Too many young scorpions death; What i'm doing bad?

Androctonus_bic

Arachnoprince
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At the begining of summer, I bought 4 A. mauritanicus, 4 P. transvaalicus and 2 Buthus sp. Now I only have a Muri and a Trans, I keep it in 30ºC at day, and 22ºC at night, 30% of humidity and eating 2 times every week. What am I doing wrong to have so elevate death number?

Cheers
Carles
 

Galapoheros

ArachnoGod
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Where they adults, babies,...? What kind of sub? What are you keeping them in? Are you in an apartment complex? Any pesticides around?
 

Arachno Kid

Arachnoknight
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Hola friend :)

Is it possible of the water source beeing contaminated for them, you know like when it rains and everything our water turns a redish crap color o_O and its still not drinkable sometimes due to a high bacteria rating in it. off the subject but what were you using for a water container?
 

quiz

Arachnoprince
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At the begining of summer, I bought 4 A. mauritanicus, 4 P. transvaalicus and 2 Buthus sp. Now I only have a Muri and a Trans, I keep it in 30ºC at day, and 22ºC at night, 30% of humidity and eating 2 times every week. What am I doing wrong to have so elevate death number?

Cheers
Carles
Did they all die at the same time/same day? What instar?
 

Androctonus_bic

Arachnoprince
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All they are between 2nd 3rd and 4th intar. There no any pesticide. They are keep alone in a orine pot with holes. Substrate are acuarium sand very dry. I water they once/three weeks. They doens't die at same time. The water is not contamined, I use mineral water.

I don't know what I'm doing wrong. T's and centipedes (lings) don't give to mi any problems, but scorps... until they are no juvenil, dies like flyes in a dendrobates terrarium...

Cheers
Carles

Very pleased with you.
 

Galapoheros

ArachnoGod
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I don't have allot of experience with these. I just started keeping only one of the sp you mentioned in your thread and that is P. transvaalicus. At first I was keeping them too wet, then I kept them too dry. They are diggers and hide in their holes. There would be more moisture in the holes than at the surface, even in the desert. Nothing new there. I keep mine in containers that have some ventilation but not much. I put a small bottle cap in each one. Every day, I put 3 to 5 drops of water in the cap. It's all evaporated by the next day. I'm not worried if I don't do that every day or even once every three or four days but I try hard to keep up with that when I think they are premolt. I saw the 30% RH you said you have going so, I really don't know if you can use any of that.

I just noticed that all the water evaporates from the caps in about 4 or 5 hours.
 
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quiz

Arachnoprince
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Jan 27, 2006
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At the begining of summer, I bought 4 A. mauritanicus, 4 P. transvaalicus and 2 Buthus sp. Now I only have a Muri and a Trans, I keep it in 30ºC at day, and 22ºC at night, 30% of humidity and eating 2 times every week. What am I doing wrong to have so elevate death number?

Cheers
Carles
Hi,
Maybe your temperature during the day is going over 30C degrees?
 

ParabuthusKing

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Hey.. not to say I am an expert ( I have had my fair share of deaths so I feel your pain), but I feel that your setup could be too dry for the little ones. Temperature is likely not an issue as they can tolerate a wide range of temps even though the high and low extremes are not "ideal". I keep all my juvenile scorpions of the Parabuthus genus / Androctonus genus on coconut fiber mixed with a little sand. ( about 70% fiber/ 30% sand) and then keep it mostly dry but definitely saturate one portion of the enclosure with water on a regular basis, or about once a week in summer and once every other week in the winter. I feel that they need some moisture as such small organisms and have never had a problem with mycosis up until about the 4th instar stage at which point I switch watering cycle to simulate a drier desert climate. Adults of these species I really keep dry and only water about once a month and they are in much larger 10 gallon aquariums so ventilation dries this moisture out quickly. Some of my transvallicus 2nd/ 3rd instars have been kept on moist coconut fiber only which doesn't dry out for a few weeks at a time, and I have yet (knock on wood) to have a single one die. Best of luck, and hope this helps somewhat. NAte
 

quiz

Arachnoprince
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I have never give any of my scorplings water or any type of moisture. I even stopped giving them droplets of water before molt. In my experience with raising 2nd instars, I keep them in a box where the temperature stays between 28-30C degrees all day/all night. Never gave them any water and I have never experience bad molt. Most of my juvies will finish molting within 7-8 hrs or 4 hrs. to finish molting if I bump the temperature between 32-34C degrees. The only death I had was with P.transvaalicus. 4 P.transvaalicus specimen died in 1 day. All 4 molted on the same day and all were dehydrated. That only happened when I got my temps up between 32-34C degrees and all 4 specimen died within 20 hrs. after molting. Recently, 1 of my P.transvaalicus almost dehydrated after molting to 5th instar because I bumped the temps to 32-34C degrees again. It's life was 50/50 but I managed to save it. It's only P.transvaalicus in my experience that gets dehydrated really fast after a molt. Never had any problem with my Androctonus spp. Now, my temps are back between 28-30C degrees.

In my opinion, I don't think giving water or moisture is the issue because I never give water/moisture to any of my desert species except adults/sub-adults. I feel that temperature plays a big part. Maybe his temps are going over 30C degrees.

Don't do what I do because what works for me might not work for you.
 

Vixvy

Arachnobaron
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IMO your substrate might be to dry and you did not wash them before u use it. and with its early instars they are very vulnerable this may also contribute for their deaths. misting will help from what I have observed with some of my desert sps when we use sand as substrate I think its very very dry for them I think even if you live in the desert they experience morning dews or some other sort of moistures. now I am using a very dry potting soil mix try to mist it on one side only.
 

Androctonus_bic

Arachnoprince
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Ok, untill we now, I have two problems: first one, maybe I have to hight the temperature without know it, and the second one, the desertic scorpion lings maybe need a little bit higher hygrometri.
Tonight I'll change the scorps to a bigger can with a mixt of sand and pet moist and I'll keep it at room temperature (aprox. 23-25ºC).
P. trans is near to molt, maybe doing that will save their life. A. mauritanicus had molt 2 months ago and looks like very healthy at this days.

Maybe this are the problems. Very glad with your help.
Cheers
Carles

P.D: When you say "it dyes dehydrated" How can I know that it is the cause? Any forensic diagnostic? How can avoid it? Just increasing the humidity level?
 

quiz

Arachnoprince
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Ok, untill we now, I have two problems: first one, maybe I have to hight the temperature without know it, and the second one, the desertic scorpion lings maybe need a little bit higher hygrometri.
Tonight I'll change the scorps to a bigger can with a mixt of sand and pet moist and I'll keep it at room temperature (aprox. 23-25ºC).
P. trans is near to molt, maybe doing that will save their life. A. mauritanicus had molt 2 months ago and looks like very healthy at this days.

Maybe this are the problems. Very glad with your help.
Cheers
Carles

P.D: When you say "it dyes dehydrated" How can I know that it is the cause? Any forensic diagnostic? How can avoid it? Just increasing the humidity level?
Hi Charles,
Dehydrated scorps looks like desert species in a molting position except that their metasoma are sometimes really stretched (i'm no expert but that's what I see in my dehydrated scorps). Both pincers are lined up and covering the face, their metasoma are really stretched (1 of my 6th instar P.trans didn't have it's metasoma stretched). Legs are really folded. I'm trying to find a pic of dehydrated scorpion because I'm really bad at describing {D. Sorry about the description, that's the best I can do {D . To avoid it, make sure to feed your specimen 8-9 DAYS after molting or you can take give a day/night temperature but it wil take them more than 9 days to harden.

I thought that big problems occur between 2nd to 4th instar. I don't have a problem raising P.transvaalicus from 2nd to 5th instar but I noticed with my specimen and set-up that P.transvaalicus takes more than 7-9 days to harden. I don't advice to keep them at temps between 28-30C degrees because it took my specimen atleast 12 days to eat it's first meal at 6th instar. 1 of my sub-adult died of dehydration just last month so what I do now is give my sub-adult P.transvaalicus day/night temperature.


Ed
 
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Vixvy

Arachnobaron
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@quiz
What type of substrate do you use for your desert species? and also are they enclosed inside your hotbox?
 

quiz

Arachnoprince
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@quiz
What type of substrate do you use for your desert species? and also are they enclosed inside your hotbox?
playsand and they're not enclosed in my hotbox :D . I have them in deli cup with no lid :?
 

Andre2

Arachnosquire
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I just wanna comment this;

early instar Buthus or Parabuthus spp - this is NOT easy to raise! Even though P. transvaalicus generally may do well in captivity. But tell me, who has raised a litter of Buthus spp succesfully?

I don't think you must judge too hard on yourself, because many people have similar problems with these types of scorpions.

I have not much experience with the species you mention, but I have much experience with (somewhat) similar Hottentotta spp. With these species I often give a longer (2-4 months) period of a much cooler temperature. As far as I understand the behavior of my scorpions correctly, I think they really appreciate this.. Also it seems to stimulate molting in the latter instars especially the last one. But this is just a personal observation
 
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Androctonus_bic

Arachnoprince
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Look at this, you was in reason!!!!!!!!





Very glad with your help guys!!!!!!!!!!

Cheers
Carles
 

Galapoheros

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Nice! I really wanted to look at ALL your pics but my dialup service is killing me. But I could see one molted! I thought about, "maybe", another idea that might help control humidity a little more. I haven't tried it yet. I'm thinking about partially burying one or two of those peat things that people use to germinate seeds. You soak them and they expand. Maybe if you use allot more sand in the substrate, you could partially bury one or two of these in the cage, maybe in a corner or two and check to see if they have dried out every once in a while. Maybe using these would help keep accidental run-off underneath the substrate from happening so you might be able to avoid sub saturation and too much moisture. Pic of the peat discs turned out blurry but, you get the idea.
 

Androctonus_bic

Arachnoprince
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Yes gala; it looks like a good idea TMO. Then the scorp can choose the better place to molt or to keep quite.

Cheers
Carles
 
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