Which's more venomous...a Black Widow or a Poecilotheria?

Rich

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Anyone know which bite will most likely do the most harm?
 

pategirl

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I would have to say the widow. Pokie bites usually cause a lot of pain and such things, and I haven't heard of any deaths by a poecilotheria. Black widow bites can cause serious damage if medical attention isn't sought quickly, and the bites have caused deaths.
 

Mendnwngs

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There have been fatalitites from widow bites, (although rare). There have never been fatalities from Poecilotheria bites.

so, I would imagine that widows venom is more dangerous than a Pokies.

-Jason
 

That_Guy

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Neurotoxins, is what the widow is good for. It pust your whole body into a cramp. Soon you wont move, then you die. But, a pokies venom is also a neurotoxin i dont think that its as heavy as the widows.
 

Phillip

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Widow by far.......

Although the death toll has been extremely low over the last 20 to 30 years widows have caused deaths where pokes have not. Then factor in the size of the widow and the small venom yeild versus how much a poke can pump in and it doesn't take a whole lot of adding up to see how much hotter widows are. Also try to keep in mind when getting pulled into the pokes are really hot train of thinking that everyone who has been nailed by them and written how bad it was is still alive kicking and doing just fine.

Phil
 

Code Monkey

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As in scientifically/medically verified, it's the widow. However, in an absolute sense, who knows? The widows are an extremely common spider throughout one of the more heavily populated western continents. As a result it has come into "violent" contact with humans a large number of times, and the effects have been well documented as well as disseminated through the past couple of hundred years.

Conversely, pokies, are not common anywhere except in the spider rooms of a handfull of T enthusiasts and the number of times a human has been bitten by one is minuscule next to the number of human widow bites. If we could get as many people who have been bitten by widows to be bitten by pokies we might find that there are rare deaths as well, and they might even be more frequent. We just don't know and probably never will.
 

Code Monkey

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Phillip raises one good point: if you consider the amount of venom delivered by a 1+" female widow next to the amount delivered by a 6"+ pokie, even if they did cause rare deaths, the widow would still win the LD50 contest.
 

Mojo Jojo

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Originally posted by Code Monkey
As in scientifically/medically verified, it's the widow. However, in an absolute sense, who knows? The widows are an extremely common spider throughout one of the more heavily populated western continents. As a result it has come into "violent" contact with humans a large number of times, and the effects have been well documented as well as disseminated through the past couple of hundred years.

Conversely, pokies, are not common anywhere except in the spider rooms of a handfull of T enthusiasts and the number of times a human has been bitten by one is minuscule next to the number of human widow bites. If we could get as many people who have been bitten by widows to be bitten by pokies we might find that there are rare deaths as well, and they might even be more frequent. We just don't know and probably never will.
You're stealing my thunder man!

Jon
 

skadiwolf

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i think of the common spiders, funnelwebs are the most venomous, then brown recluse, then black widows.

if the Ts were that venomous, i'm sure you would've heard much, much more about it.
 

That_Guy

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Originally posted by skadiwolf
i think of the common spiders, funnelwebs are the most venomous, then brown recluse, then black widows.

if the Ts were that venomous, i'm sure you would've heard much, much more about it.
Are you fogeting the Daddy? Daddy long leg(Dont know sci. name) There fangs are to small to bite us. So we dont die:)
 

TarantuChimp

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The DDL being most venomous is ment to be a myth, I am not sure wehre i read that but alot of people are claiming it to be false. I have load DDL's in my garage and my friend who owns a farm as HUGE ones in his toilet.

I always thought that the Brazilian wandering spider was most venomous, or that might be most dangerous which does not mean venomous. hmmm.

Brown Recluse bites look the worst, so much Necrosis tissue damage i have read a book called the Red hour glass and he describes wounds of dead fleash the size of tennis balls.
 

MizM

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"Daddy Long Legs" are not even arachnids anyway. They are "huntsmen". And the story that they are venomous is another urban legend. If in doubt, talk to your local college entymology department.

Also note, again, that the toxicity of a given species will differ with each individual bitten. My son-in-law is an air conditioning/heating repairman and gets bitten by widows so often that he just gets something that looks like a big whitehead zit when he's invenomated. However, his 10-month-old daughter could die as a result of invenomation.

There are so many factors to consider that I would have to see a scientific breakdown of equal amounts of each species' venom for me to consider that I knew the answer!!!:?
 

Tamara

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According to my friend John Acorn (also known as television's Nature Nut) there are three big myths about harvestmen (huntsmen, DDL). First is that they are spiders (they're not), second that they are extremely venomous just not able to bite us (they're not venomous), and third, that if your cow goes missing you can pull off a DDL's leg, throw it on the ground, and it will point you in the right direction to look.
As for more useful information, I have none to add.
Tamara
 

Vys

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Originally posted by Tamara
and third, that if your cow goes missing you can pull off a DDL's leg, throw it on the ground, and it will point you in the right direction to look.
Lol :D
Though I don't know if heavy rationalisation without anyone ever pausing long enough at the machinery to ask why? is good. Well, it is, mostly, but sometimes it isn't, I'm fairly certain, and those times are paved right over. Anyways, I almost wish there were huntsmen here I could try that on. Not that I ever get many cows escapin' on me, but hey.
 

MrMatt

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It is my understanding that drop for drop Latrodectus sp. have the most potent venom of spiders. It is true there are more deaths from Wandering spiders , or Funnel weavers but take into account the amount of venom they push compared to a widow or redback. I was bit by a widow about a year ago and that was the most painful experience I have had. I couldn't work for three weeks and wasn't able to walk or dress myself for about a week and a half, it took me several months to be symptom free. All that from a very minute amount of venom. Just food for thought.

Matt
 

Steve Nunn

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Originally posted by MrMatt
It is my understanding that drop for drop Latrodectus sp. have the most potent venom of spiders. It is true there are more deaths from Wandering spiders , or Funnel weavers but take into account the amount of venom they push compared to a widow or redback.
Hi Matt,
Going by LD50 tests, the funnel-webs (genera Atrax and Hadronyche from the family Hexathelidae ) are the most venomous by a long shot. The genus Missulena from the mygale family Actinopodidae are a close second, this is only VERY recent news. The venom components of Missulena are extremely similar to the funnel-webs. There are also kown cases causing death. The wanderers venom cannot kill, so it doesn't belong on the most venomous list, maybe most dangerous, but certainly not most venomous (info from Dr Robrt Raven). The Latrodectus sp. rate quite highly too, although not near both the Hexathelids and Actinopodids. Recluses shouldn't even rate amongst the most venomous, again, maybe most dangerous, but not most venomous (info from Dr Breene). Necrosis rarely kills ;)

These spiders are only considred dangerous because of their localities and closeness to people. The most dangerous spider in the world is Atrax robustus (due to the fact it lives in the inner city of Sydney), but it isn't the most venomous either, burn the books you read that in. The most venomous species on the planet is the little known funnel-web Hadronyche infensa. No.2 on the list is Hadronyche formidabilis.

Hope this helps,
Steve
 

MrMatt

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Thanks for clearing that up and keeping me honest Steve ;)


Matt
 

Steve Nunn

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Re: Hey steve

Originally posted by Vayu Son
where does Phoneutria fera rank on that list?

-V
Hi VS,
I would imagine highly re: most dangerous, not even in the top twenty most venomous, those spots are taken up by Hadronyche and Missulena ;) (first 15 spots are ALL funnel-webs). I know it's been reported that P.fera has killed, but the reports aren't substantiated, not one of them. In fact, the unbelievable hype surrounding this spider is just plain ridiculous. Every thing you read about this spider mentions words like "deadly, lethal, most venomous in the world" and other non-truths typically seen when addressing any dangerous spider. Sure I think this species is dangerous (the most dangerous in the NW), very, but not deadly or potentially lethal. It's even arguable as to which species is the most dangerous over all, A.robustus or P.fera. A.robustus is way more venomous, but more people get bitten by P.fera, so which should it be???? There's no real solid answer regarding the most dangerous because of the varying factors involved.

Cheers,
Steve

Cheers,
Steve
 
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