Warning: graphic images of starvation

Gail

Arachnopixie
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Well, now that life is getting back to normal I hit the Pittsburgh Reptile Show today. It was probably one of the worst shows there so far - hardly no venders and fewer buyers. However, not being willing to walk away empty handed when I had Christmas and Birthday money in my pocket :D I decided to rescue 8 rose hairs - I just felt so bad for them. I got them for just $3.50 each. It is unbelievable the conditions that some spiders must endure (and probably eventually die from) during importation and shuffling around from show to show. Three of the eight aren't in too bad of shape - they were more dehydrated than anything else. One of the three is the biggest rosie I have ever seen in my life - at least 6.5". The other 5 are going to be lucky to pull through. Two of them (pictured here) are so emaciated and dehydrated that when looking at them from the side/underneath their book lungs actually stick out because the abdomen is so shriveled. All 8 buried thier faces into the water dishes and drank for at least 15 or 20 minutes and all but one are feeding on fresh killed crickets as I write. The one not eating is one of those that's not too bad looking.
It just breaks my heart to see any animal so abused. Makes a great case for captive breeding but I really doubt that we'll ever stop imports and the abuse they go through.

Gail
 

Gail

Arachnopixie
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the second rosie that is almost a goner
 

pategirl

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Gee....It's hard to believe that people would allow such amazing creatures to almost starve. I hope they get well.
 

conipto

ArachnoPrincess
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Well, on one hand, it's great that they are in your care now. I know they're in good hands now.

On the other, I've got a pretty big heart for bugs, and I've done the same thing before with my rose hair, but someone brought to light the point that rescues may not always be such a good idea. The one problem is, now that he's sold those 8, He may get more (since those sold too) I hope you atleast had a good talking to him before you took them off his hands. It's a pretty tough cycle. We see these poor things, want to help them, but at the same time, are really just contributing to the next batch that get wild caught.

Bill
 

Gail

Arachnopixie
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Yea, Bill, you've got a really good point there but it really is the delimma that he (and others) are going to continue to do this because even if I don't buy them, someone will. As I explained to pategirl in response to her PM...

I bought them at the local reptile show today from one of the regular venders. He gets them from an importer in Florida. They usually are in pretty bad shape when he gets them and then he usually has them for several months as he totes them from show to show. They never leave the deli cups and apparently he rarely feeds them. You figure he probably only pays 50 to 75 cents each for them, so if he buys a lot of 100 and sells even just 25 at $5 each he has made back his money, so there is no reason (financially) for him to feed the remaining 75 spiders. If they sell, they sell, if they die then they die. He cut me a deal on them at $3.50 each and still made money. In this case it was a win-win situation - I got 8 new spiders, he got a profit on 8 spiders (5 of which would probably have been dead and thrown out before the next show), and 8 spiders got a second chance at life.

So really it comes down to the fact that he will sell enough of them at $5 when they still look fairly decent to warrent him continuing to buy them from the wholesaler, who will continue to import them. If I thought that me not buying them would truly make a difference I wouldn't buy them, but it won't because there just is no way that there will ever be enough people who will stand up and say "no, I won't buy an imported spider (or lizard, etc.)" - it's a wonderful thought but this is not a utopian society where it will ever see fruition :( Sorry if I sound a little harsh - it's not meant harshly :D

Gail
 

conipto

ArachnoPrincess
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No Gail, I fully understand your point of view, and it mirrors mine for the most part. It's a pretty sad thing, but we can't do much about it. Better us than an impulse buy that doesn't know better.

Bill
 

chid

Arachnoknight
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Oct 8, 2002
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I hope you are sucessfull at saving them ,I cant belive people would take them to a show in that condition in the first place.

Chid
 

Cowshark

Arachnosquire
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Those pics break my heart. You get so used to seeing pics of happy fat spiders in this forum, especially when Joy posts. :p That is truly shameful. Hope those sweeties make it.
 

Immortal_sin

Arachnotemptress
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wow..that second pic is especially appalling :(
I don't blame you a bit, and it's sad there is no current way to stop the cycle either
 

arachnopunks

Arachnobaron
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Nov 10, 2002
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It is frustrating. We have a local pet shop that recently started carrying tarantulas. They do not have any waterdishes. We told them about it once, then brought the ATS caresheet in stressing the importance of a waterdish and suggesting anyone buying one look for that. We went in today for some crickets and there were still no water dishes. Granted, they do not look as bad as your rosies, but it is only a matter of time. I am tempted to rescue them, but they want $15-20 per rossie. They just figure that neither us or the ATS knows what we are talking about and assume they know best I guess.
 

Raveness

Arachnobaron
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Nov 2, 2002
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This one almost has a sad puppy dog look on it's face :( poor baby. I tried to do this with a grey formed P.murinus.. but it died before I could ;( The owner of the pet shop gave it a little tiny sponge..a little tiny tank.. dead crickets were all over the cage and no hiding place. She also used sand as a substrate. Look at it this way... You saved eight spiders..you saved eight lives you could have lost eight lives.. in my book that is a big difference. If you just save one little spider you are making a difference. Good luck :)

Originally posted by Gail
the second rosie that is almost a goner
 

conipto

ArachnoPrincess
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With all this down discussion, I just thought I'd take a second to mention the two good experiences I've had with Pet shops and suggestion.

Both small independant petshops in my area that carry T's had some serious problems with their T's. In one, there was a very unhappy king baboon on half an inch of wood chips, that looked near death. I spoke to both the manager and one employee who was blindly keeping a few T's without any knowledge of them. Through one of them, that King baboon now has a very nice tank, and despite it's ludicrous pricetag, looked healthy outside it's large burrow last time I saw it. The same store also recently got a T. blondi, and it is being housed in the exact way I recommended that the one employee house his.

The other store, the owner has removed all the sponges, and replaced them with water dishes, and dirt instead of the wood splinters he had before. With some 20 rose hairs, I had to congratulate him on undertaking the task of refitting each of them with proper set-ups.

It could be just that they want to keep up with the Petsmarts and Petcos of the world, but I'm happy to see that atleast a few people in the world are accepting education, and passing it on to potential buyers.

Bill

P.S. - Petco still uses the same setup where one rose hair burrowed under a divider to eat another, so chalk another one up to corporate stupidity.
 

Tarantula Lover

Psalmopoeus Lover
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i hate people who dont know how to take...

I hate people who do this to beautiful T's, Take care of them Gail! I feel so sorry for them! Good Luck!

James

P.S- Keep us updated!
 

Gillian

Arachnoblessed
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Aug 13, 2002
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Gail,
I'm sorry but, JESUS CHRIST! That is such bullsh!T! And I thought my chalcodes was in bad shape when she got here...Good luck Gail...

Peace,
Gillian
 

Joy

Priestess of Pulchra-tude
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Gail, I think it was wonderful of you to save them. I know and understand the argument for not buying from and thus encouraging bad vendors, but my own tendency is to see and empathize with the spiders as individuals, and the fact is you saved those eight individuals. Hence, you have my warmest applause for a truly noble and generous act :)

Joy
 

Gillian

Arachnoblessed
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Re: Re: Warning: graphic images of starvation

Originally posted by Joy
Gail, I think it was wonderful of you to save them. I know and understand the argument for not buying from and thus encouraging bad vendors, but my own tendency is to see and empathize with the spiders as individuals, and the fact is you saved those eight individuals. Hence, you have my warmest applause for a truly noble and generous act :)

Joy
Joy,
Thank you...I could not have said it better myself..
Peace,
Gillian
p.s., Gail, you wouldn't happen to know who it was, do you?
 

galeogirl

Arachnoprince
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Aug 15, 2002
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I've found myself in similar situations, I always end up saving them if I can. Best of luck with them.
 

MrT

Arachnoking
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Gail,
Theres no doubt in my mind that you'll have pic# 2 and all the rest fattened up, and right as rain in no time at all.;)
Your the one!! IMO

Ernie
 

SkyeSpider

Spider Queen
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Jul 17, 2002
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Yikes!! That's awful :( Like everyone else said, though: At least they're in good hands now.

I've gotten a few spiders out of pitty at reptile shows before, myself. It's deplorable; the conditions that vendors keep their animals in sometimes.

On the note of petshops: One of the local ones near me stocks LOTS of tarantulas. When I first started visiting them, about a year ago, the spiders had no water, and were all kept in 2.5 gallons with dividers (3 spiders to a cage). They ignored my innitial warnings about the conditions for a few months.

After frequenting the shop for a while, handling their more agressive/ flighty spiders, and talking shop with them, they've warmed up to my advice. They've now got the spiders on a rigid feeding routine (once a week, five crickets each; instead of 10 a day), and each has its own cage and water dish :)

It goes to show that most petshops will take advice, but you'll have to be persistant. They're not going to believe the average customer, of course, but just show them you know something and they open right up :)

-Bryan
 
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