Ultimate Invert Killers!!

Neo

Arachnosquire
Old Timer
Joined
May 9, 2003
Messages
145
I had 5 emperor scorpions, than one day I bought crickets from this Chinese Petshop near my house, and by the next day, I notice these little small worms crawling all over the tank serface where there are alot of moisture. The crickets from than only all die in about an hour when I put them inside there, and there are these weird bugs that crawl in the soil and on my emperors. I cleaned the substrate once, they came back, and I couldn't do a damn thing, cause their on or maybe even inside my scorpions. Before I realized that this was so, I tried to move them over to a sectioned place over my T's tank. Later it became infected as well. All my emperors and my T started acting weird, and they later died.

I'm wondering, anyone have the same problem before? Is it Stoppable? I just lost 6 inverts and I couldn't do anything about it.
I can't think of any way, I've searched as well and found something about worms inside crickets, but little else. Anyone? :?
 

Vys

Arachnoprince
Old Timer
Joined
Sep 22, 2002
Messages
1,571
I don't entirely get your post; did the crickets die an hour after you put them in their own enclosure, or the scorpion's?
Did the worms and bugs (they were separate) spring from the cricket-enclosure if such exists, or the scorpion-tank?
Anyway, best way I've found to avoid bugs is just to keep it as dry as you dare.
 

Professor T

Arachnodemon
Old Timer
Joined
Apr 11, 2003
Messages
724
Originally posted by Neo
I had 5 emperor scorpions, than one day I bought crickets from this Chinese Petshop near my house, and by the next day, I notice these little small worms crawling all over the tank serface where there are alot of moisture. The crickets from than only all die in about an hour when I put them inside there, and there are these weird bugs that crawl in the soil and on my emperors. I cleaned the substrate once, they came back, and I couldn't do a damn thing, cause their on or maybe even inside my scorpions. Before I realized that this was so, I tried to move them over to a sectioned place over my T's tank. Later it became infected as well. All my emperors and my T started acting weird, and they later died.

I'm wondering, anyone have the same problem before? Is it Stoppable? I just lost 6 inverts and I couldn't do anything about it.
I can't think of any way, I've searched as well and found something about worms inside crickets, but little else. Anyone? :?
Just a guess, but I bet the "worms" were the larval stage of a parasitic insect, most likely a species of beetle. One out of five animals on the planet is a beetle. :mad:
 

Neo

Arachnosquire
Old Timer
Joined
May 9, 2003
Messages
145
Originally posted by Vys
I don't entirely get your post; did the crickets die an hour after you put them in their own enclosure, or the scorpion's?
Did the worms and bugs (they were separate) spring from the cricket-enclosure if such exists, or the scorpion-tank?
Anyway, best way I've found to avoid bugs is just to keep it as dry as you dare.
The crickets die about an hour after I put them inside the infected tank...which was my scorpions. I believe they came from inside the dead crickets, something about parasitic worms. Thats the problem with keeping it dry, my emperors need it....any moisture at all, they can live in it, I even seen some in the water dish. Nasty %*&%(&. Thats why i'm not buying from some Asian that keeps HAMSTERS in a BIRD CAGE. That Idiot!!. He's a freaken liar too, I ask him to order me a monitor lizard from this internet site, because my parents wouldn't let me, I showed him the money and he said yea okay. Than the next day he said they're out of them and he called. I called them and they said they got a whole bunch.... LOSER!!! :mad:
 

bodisky

Arachnoknight
Old Timer
Joined
May 25, 2003
Messages
163
Neo,
Your description is indicative if parasitic nematodes. Yes they are parasitic to your scorpions and T's and yes crickets are a vector.
Pleae read the sticky entitled "Research Institute for Exotic Species Microbiology. We are here to help but we cant do that without participation. We can send you a kit for sampling. If you are a younger enthusiast/keeper maybe your parents can help you with the kit.
Best regards,
Kerry
 

Sean

Arachnodemon
Old Timer
Joined
Mar 18, 2003
Messages
718
man what is up with all these peoples inverts being killed by weird parasites first maggots now little tiny worms coming from crickets freaky dude thats even giving me the creeps, im now searching through my invert cages looking for weird little creatures...i dont keep my inverts really moist though my inverts that like humitity i mist once every 7-10 days unless its on a molt then i mist twice a week but man that is just creepy little weird creatures crawling around killing our inverts this must be stopped!
 

Professor T

Arachnodemon
Old Timer
Joined
Apr 11, 2003
Messages
724
Originally posted by bodisky
Neo,
Your description is indicative if parasitic nematodes. Yes they are parasitic to your scorpions and T's and yes crickets are a vector.
Pleae read the sticky entitled "Research Institute for Exotic Species Microbiology. We are here to help but we cant do that without participation. We can send you a kit for sampling. If you are a younger enthusiast/keeper maybe your parents can help you with the kit.
Best regards,
Kerry
Kerry,

Do you know what kind of roundworms they are? I never saw a cricket with nematode parasites...any info would be appreciated.
 

Neo

Arachnosquire
Old Timer
Joined
May 9, 2003
Messages
145
Yes I think I have researched a long while back about those parasites. Found out they love humidity and the host of crickets. They infect crickets, kill them, and burst out of them into a small body of water or somewhere that has high humidity.

They told me to dry up the place. I did that but it simply didn't work because I believe some were inside the scorpions. So moving them back, they just reinfected the place over again. It was a sad way the scorpions died. They stopped eating, stopped moving around, they're like.....ME...LAZy!!. Then they died....

:(

If there are ways to kill them, I think its not going to be easy or cheap. Dunno. HOpe no one will have this problem...
 

bodisky

Arachnoknight
Old Timer
Joined
May 25, 2003
Messages
163
Hello!
Nematode infested crickets are quite common. Parasitic nematodes were developed as a kind of "pesticide" for mole crickets. Parasitic nematodes do not descriminate. All insects and arthropods are vulnerable.
You can find info all over the net. Here are a personal few fav sites.


http://nematode.unl.edu/

and

http://nematodes.unl.edu/wormepns.htm

Kerry
P.S. I can buy these alleged "beneficial nematodes" at the nursery.
 

Buspirone

Arachnoprince
Old Timer
Joined
Mar 10, 2003
Messages
1,064
I've gotten into the habit of dipping the tweezers I use to do maintainence and feed in alcohol and flame them between cages hoping it will help discourage the spread of anythig since I have a rosie that appears to be affected.
 

Professor T

Arachnodemon
Old Timer
Joined
Apr 11, 2003
Messages
724
Originally posted by bodisky
Hello!
Nematode infested crickets are quite common. Parasitic nematodes were developed as a kind of "pesticide" for mole crickets. Parasitic nematodes do not descriminate. All insects and arthropods are vulnerable.
You can find info all over the net. Here are a personal few fav sites.


http://nematode.unl.edu/

and

http://nematodes.unl.edu/wormepns.htm

Kerry
P.S. I can buy these alleged "beneficial nematodes" at the nursery.
Kerry,

This was great information! Apparently "beneficial nematodes" aka entomopathogenic nematodes are not the friend to arachnoculturists. Nematodes of the genera Heterorhabditis and Steinernema have symbiotic bacteria that kill insects rapidly... and apparently arachnids too! This translates into being careful bringing in outside soil, which must be heated to kill the roundworms. Also, this would be a case for not taking a chance feeding any wild caught prey to your pets, because of the entomopathogenic nematode risk!

More information:

http://www2.oardc.ohio-state.edu/nematodes/biologyecology.htm
 

bodisky

Arachnoknight
Old Timer
Joined
May 25, 2003
Messages
163
Thats exactly right Professor T. Although Heterorhabditis and Steinernema are culprits they arent the only ones.
Larry Boyd of our research institute, is working hard identifying the symbiotic bacteria of each parasitic nematode starting with Heterorhabditis and Steinernema. Since the nematode feeds upon this bacteria we intend to develop a treatment to deprive them of it. Less toxic then using an antihelmenthic.
The key here is to become educated about this as you have. Good husbandry practices and regular examination of our precious pets is a must.
There is a multitude of info out there on the net regarding these parasites.
Best regards,
Kerry
 

crash769

Arachnosquire
Old Timer
Joined
May 29, 2003
Messages
144
I have gottin boxes of crickets with large black worm type things (they have legs) in it but they have never been a problem for me.
 

Professor T

Arachnodemon
Old Timer
Joined
Apr 11, 2003
Messages
724
Originally posted by crash769
I have gottin boxes of crickets with large black worm type things (they have legs) in it but they have never been a problem for me.
I think those are the larval stage of a harmless beetle, but that is just a guess.

If you purchase quality crickets, they should be free from beetle larva, so your source for crickets has suspect husbandry practices.
 

invertepet

Arachnolord
Old Timer
Joined
Oct 4, 2002
Messages
608
The black larvae are Dermestids (Carpet Beetles). They tend to eat the cricket food and any other fibrous stuff with even a hint of nutrients. They tend to be fairly inconsequential as long as they're not allowed to escape into the home, where they can set up shop in the carpet and among clothing (esp. wool, furs, hide, etc).

Excessive infestations of incoming cricket batches can be a drag, but they're quite common with even more respected cricket distributors. I've gotten them from time to time from just about all of the major sources.

You can clean the cricket enclosure periodically to try to keep them down.

bill
 

Ultimate Instar

Arachnobaron
Old Timer
Joined
Aug 20, 2002
Messages
457
Will freezing kill the nematodes? I've found that many (if not all) of my Ts will eat dead, previously frozen crickets. Some parasites can be incredibly difficult to kill, though. "Alien" is a pussycat compared to some of them.

Karen N.
 
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