When people buy advanced species as one of their first

[Chris LXXIX]

But those are clearly not a beginner species either. Not all NW are beginner friendly.

Yes, I know. Indeed. But so are genus Pamphobeteus T's. Yet just those days, if I'm not wrong in the 'Israeli Tarantula' thread, a lot of people, including long time keepers, suggested said genus to a complete beginner.

What's the difference (in the care, I mean) one moment, between genus Megaphobema and genus Pamphobeteus? I've kept both, today I have a M.robustum. I tell you, the difference is only that, genus Megaphobema, being class A burrowers that can compete to certain 'baboons', needs more inches of substrate. Nothing else.

This prove my theory, isn't true that genus Megaphobema is so hard to keep, if you ask me.

Yeah, sure, according to Jon3800 'Mythbuster' vids that's an 'hard to care for' genus but in reality, IMO isn't.

See what I mean, my man? Sometimes people loves to 'hype'

 

[cold blood]

@cold blood I totally agree with your post.

Especially with these two parts:


People do progress at different rates not just in this hobby but in everything. A lot of how you progress depends on other experiences you've had in life. I've seen people on here say keeping snakes or lizards are totally different than keeping a tarantula and that is true. But I believe a person who has experience with these other types of pets (or just been around these types of animals) well progress faster than someone with no experience dealing with them. Growing up on a farm and spending a lot of time catching snakes and bugs and lizards made this an easy hobby for me to progress in. I know I give people a hard time about teleporting Ts since I've caught and kept lizards that, while slower with strike speed, were faster than Ts over all.

That being said it's very alluring to a new keeper excited about this hobby to want harder to keep species. A lot of times it's before they are ready for them (though that's not always an easy thing to determine with a post or two in the internet). That's why when people ask about these species I think it's important not to beat them over the head about it but to explain the things they need to consider before getting them. Being informative and helpful to these new keepers, who most of the time are just really carious about the advance Ts, would go a long way to helping them not get in over their heads while preparing them for the next steps in keeping. That's why when I see new people on here make a post about an advanced T only to be made fun of or belittled it annoys the crap out of me. It doesn't help anyone when that happens.

I've always been impressed with how you gave out advice on here.

Great post man.

Great follow up post, I wish I could both like and agree and maybe more.

Thanks for the kindness my friend

However, some people paint unnecessarily dark and complex pictures about OWs, that's what I meant

And I don't agree...but that's ok...I was merely stating my viewpoints, not trying to be derogatory or inflammatory or even tell you that you are wrong....your opinion is yours alone. All I can do is show my angle or viewpoint (and hope to get you to see it my way)

I just think many people just take advice the wrong way, yeah, most of the time these ts are easy to keep...then they're not, and that is where experience means literally everything unless you have a significant amount of luck consistently on your side. These difficult moments are exactly why they are advanced, and this is why these points are often emphasized...but own enough and you know, these aren't wild exaggerated scare stories, they are real life situations real life keepers dealt with.

People warn about the worst case scenarios, because that's exactly why the extra experiences really help...anyone can keep an ornata for example...for a period of time...but the advanced species do not always stay consistent, and they grow up, often fast...one day they do something different than they ever did, and if you are prepared, its just something different, but be unprepared and all kinds of things can and do happen in the blink of an eye.

That one day you grab a bolus and it comes flyng out of nowhere and grabs your tongs and doesn't stop moving up them.....or when that one time you open the lid and the doesn't just sit there, but bolts instantly for the light of day...

I had my big vitatta do this a few weeks ago, but I was able to see it coming (for a year), because experience tells me that its always something to watch for, so I was able to calmly close the bin, blocking her path, but not closing anything all the way so her prodtruding legs didn't get damaged....touched her legs with the other tweezers, she moved in and it was over...3 seconds of nothing but a few long legs if you were there, but I couldn't imagine what had happened if the first time I saw that was with that spider, at that time.

Just having the experience enough to have built and experimented with enough housing options to know how to set up an enclosure so that the t has a safe place to bolt to is yet another type of un-talked about experience...a cage that's got too much open space and not a good enough place to hide for example, can cause instant whirlwind OW arboreals as they panic in any and every direction all at once.


Like I said, just explaining my points, and I do understand yours as well, so no worries my friend. It was never, and never will be anything personal.

Yes, I know. Indeed. But so are genus Pamphobeteus T's. Yet just those days, if I'm not wrong in the 'Israeli Tarantula' thread, a lot of people, including long time keepers, suggested said genus to a complete beginner.

Well, you're totally not wrong In that thread I think it ended up being the lesser of two evils...yeah, probably not the best first, but if the dude was hellbent on a OW arboreal fast, this was better than nothing...at least the venom is much less significant. But he did get the better ones in the end and went for good beginner types if I am recalling that thread right.

Still better than a P. muticus as a first.

 

[miss moxie]

In that thread I think it ended up being the lesser of two evils...yeah, probably not the best first

100% agreed. You don't see people suggesting a Pamphobeteus to someone who comes in posting about "Hi I've never kept a tarantula before but I'm really fascinated by them and would like suggestions for a good first tarantula" but rather when a new person comes in with "I've never kept a tarantula before but I love baboons and I was wondering what sort of baboon I should get."

 

[iEatRazorz]

Fill your shelves with multiples of each species and when they are ready for adult enclosures in a few years, you will have MMs or penultimate males to sell or trade, and have a greater chance at one or multiple females of each species, multiples can be sold for greatly enhanced prices you would pay for the sling (even many MMs can)....the result would be in a few short years you would have your 5 or 6 females and have not only re-couped all you spent on feeding, but buying them and housing them as well, and have something extra padding your wallet on top of the now free females and housing.

Conversely, you could just buy the 6, and in those few years when you are ready for those adult cages to be filled, you will have maybe 2 females if you are lucky, and several MMs, now you only have 1 or 2 adult enclosures, but room for 6 and are starting over from scratch to fill those other 4 or 5 spots, buying more single slings and hoping to get another female....in a decade you might finally have your 6 females in those adult enclosures, but at a far, far greater ultimate cost and it would take a great deal longer.

Buy in multiples and your room will work for you, buy singles and you end up a slave to your t room and buying....Just some food for thought.

You do make a very valid point. I gave thought to what you say here, not as in depth, but ultimately this is where I came out on it.

I don't want to pack up and ship one, I wouldn't feel right and would dwell on it if something were to end up resulting in the animals death. It would ultimately be my fault for putting it in that situation. Maybe a few years down the line I would be okay with it, but right now I'm not so I don't want to put myself in that situation.

I'm also not worried about recouping cost. If I was worried about it then I shouldn't be buying them in the first place. They have to rely on me for food and housing, that's part of owning one and I accept that.

As far as females go, I'm not worried about having females. I get they are bigger, live longer and are colorful. That stuff just doesn't matter to me. I didn't buy them to brag about having female T's or to be show pieces on my mantle. I bought them cause I've always liked spiders, like watching the development of stuff and observing them in general just zens me out. I was the kid catching bugs and releasing them after a couple of days of watching them

I respect what your saying and it makes perfect sense. It's just as of now I don't want to end up in a spot where I have too many, don't want to ship them and can't find a home for them locally.

 

[miss moxie]

I'm not worried about having females. I get they are bigger, live longer and are colorful.

Actually MMs can be very colorful. Just look at pretty much any MM Pamphobeteus.

 

[VolkswagenBug]

How will you move your collection?

Not that it's exactly similar, but when I needed to take all of my various insects and other oddities on a long car trip because I couldn't find a sitter, I just put them in deli cups and put the deli cups in boxes that I kept next to me so they wouldn't fall and slide around. They were quite a bit smaller than an adult T, though.

 

[VolkswagenBug]

Actually MMs can be very colorful. Just look at pretty much any MM Pamphobeteus.

Also Xenesthis immanis.

 

[iEatRazorz]

Actually MMs can be very colorful. Just look at pretty much any MM Pamphobeteus.

I just about had an aneurysm when I looked them up... They almost look painted. I'll now be looking at same species male color/female color. Perhaps I should be saying vibrantancy?

I've been convinced since I was 15/16 that males are duller in color. Now I feel like a fool asking, but am I correct in taking it's more of a case by case according to genus?

 

[miss moxie]

I just about had an aneurysm when I looked them up... They almost look painted. I'll now be looking at same species male color/female color. Perhaps I should be saying vibrantancy?

I've been convinced since I was 15/16 that males are duller in color. Now I feel like a fool asking, but am I correct in taking it's more of a case by case according to genus?

Hahaha, yeah definitely. I mean, G. porteri males and females look pretty much identical save for the potential for males to have longer, skinnier legs. There can be a huge size difference in some genera. MM Poecilotheria look more dulled out than the females do. MM P. regalis vs. AF P. regalis

 

[Chris LXXIX]

Still better than a P. muticus as a first.

This is heresy, and nothing else

 

[cold blood]

I just about had an aneurysm when I looked them up... They almost look painted. I'll now be looking at same species male color/female color. Perhaps I should be saying vibrantancy?

I've been convinced since I was 15/16 that males are duller in color. Now I feel like a fool asking, but am I correct in taking it's more of a case by case according to genus?

Many beautiful MMs out there...Phormictipus is another that MMs turn bright purple, like Pamphs.

Versicolor look awesome as MMs...

versicolor

• cold blood
• Jun 28, 2017
• 2

not all MMs look drab.

GBBs don't look bad either...

Resized952017040795104719

• cold blood
• Apr 8, 2017
• 4

MM GBB

Actually quite a few nice MMs...others aren't as bright, but still look neat...this is irminia...first a female, then a MM...

Resized952017040695224617

• cold blood
• Apr 7, 2017

irminia female #2

Resized952017041295134920

• cold blood
• Apr 13, 2017
• 4

MM irminia on loan from viper69

MM balfouri look great, too...

20170502_215729

• cold blood
• May 2, 2017
• 1

freshly molted balfouri

MM pokies look very different, but I still think they look good...this is a MM regalis on the way to a female.

Resized952016112295215908

• cold blood
• Nov 22, 2016
• 1

male regalis, on the way into the female's enclosure

But yeah, about Pamphs, while MMs are bright, females are generaly black, fading to a deep chocolaty brown before molting.....this is the same P. nigricolor.

Resized952016112095154314

• cold blood
• Nov 20, 2016
• 4

very fat nigricolor. She's about 6.5"

Resized952016112295174054

• cold blood
• Nov 22, 2016
• 1

nigricolor

Male or female...Pamphs just might be the coolest NW terrestrial genus as a whole.

 

[Ungoliant]

Actually MMs can be very colorful. Just look at pretty much any MM Pamphobeteus.

Look at my little dandy (a 3" mature male Dolichothele diamantinensis).

The colors in the right-hand picture are truer to life.

 

[miss moxie]

MM pokies look very different, but I still think they look good...this is a MM regalis on the way to a female.

IS THAT SASSY'S POPS?

Male or female...Pamphs just might be the coolest NW terrestrial genus as a whole.

I agree. I'm an absolute harlot for Pamphobeteus. I just discovered Pamphobeteus sp. Solaris the other week. PHEW. What a beauty.

 

[cold blood]

IS THAT SASSY'S POPS?

It is indeed. The female hes going to molted, sassy's mom is my other female.