advice. I usually do release everything, but I find widows fascinating and beautiful, am I a bad person for that? haha I have been watching her spin all day. I am very careful and caring with my animals and familiar with first aid, plus I am not allergic to anything so I wont have a bad reaction in a worst case scenario situation. I still have her currently in the large critter keeper but I have a very large pickle jar that i could put her in. Would she be more comfortable in that? And I have done much homework on keeping this species so I am fully prepared for her. But how should I move her around if transferring her? I ran her into the kritter keeper the first time, but I think it will be harder to transfer her into the mouth of the pickle jar. Thank y'all in advance

---------- Post added 04-13-2012 at 01:30 AM ----------

p.s. I love the structures you created for your spinning spiders, that was a brilliant idea Ciphor

 

[cacoseraph]

i have used jars (with lids, for goodness sakes... i have had widows escape jars with rubberbanded plastic wrap on them as a makeshift lid, they can easily escape jars with no lids...) flipped upside down. the widow tends to go up in her web when you disturb the jar which makes cleaning debris and poop off the lid very easy. just watch out because they have a drop defense... sometimes they just scrunch up into a ball and drop out of their web. if you are using an upside down jar and have the lid of when they do that things can perhaps get more exciting than you would like

widows have very potent venom but are easily managed if you do your research and use your head

 

[Irene B. Smithi]

This is a completely inaccurate statement about taking a risk. Misting adds no additional risk at all. My spiders can attach webbing to the glass and sticks, and really everything they can reach with their butt. Dried water droplet or not, it has zero impact on the spiders ability to scale glass or smooth surfaces. The spider will not be able to get a foot hold with its front legs which is the key to climbing.

in 10 years of keeping true spiders in jars, I have had one escape. Male giant house spider that actually constructed a spiral funnel out to the top.

If your spiders are magically escaping jars you might be leaving behind a drag line that they find later and climb out with. Or you have sticks going to far up the top. If you have smelly left overs you are over feeding in my opinion, which is leaving uneaten remains to decompose and create a odor. When fed right, they will suck every last drop out of the pray leaving a easily decomposing remain that generates no odor me or anyone has ever noticed.

They are indeed capable of catching and consuming prey much larger then themselves, this is well documented fact. Most Theridiids can. This is an adaptability to help survive in the wild which ultimately takes a toll on the spiders life span. If I do give one a larger meal, one I want to keep around for awhile, I make sure not to feed it for awhile after.

I've never had one escape, ever. Always have a lid on, never suggest to any one that it's okay to not have it secure. Misting will cause water spots. Widows will attach webbing to it. Suggesting to not have a lid on any enclosure is a very odd and unsafe practice. If you do it, yay for you. Crickets smell. You will at some point clean the enclosure, if you don't, yay for you.

Widows are very easy to care for yes. Widows are also easy to move from one enclosure to another. They are extremely clumsy out of their web. Take it to a safe place, take out the webbing first, and get it to climb on a long stick, move it to the other enclosure.

Best of luck

---------- Post added 04-13-2012 at 08:12 AM ----------

I am very careful and caring with my animals and familiar with first aid, plus I am not allergic to anything so I wont have a bad reaction in a worst case scenario situation.

---------- Post added 04-13-2012 at 01:30 AM ----------

You may want to do a lot more reading on venom. Just from this statement alone, I'd suggest you find another spider to keep.
This will be my last reply to this post.
Best of health



***Edit: the only reason Cacoseraphs' escaped was due to an insecure lid. You won't have that issue with a secure lid, keep the air holes small. Do watch for egg sacs, if you do find one, remove it safely, and I like to drop them in a small clear vial of rubbing alcohol. You'll be able to see through the sac, it's kind of neat

 

[Arianji]

Well thank you all for the good advice, I'll transfer her later today. She seems to only be using a tiny corner of the large kritter keeper anyways so she would probably be more secure in the jar, and I would have more peace of mind with the tight shutting lid that the jar provides. I know this is a dangerous animal, but I am taking the precautions necessary to ensure the safety of both her and myself. I am very aware of the potency of her venom and am a responsible caretaker, she is an observational pet, that I have already gained hours of enjoyment from watching her move and spin her web. Thanks again everyone

 

[Irene B. Smithi]

C. Sculpts will climb water spots. Above and beyond that, I find you reply amusing. Thank you

Oh, and I did just reread it, you said that due to you being such an experienced keeper you do not use lids or something of the like, you did however suggest that the OP uses a lid. I will correct myself on that. I've never met another keeper that didn't use a lid, but each to their own.

 

[zonbonzovi]

Good lord, man! Dial back the vitriol a bit. This is not an official mod post, just a plea for sanity...thank you.

 

[cacoseraph]

I will add I seldom use lids as I am experienced with keeping these spiders in jars, for you, I would recommend a lid with lots of holes punched in it.

*ahem* now, what you probably meant ( i hope) is that you don't use lids for cobweb spiders, which are, iirc, pretty crappy at attaching web to glass... but the way you phrased that is pretty ambiguous, especially considering the OP is asking about widows and not Pholcidae

i second zbz, btw

i've noticed spiders using dried water spots to climb and anchor web to before. not all spiders are equally good at all things... like attaching web to glass, for instance


edit: lol, argue with a mod publicly... see how good that turns out for you =P

You know I actually started out quite kind, and simply stated my opinion not attacking at all. It really was not till Irene decided to start picking apart my opinion with snide comments that I hit the nuke button.

So if its a problem, you should address the person instigating don't you think? I'm civil to a point, but when people push my buttons they are launching the nuke strike. Don't blame the nuke, blame the one pushing the button.

edit2:
irene was either correcting or clarifying what i consider to be an ambiguous to bad bit of advice... that's kinda what these whole forum things are about

 

[cacoseraph]

you are freaking awesome and i don't begrudge you a blessed thing!

also, you might want to take a gander at https://www.google.com/webhp?source....2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.,cf.osb&biw=1333&bih=665

 

[The Snark]

Shades of Cool Hand Luke: What we got here is failure to 'municate!

 

[zonbonzovi]

Mod note

OK, this is official. This thread is going nowhere, the original question has more or less been answered and the OP has moved on. If anyone has anything to contribute in a constructive manner, please do so. If not, find another street to play chicken in. Cheers, John

 

[Ungoliant]

I feed them isopods which help clean the bottom while providing a food source for the spider.

That's a really good idea. I think I am going to try that in my big Kuk's jar, as I didn't have the foresight to think about easy cleanup when I set it up but don't want to destroy her web to redo it.