Sticky situation in business

[Swagg]

Amazon doesn’t allow getting merch before you pay. You shouldn’t either. Stay strong, don’t give in to bullies.

 

[ShyDragoness]

Honestly I would've just turned that person away

 

[MrDeranged]

Hi @SkittleBunny

Please don't take any of this personally, it's not meant that way. I just need to play "Devil's Advocate" here as it's kind of my thing

I recently had to make a new paypal account cause my old one is going through a password lock, and anyone who uses paypal knows they hold funds until positive feedback is recieved or 21 days has passed, until you have decent credit with them on new accounts.

I don't understand this, did you contact Paypal to see why your original account was locked and if they could get it unlocked? Wouldn't that have been easier than signing up for a new account and having to deal with all the headaches that comes with? Did your TOS state that you won't ship until all funds have been received and clear processing? Common sense isn't all that common lately and it's partly the reason that our rules have increased and become more detailed over the years here at Arachnoboards. Did your TOS state that you signed up for a new account and that the buyer would have to wait an additional 21 days for their funds to clear? I know that I would be pretty pissed if I bought something and the seller told me (after the fact) that I had to wait an additional 21 days for my perfectly good payment to clear because they just signed up with a new payment processor.

This was never a problem before because customers would send the payment via 'gift' and avoid the %3 fee or simply add the fee with no issues or complaints, since that's kind of how things are online.

I don't know where you frequent online, but that's not my experience at all. If I'm purchasing from someone that I don't know personally, or don't already have an existing relationship with, I would NEVER send money as a gift. This is both for my protection and the sellers. Sending the money as a "gift" leaves a buyer with no recourse if the seller is "scamming". It also takes away protections from the seller if the buyer is a scammer (i.e. buyer receives product and then contacts Paypal to say that the "gift" was sent by accident.) Paypal fees are a part of using them as a payment provider. It is against Paypals TOS to add a surcharge to cover Paypal fees. If you're worried about that, add the 3% into the overall price for the item that you're selling.

I don't have a single bad review over my sites/accounts so I'm a little scared.

The fact that you will get bad reviews at some point is almost a given in this day and age of "outrage culture". I've seen reviews on a product page for a product that the reviewer said was the best thing since sliced bread, but because the reviewer saw the shipper toss the package onto their porch they gave it one star. The only thing you can do is keep detailed records of what you did and reply to the negative review with your side of the story. At that point, you just hope for other users to have the comprehension to know that you did everything you could to make things right and/or weren't at fault in the first place. If they don't have the comprehension, you're probably better off with them not buying from you.

TL;DR:

• Make sure you have a DETAILED TOS in your ads.
• Roll the 3% fee into your asking price.
• Don't sweat bad reviews.

One final note: Don't EVER ship merchandise until payment has been received in full and cleared. I can't think of any business, online or off, that will release a product to a buyer until payment has been made in full.

Regards,
MrD.

 

[SkittleBunny]

What @Liquifin said. If a customer is giving you this much of a hard time, a bad review may be a given already even though you have handled things professionally; some people just can't be pleased. However, one poor review in a long line of good ones is easy to overlook.

It is in times like this when a shipping/payment policy comes in handy, so you may want to write one up with this experience in mind for the future.

Thanks,

Arthroverts

I actually do have a very clear TOS... they did not follow it from the beginning as far as send the fee or send it as gift, they were very quotey and would quote me on my own stuff, but never the part about 'adding 3% or send as gift/friend'.. paypal never held funds like this before and they were very insistent on getting the spiders before they would have it released from their end.. but I will call paypal and have it reversed and forget about the whole situation I suppose. I was selling them because I needed the money, but I think I'll stick to selling the T.vagans pair here for now..atleast folks here know how its done lol.

 

[Arthroverts]

I actually do have a very clear TOS... they did not follow it from the beginning as far as send the fee or send it as gift, they were very quotey and would quote me on my own stuff, but never the part about 'adding 3% or send as gift/friend'.. paypal never held funds like this before and they were very insistent on getting the spiders before they would have it released from their end.. but I will call paypal and have it reversed and forget about the whole situation I suppose. I was selling them because I needed the money, but I think I'll stick to selling the T.vagans pair here for now..atleast folks here know how its done lol.

If that's the case you should walk away as already suggested. Your TOS is your best friends in these situations, and if they aren't following it you have no obligation to carry on any further deal with them.

I wish I could be less critical of the buyers, but in this case they've gone too far to write it off as someone just having a bad day.

I hope it all works out for you @SkittleBunny.

Thanks,

Arthroverts

 

[SkittleBunny]

This is the last message I recieved from them; after I told them again and again that no one has ever done me this way on Paypal and it caused me to have to wait for my payroll, and since my printer refused to print his label i missed the ship date and had to unpack his order and my only heat pack went to waste (i was going to use these funds he was holding over my head to buy the things i need to continue to ship, like any starting business would)so i ordered better heat packs when I got paid Friday and told them I had to wait until the packs get here, and told them i can have an exact date very soon. Since its holidays and i cannot predict when my order will arrive, but the estimate was 3-5 days. Did I do something wrong here??? I understand waiting until last minute is depending on tech and that's bad since my printer crapped a brick, but they are very very very unforgiving.... every time i check their replies my heart goes crazy with anxiety and stress. Maybe my printer saved me instead? I mean <poop> happens and I am very honest (way too honest to this particular unforgiving fellow since y'all are right.. they 'cant be pleased..' ) i have nothing personal against them and was kind and honest, just another example of 'those' customers we all have to encounter at some point or another...

edit: ive done over 50 transactions and not a single one was held like this

Did your TOS state that you signed up for a new account and that the buyer would have to wait an additional 21 days for their funds to clear?

I was very clear that they could release the funds from their end, but they already knew, and refused. It was then I mentioned they would have to wait 21 days (since they refused to let it release until they recieved spiders and I refused to ship until I recieved payment) for paypal to release it automatically.
But by then I was pretty upset with them trying to run my business their way, otherwise I wouldn't had mentioned it at all..lol

In this case you did not receive the necessary funds to send the animal. Period. What are they going to complain about "I refuse to pay for anything until it arrives at my door"? Nope

Exactly!!! This eases my mind, lol

 

[Arachnophoric]

This is the last message I recieved from them; after I told them again and again that no one has ever done me this way on Paypal and it caused me to have to wait for my payroll, and since my printer refused to print his label i missed the ship date and had to unpack his order and my only heat pack went to waste (i was going to use these funds he was holding over my head to buy the things i need to continue to ship, like any starting business would)so i ordered better heat packs when I got paid Friday and told them I had to wait until the packs get here, and told them i can have an exact date very soon. Since its holidays and i cannot predict when my order will arrive, but the estimate was 3-5 days. Did I do something wrong here??? I understand waiting until last minute is depending on tech and that's bad since my printer crapped a brick, but they are very very very unforgiving.... every time i check their replies my heart goes crazy with anxiety and stress. Maybe my printer saved me instead? I mean <poop> happens and I am very honest (way too honest to this particular unforgiving fellow since y'all are right.. they 'cant be pleased..' ) i have nothing personal against them and was kind and honest, just another example of 'those' customers we all have to encounter at some point or another...

edit: ive done over 50 transactions and not a single one was held like this



I was very clear that they could release the funds from their end, but they already knew, and refused. It was then I mentioned they would have to wait 21 days (since they refused to let it release until they recieved spiders and I refused to ship until I recieved payment) for paypal to release it automatically.
But by then I was pretty upset with them trying to run my business their way, otherwise I wouldn't had mentioned it at all..lol



Exactly!!! This eases my mind, lol

"The way you run your business is not normal."

Yeeeeah, hell no.

Normal for people to receive payment when they recieved goods? At a grocery store, maybe. They should give it a try with Amazon or literally any other online store, see how that plays out.

Recieving payment prior to sending is the standard in both this hobby and many others, last I checked. I mean hey, what do I know, not like I haven't been at this for 4 years now or anything. Has this person not ever purchased tarantulas before??

I think you're dodging a bullet with this one if you decide not to go through with the sale. If they "very much would like the transaction to go through", then they can abide by your TOS, send the payment in full, accept that sometimes - stuff happens that prevents shipping that particular day!! And wait for appropriate time/weather for you to safely ship these living animals (if they're not trying to actually scam you and are annoyed now, a DOA would really be the topper on this messy cake). You might want to add in and remind them that had they followed the standard payment practices completely commonplace for this hobby, they'd already have their Ts and the whole situation would have been avoided; happy seller, happy customer, hopefully happy Ts, happy happy happy!

If they still badger and insist that you send them before giving payment/releasing the funds, tell them to take a hike (though perhaps in less aggressive wording - I'm just mildly irritated on your behalf that this person is putting you through the ringer and trying so desperately to twist your arm into sending them animals before paying). There are plenty more T. vagans in the sea.

 

[MrGhostMantis]

@SkittleBunny if they really are that rude don’t complete a transaction with them. I’ve had people email me and offer on a pair of mantids “pushilly” and I flat out refused them. Stand strong and defend yourself! No need to feel nervous! Call off the deal, block them, and put them on the “no sell” list. <edit> Even if they leave a bad review we are here to vouch for you! I have friends with depression and I know it’s hard and stressful but, as I said before be strong as we will always be here for you. Keep happy thoughts. This has a very high possibility of being a scam. If you send it to them you may never be payed.

 

[cold blood]

if they dont pay and you dont ship, a purchase has never been completed, therefore leaving a review wouldnt be applicable.

 

[lostbrane]

Bah. Beyond everything else that has been said, that last message got to me. Let's not wait for good weather? Screw them! They don't have the t's best interests at heart!

 

[MrGhostMantis]

Yeah, they would probably hoard them. Or breed them, get the sac, euthanize the parents, then sell all the babies for MORE money. Do NOT sell to them if they are not willing to wait.

 

[Arachnophoric]

Yeah, they would probably hoard them. Or breed them, get the sac, euthanize the parents, then sell all the babies for MORE money. Do NOT sell to them if they are not willing to wait.

Why in the world would you think someone would euthanize the parents of a sac?

 

[GalacticFurai]

Why in the world would you think someone would euthanize the parents of a sac?

To remove the evidence, of course!

but really tho why?

 

[MrGhostMantis]

Dunno. I have known people who have done that after because they don’t want to care for babies and adults but the want babies. I always try to convince them to give me the parents but nope.

 

[Brachyfan]

That's a shame that this happened to you. Especially selling the Ts to pay bills and having to wait that long for funds.

I don't ship tarantulas but I run my own business. And I gotta say No cash no product. I deal with it all the time. You did the right thing if you killed that C.O.D. sale!

I used to record albums for bands at a decent price. Got sick of people deciding not to pay me lol. "We can't pay you till the album release party so give us the tapes and we will "donate" all the cash we get at the release party to you". Uh...NO!
You don't get the tapes until you settle the debt lol.

Now I only mix and master peoples albums. I'm less broke and don't end up with months worth of debt to collect from deadbeats!

 

[Arachnophoric]

Dunno. I have known people who have done that after because they don’t want to care for babies and adults but the want babies. I always try to convince them to give me the parents but nope.

That makes absolutely no sense since two more Ts on top of a ton of slings is maybe a minute of difference in care and maintenance. And euthanizing an adult female is completely moronic since she can lay another sac and produce more slings. That's without even looking at the moral issues with doing so. You must know some incredibly dense people.

 

[MrGhostMantis]

I do. Not really friends since they did that. I kinda back off of them.