Xenesthis sp Blue

[Crazyarachnoguy]

Ive never ever had a problem finding care sheets, and or videos on youtube on husbandry care fore any species. My collection might be a little small though, i only have 25 tarantulas.

I only have 25 t's but between google and youtube ive had no problems finding husbandry information for the genus and species i care for.

thats good information, thank you.

 

[Arachnid Addicted]

Hopfully others are able to see this and maybe have a better understanding of where I am coming from

Here's what I think about it.

Martin based himself on the areas he found those specimens. Unless I lost something in translation, I believe he try to keep all his species in a more "natural" way in his enclosures, and that's why he said that we should keep X. sp. "Blue" in a dryer condition, same goes to X. immanis.

That said, I think that is the problem with YouTube videos. Usually, it's one person, providing one information that worked out fine for him/her, passing this through a lot of keepers around the world.

In this forum, it was said many times that "what works for you, not necessarily will work for others", when you take this into consideration and see the answers you have in this thread, imo, is clear that the way Martin keep his Xenesthis species is what worked for him, however, at least in this thread, most keepers keep their specimens fine doing the opposite, for both X. immanis AND X. sp. "Blue".

Another thing I find important to mention is how simulate the species natural environment in captivity is something that lots of breeders not usually do, me included. For me, tarantulas aren't hard to maintain in captivity, overall. When you try to simulate how they live in situ, that could lead to more fails than success, specially if you keep hundreds of species from different environments.
In the link below, there are interesting opinions from both sides, take a look at it.

Environmental manipulation and breeding in captive Tarantulas

In situ, there are a breeding season for them, and and tmk, they respect these periods, even males tend to mature in the right time and get out of their hides to find a female in these periods. That said, I agree with Cold Blood, in captivity, most species can drop a sac whenever the season we...

arachnoboards.com

Last, and that's a personal opinion, I tend to keep science and hobby separate. Whenever you try to walk both path, even if its minimum, mistakes can happen. It's easier for someone who doesn't like, or isn't familiar towards science, to misinterpreted an information and spread it out, than to someone who is familiar with the science side, to explain the same info correctly.
For example: Tom Moran meant in his blog once, that all B. hamorii were now B. smithi, this was not what happened but it was enough for the info to spread all over the hobby. Was his the one who started this or if he got it from other hobbysts, I can't say, though. Here's the link:

B. smithi is Now B. hamorii – A Breakdown of the Taxonomic Revision Paper

“A rose by any other name would smell as sweet” – William Shakespeare It was talked about and anticipated for years, and on April 26, it became official. Jorge Mendoza and Oscar F…

tomsbigspiders.com

In conclusion, Tom also said, and I quote "it’s taxonomy that informs the hobby, not vice versa", and I agree with that. However, imo, hobby and science are separated things and, no matter how experienced or familiar the keeper is with science, knowing how to filter information and make further research by ourselves, is important.

 

[Vanessa]

if you have not seen Martins video on Sp blue then please, before you assume I am going on outdated information or am over complicating the husbandry, watch his video and perhaps you will understand why this thread has been just a bit frustrating for me

I have seen it. Martin has gone around the world and has studied tarantulas on pretty much every corner of the world. He has observed them in every type of habitat. If he says that they can be kept a bit drier (as larger individuals - that is very important) then they can be kept drier. That would make sense, since Colombian Pamphobeteus are also known to tolerate drier conditions.
That is not to say that they don't appreciate a bit of moisture and that you shouldn't provide any. It rains in Colombia too and they have a proper rainy season. What that means is that they won't die if they're allowed to dry out a bit, which cannot be said for some species from the more tropical regions.
Trying to emulate the setup that Martin has is not realistic for the average hobbyist and elaborate setups like his are not required. We have seen over and over again, people trying to do natural, bioactive, setups and end up with a dead spider. Martin isn't just a hobbyist, he is a scientist and his setups are based upon many years of first hand knowledge of their habitats and what parts of them can be replicated and what can't.
The most important thing is that Martin has the hands on experience to make a judgement call that is based upon factual evidence. It is not a case where he's seen a few bioactives and done a bit of research online and thrown his enclosures together based on what other people on the internet have said. He has intimate, hands on, first hand, knowledge on how they live and under what conditions.
Personally, I would still keep this species with a bit of moist substrate around the water dish, but leave the rest of the enclosure to dry out. Then, I would watch what my tarantula tells me - do they avoid the wet area, or are they sitting on top of it all the time? I would then make adjustments based on their behaviour.
If you want a black and white answer, you're likely to remain frustrated. There is a very distinct line between 'can be kept' and 'should be kept'. There are certain aspects of their care that are very straightforward with little room to be creative and other aspects that you can play around with a bit without it being a detriment. You need to have a firm grasp on which is which before making recommendations to others.

 

[birdspidersCH]

Hi everyone!
First of all, thank you Vanessa for elaborating some of the difficulties our team faces all the time - much appreciated!

As Vanessa correctly assumes, it is a fine line between professional scientists and hobbyists we are walking. It's important to keep information seperate from each other, meaning that exclusive locality data from professional scientists can not be shared with good friends who are in the hobby for a long time, willingly to only want to best to the tarantulas and hobby anyway. We are based in Switzerland, so neutrality is something we are well aware of. To all of you, please consider the information regarding Xenesthis sp. blue the best we can put out there today, without harming anyones research or interests / hard work. We would not be able to do videos like this without friends who share their valuable information with us.

In fact, as stated in this the mentioned video, the whole Xenesthis genus is being worked on professionally and we certainly don't need to wait another decade to get to see a valid species name on them. Maybe the public get to know more about the detailed location and the microclimate, maybe not.

In short summary; Xenesthis sp. blue lives in valleys with special conditions, making them hotter and with less rainfall than your "Xenesthis immanis" for example, and clearly differs from the more humid environment Xenesthis sp. White is found. But as Vanessa states also correctly, the best husbandry is not to take these values from the wild and put them 1:1 to your enclosure - adapt them to your liking and especially when trying to breed this species, vary with humidity and temperature - just as in most species, like Poecilotheria metallica for example.

all the best,
Martin

 

[Arachne13]

I have seen it. Martin has gone around the world and has studied tarantulas on pretty much every corner of the world. He has observed them in every type of habitat. If he says that they can be kept a bit drier (as larger individuals - that is very important) then they can be kept drier. That would make sense, since Colombian Pamphobeteus are also known to tolerate drier conditions.
That is not to say that they don't appreciate a bit of moisture and that you shouldn't provide any. It rains in Colombia too and they have a proper rainy season. What that means is that they won't die if they're allowed to dry out a bit, which cannot be said for some species from the more tropical regions.
Trying to emulate the setup that Martin has is not realistic for the average hobbyist and elaborate setups like his are not required. We have seen over and over again, people trying to do natural, bioactive, setups and end up with a dead spider. Martin isn't just a hobbyist, he is a scientist and his setups are based upon many years of first hand knowledge of their habitats and what parts of them can be replicated and what can't.
The most important thing is that Martin has the hands on experience to make a judgement call that is based upon factual evidence. It is not a case where he's seen a few bioactives and done a bit of research online and thrown his enclosures together based on what other people on the internet have said. He has intimate, hands on, first hand, knowledge on how they live and under what conditions.
Personally, I would still keep this species with a bit of moist substrate around the water dish, but leave the rest of the enclosure to dry out. Then, I would watch what my tarantula tells me - do they avoid the wet area, or are they sitting on top of it all the time? I would then make adjustments based on their behaviour.
If you want a black and white answer, you're likely to remain frustrated. There is a very distinct line between 'can be kept' and 'should be kept'. There are certain aspects of their care that are very straightforward with little room to be creative and other aspects that you can play around with a bit without it being a detriment. You need to have a firm grasp on which is which before making recommendations to others.

I’m not going to break down everything as I am basically considering all this information before I even consider releasing anything to anyone however, what you have outlined here is indeed 100% EXACTLY what I am doing. I appreciate all the information you have otherwise stated but as I said at least a few times, I have no intention of emunlating what Martin did, I am not looking for a black and white answer, I would never tell anyone point blank to keep this specifies “dry” or not provide moisture. I keep my X blue on a half and half and spend a majority of my time watching and observing his behavior however. This thread was created so I could take on ALL the information and make 100% sure that I incorporate a good amount of these precautions into an informative and educational video. I am not frustrated with this thread at all. My frustration was only with the fact that I was looking for a colorful spectrum of experience and opinions of other experienced keepers and instead received some very black and white responses in the beginning. That being said, as I have further explained my intentions here I have most definitely managed to create the level of engagement I was looking for. The information you and a few others have provided here is invaluable and I am doing exactly as you have advised. No further comment

Here's what I think about it.

Martin based himself on the areas he found those specimens. Unless I lost something in translation, I believe he try to keep all his species in a more "natural" way in his enclosures, and that's why he said that we should keep X. sp. "Blue" in a dryer condition, same goes to X. immanis.

That said, I think that is the problem with YouTube videos. Usually, it's one person, providing one information that worked out fine for him/her, passing this through a lot of keepers around the world.

In this forum, it was said many times that "what works for you, not necessarily will work for others", when you take this into consideration and see the answers you have in this thread, imo, is clear that the way Martin keep his Xenesthis species is what worked for him, however, at least in this thread, most keepers keep their specimens fine doing the opposite, for both X. immanis AND X. sp. "Blue".

Another thing I find important to mention is how simulate the species natural environment in captivity is something that lots of breeders not usually do, me included. For me, tarantulas aren't hard to maintain in captivity, overall. When you try to simulate how they live in situ, that could lead to more fails than success, specially if you keep hundreds of species from different environments.
In the link below, there are interesting opinions from both sides, take a look at it.

Environmental manipulation and breeding in captive Tarantulas

In situ, there are a breeding season for them, and and tmk, they respect these periods, even males tend to mature in the right time and get out of their hides to find a female in these periods. That said, I agree with Cold Blood, in captivity, most species can drop a sac whenever the season we...

arachnoboards.com

Last, and that's a personal opinion, I tend to keep science and hobby separate. Whenever you try to walk both path, even if its minimum, mistakes can happen. It's easier for someone who doesn't like, or isn't familiar towards science, to misinterpreted an information and spread it out, than to someone who is familiar with the science side, to explain the same info correctly.
For example: Tom Moran meant in his blog once, that all B. hamorii were now B. smithi, this was not what happened but it was enough for the info to spread all over the hobby. Was his the one who started this or if he got it from other hobbysts, I can't say, though. Here's the link:

B. smithi is Now B. hamorii – A Breakdown of the Taxonomic Revision Paper

“A rose by any other name would smell as sweet” – William Shakespeare It was talked about and anticipated for years, and on April 26, it became official. Jorge Mendoza and Oscar F…

tomsbigspiders.com

In conclusion, Tom also said, and I quote "it’s taxonomy that informs the hobby, not vice versa", and I agree with that. However, imo, hobby and science are separated things and, no matter how experienced or familiar the keeper is with science, knowing how to filter information and make further research by ourselves, is important.

This is all very good information to keep in mind! I have most certainly gained a great deal of insight to pull from for future reference. This is very much exactly the type of information I wanted to keep in mind before putting any of this together! I really appreciate the thorough response and the thought put into this. It really gives me a lot to take into consideration as I work on my “essay”

Hi everyone!
First of all, thank you Vanessa for elaborating some of the difficulties our team faces all the time - much appreciated!

As Vanessa correctly assumes, it is a fine line between professional scientists and hobbyists we are walking. It's important to keep information seperate from each other, meaning that exclusive locality data from professional scientists can not be shared with good friends who are in the hobby for a long time, willingly to only want to best to the tarantulas and hobby anyway. We are based in Switzerland, so neutrality is something we are well aware of. To all of you, please consider the information regarding Xenesthis sp. blue the best we can put out there today, without harming anyones research or interests / hard work. We would not be able to do videos like this without friends who share their valuable information with us.

In fact, as stated in this the mentioned video, the whole Xenesthis genus is being worked on professionally and we certainly don't need to wait another decade to get to see a valid species name on them. Maybe the public get to know more about the detailed location and the microclimate, maybe not.

In short summary; Xenesthis sp. blue lives in valleys with special conditions, making them hotter and with less rainfall than your "Xenesthis immanis" for example, and clearly differs from the more humid environment Xenesthis sp. White is found. But as Vanessa states also correctly, the best husbandry is not to take these values from the wild and put them 1:1 to your enclosure - adapt them to your liking and especially when trying to breed this species, vary with humidity and temperature - just as in most species, like Poecilotheria metallica for example.

all the best,
Martin

Thank you so much for coming to my thread! I do appreciate the elaboration on the Species location is not currently available and why you are unable to share. It truly provides me with a much greater understanding and the information you have provided here about climate and environmental differences between this species and others in the genus is actually extremely helpful! I am actually very greatful that I posted here at this point as I value the information you provide on your Channel but I had hoped at the very least to get some insight into the personal experiences of others to add to my own experiences along with the data I’ve already acquired from others. It really has given me a much better grasp going forward.

 

[Nathan Zhang]

Speaking of breeding xenesthis blue, is there any resources on just breeding immanis or is breeding immanis just as hard as sp blue

 

[BillsSpider]

How are your Xenesthis doing Arachne?

 

[Arachne13]

How are your Xenesthis doing Arachne?

All doing very well thank you I’ve added several more to the collection