Sling somehow escaped it's enclosure?! (please help)

Phobiuh

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Jul 4, 2018
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Hello everyone,

Wanted to start off by saying I am ready for all the hate I am potentially about to get... I know how brutal some people on here can be on any novice that asks the simplest questions, and I don't think what I am about to post is any different that that.

I have had an A. Mooreae since about the last few days of February/start of March and the little guy was doing excellent -- he ate on his second day here, was very alert when I made sudden movements, and even molted once under my supervision... even though I did not notice it initially until I went to go remove leftover food from his enclosure as he was very tiny at only .33 of an inch. Everything was fine until March 31st, when it decided to burrow but not leave tracks onto where it could have went; the burrow looked closed off even though it had just started burrowing. I let it be for nearly two months, although I left food outside of the small burrow it had created every single week which went untouched and even though I thought nothing of it as it could have been preparing/ to molt, I still had a very bad feeling about it.

Finally, today, my curiosity got to me and I began to attempt to dig the little guy out. Unfortunately, I could not find anything after I had dumped out all of the dirt into a bucket in case it decided to make a run from it when opening its enclosure, like it always did when I first got it. I am absolutely clueless on how this could have happened??? I always made sure that the T was in the enclosure before closing it (even the last day I saw it, March 31st), made the smallest holes for his deli cup using a button pin, and tightly sealed it every time I opened it because I understand how strong they are.

Does anyone have any idea what could have happened or what I can do? to help locate it?? If it helps, he was housed in a 4 1/2 oz deli cup with small button pin-sized holes for air flow. His enclosure sat on top of my modem for heat (to help them grow faster and get them out of the delicate sling stage, I have also kept my other 3 Ts the same way and none are experiencing problems).

Should I just give up hope in finding it ever again? I put all of the substrate back in, in hopes that it would miraculously turn up again one day. Yes, it was an A. Mooreae and although they are very expensive, money is not the issue for me... I just want the little guy to be OK.
 

CJJon

Arachnokrólewicz
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601
My vote it dried up and died and you just missed it when you tore through the sub.

Pics would be helpful.
 

Phobiuh

Arachnopeon
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My vote it dried up and died and you just missed it when you tore through the sub.

Pics would be helpful.
Thanks for your reply. That was also my guess, but I'm really hoping that wasn't the case. I've always kept the substrate damp for it to drink and while I was digging it up, the substrate was still moist... there were a few clumped up pieces that I did not dare disrupt, but other than that no sign on the little guy. :sad:

I have pictures of the T and its enclosure on this thread I made when I first got it. The only things I've changed since then is get rid of the bottle cap water dish and made vent holes at the top.

 

CJJon

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Frankly, your first mistake was digging it up. I'd carefully check every grain of substrate. If it wasn't dried out from the heat of the modem and the new holes you added were not too big, it probably is still in the substrate.
 

PidderPeets

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Thanks for your reply. That was also my guess, but I'm really hoping that wasn't the case. I've always kept the substrate damp for it to drink and while I was digging it up, the substrate was still moist... there were a few clumped up pieces that I did not dare disrupt, but other than that no sign on the little guy. :sad:

I have pictures of the T and its enclosure on this thread I made when I first got it. The only things I've changed since then is get rid of the bottle cap water dish and made vent holes at the top.

Were the holes in the vial you ended up keeping it in the same size as the holes in the giant enclosure you originally had it in? If they were the same size, I really don't think it could have escaped from a ventilation hole. Are you sure you didn't miss it when you dug up the enclosure?

I'd bet it's either still in there, or it died and you didn't notice the body because it was decomposed.

I really hope you find it and it's alive and well
 

Phobiuh

Arachnopeon
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Jul 4, 2018
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Were the holes in the vial you ended up keeping it in the same size as the holes in the giant enclosure you originally had it in? If they were the same size, I really don't think it could have escaped from a ventilation hole. Are you sure you didn't miss it when you dug up the enclosure?

I'd bet it's either still in there, or it died and you didn't notice the body because it was decomposed.

I really hope you find it and it's alive and well
I ended up moving it back into the 4 1/2 oz deli cup as it was very bolty and didn't want to end up losing it sooner than later. IMO, it is impossible for it to have escaped through the ventilation holes as they were very tiny, even tinier than a pen point and I made sure that the ventilation holes were smaller than the T's carapace.

I am positive I did not miss it when emptying the enclosure. Nonetheless, I have put all the dirt back into the deli cup in hopes that it will somehow reappear again.. I will give it some time before I decide to sift through it again.
Frankly, your first mistake was digging it up. I'd carefully check every grain of substrate. If it wasn't dried out from the heat of the modem and the new holes you added were not too big, it probably is still in the substrate.
I understand it is a huge mistake to dig up a burrowed T, but I had a bad gut feeling that something was wrong with this particular one as it has not given me even the slightest sign of it being alive for nearly two months now. I have two other Ts that burrow (Vagans and epicuraenum) and they are doing very well, have even doubled in size and are showing color since I got them. I am really hoping that it is still in the substrate and I missed it somehow, fingers crossed!

No one can tell you what happened, only you can.
Obviously, I just wanted to hear some thoughts and what could have happened under the conditions I've posted so that I can brainstorm and try to locate it again, if possible...
 

mack1855

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Water?.dish/bowl?.Spraying lightly.Are you saying it was 2 months with no water?
Im not grilling you just trying to understand what you were doing?
I get so tired of folks coming on AB,and asking questions,or wondering what happened to my T.And then those people get offended when people offer advise,or simply asking questions.
It sounds like it died of dehydration,and dried up.
 

viper69

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Obviously, I just wanted to hear some thoughts and what could have happened under the conditions I've posted so that I can brainstorm and try to locate it again, if possible...
Thanks for clarifying. It could be anything from the fact that you dumped in the garbage by accident, died in molt, dehydrated, escaped....I can't imagine you haven't thought of these already though.
 

Phobiuh

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Jul 4, 2018
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Water?.dish/bowl?.Spraying lightly.Are you saying it was 2 months with no water?
Im not grilling you just trying to understand what you were doing?
I get so tired of folks coming on AB,and asking questions,or wondering what happened to my T.And then those people get offended when people offer advise,or simply asking questions.
It sounds like it died of dehydration,and dried up.
If you read one of my prior posts, I said I kept the substrate damp using a syringe multiple times a week, I'm not sure where you're getting it went 2 months without water. I am also not sure if you were referring to me when you mentioned people being offended but I am not offended at all? Maybe you're misunderstanding or can't read...
Thanks for clarifying. It could be anything from the fact that you dumped in the garbage by accident, died in molt, dehydrated, escaped....I can't imagine you haven't thought of these already though.
I am also afraid of the fact that I could have dumped it in the garbage by accident. Before it burrowed and went missing, I took out its water dish so that it doesn't accidentally fall on it while burrowing. Additionally, I took out the small water dish because I found it floating in it as if it was trying to drown itself. I know this is not possible, but it spooked me and I have stuck with just using a syringe to dampen its substrate ever since.

I checked the water cap thoroughly before disposing it and clearly saw the T a few days after disposing the water cap.. I'm so confused. And yes, I have thought about most if not all of these already, I guess I'll just give it some time and hope it appears somehow.
 

jaw6053

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Dec 1, 2019
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Sorry to hear that. Now do you see why Coldblood suggested you use a 1oz condiment cup in your original thread ?
 

cold blood

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From your description, it couldn't have escaped.

But this thread illustrates why I always promote smaller cups.

These 1 and 2oz cups create a small enough environment that the doesn't feel the need to burrow, and when they do, there isn't enough depth for them to just burrow away that deep. The result is a sling that is easily monitored, so when something goes wrong, at least you know.

Most expect their slings to burrow, many are surprised and worried and are told, just leave it.....fine advice, it really is, but....when a sling is burrowed away, how do you know if something is wrong? How do you help what you cant see?

Sure, burrowing slings are natural....so is a very low survival rate, ignore natural, work for ideal.

I would really sift through the sub to look for remnants, drop it in water, t parts should float. But don't beat yourself up, you didn't see a problem, and couldn't have anticipated one...and you didn't do anything different than almost anyone would have advised or done themselves (aside from smaller housing).
 

Phobiuh

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Jul 4, 2018
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Sorry to hear that. Now do you see why Coldblood suggested you use a 1oz condiment cup in your original thread ?
Yes... very unfortunate situation, although it is not the only sling that I've kept in an "oversized" enclosure and has burrowed. I also have an epicuraenum and klaasi in similar sized enclosures. Both have been doing really well and the epicuraenum has left traces for its burrow, so I never worry as to where it could be.
 

mjzheng

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You'd be shocked at how tiny a 1/4-1/3" spider can be when it's in a stress curl . I kept a baby Nhandu in a 1 oz cup and when I first got it STILL could barely see it if it was curled . I'd really check hard again . Fingers crossed for you
 

CJJon

Arachnokrólewicz
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601
So...say you found the T. Then what? Was it in trouble? Is it now in trouble and it wasn't before you dug it up? What does that even mean? What "help" would the T need?

I see no valid reason to dig up a tarantula. To what end?
 

Phobiuh

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You'd be shocked at how tiny a 1/4-1/3" spider can be when it's in a stress curl . I kept a baby Nhandu in a 1 oz cup and when I first got it STILL could barely see it if it was curled . I'd really check hard again . Fingers crossed for you
Thank you for the optimism... at this point I'm not sure if I should check again so quickly, if at all even. Should I just let the container be? If so, how long before I give up hope? I have already compacted everything down again and dropped a few water droplets into the substrate.

Thank you guys for your help!
 

jaw6053

Arachnobaron
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Yes... very unfortunate situation, although it is not the only sling that I've kept in an "oversized" enclosure and has burrowed. I also have an epicuraenum and klaasi in similar sized enclosures. Both have been doing really well and the epicuraenum has left traces for its burrow, so I never worry as to where it could be.
Yes I understand and my post was not to say you did something wrong. I just wanted you to see the benefit of using a 1oz condiment cup in this case which is being able to observe your T at anytime and know what it's doing, where it's at, etc.....
 

PidderPeets

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I ended up moving it back into the 4 1/2 oz deli cup as it was very bolty and didn't want to end up losing it sooner than later. IMO, it is impossible for it to have escaped through the ventilation holes as they were very tiny, even tinier than a pen point and I made sure that the ventilation holes were smaller than the T's carapace.

I am positive I did not miss it when emptying the enclosure. Nonetheless, I have put all the dirt back into the deli cup in hopes that it will somehow reappear again.. I will give it some time before I decide to sift through it again.
If you put it back in that giant deli cup (relative to its size, of course), unfortunately I think that just increases the odds that it could have died and you missed the body. Though most people on here will argue tooth and nail that a buried tarantula will ALWAYS come out if and when it is hungry (and I agree with that about 99% of the time), I do think there are rare instances where it will stay buried even to its detriment. I believe it was Tom Moran who has stated this with a certain species in his collection, but I think it is possible with other species as well.

Slings are small and insecure in their surroundings. In a large environment/enclosure, they hide. A particularly skittish sling might be too afraid to go out. With my very first sling (a G. pulchripes), I had it in a larger enclosure than I would go with now, and it dug a burrow and sealed itself away. After I believe 3 months of not seeing it, I caved in and poked a tiny hole where I had last seen its burrow, even though I knew I shouldn't. But much to my surprise, she grabbed the toothpick I used and tried with all her might to pull it in with her. After I got that from her, I dropped in a small cricket, and she ran out of her burrow and tackled it with gusto. She was clearly very interested in food, yet she didn't open up her den.

Since then, I keep any small sling in the standard 2 oz deli cup with just enough substrate to prevent burrowing. I know it's extremely unlikely for them to die from not coming out of their burrow, but considering all the other pros involved with keeping them in smaller enclosures, it just seems like the smartest move
 

Phobiuh

Arachnopeon
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Yes I understand and my post was not to say you did something wrong. I just wanted you to see the benefit of using a 1oz condiment cup in this case which is being able to observe your T at anytime and know what it's doing, where it's at, etc.....
No worries, I understand what you were trying to say. I do know one thing's for certain though, if I were to get anymore tarantulas in the future, I will never go with a sling smaller than .5 an inch again...
If you put it back in that giant deli cup (relative to its size, of course), unfortunately I think that just increases the odds that it could have died and you missed the body. Though most people on here will argue tooth and nail that a buried tarantula will ALWAYS come out if and when it is hungry (and I agree with that about 99% of the time), I do think there are rare instances where it will stay buried even to its detriment. I believe it was Tom Moran who has stated this with a certain species in his collection, but I think it is possible with other species as well.

Slings are small and insecure in their surroundings. In a large environment/enclosure, they hide. A particularly skittish sling might be too afraid to go out. With my very first sling (a G. pulchripes), I had it in a larger enclosure than I would go with now, and it dug a burrow and sealed itself away. After I believe 3 months of not seeing it, I caved in and poked a tiny hole where I had last seen its burrow, even though I knew I shouldn't. But much to my surprise, she grabbed the toothpick I used and tried with all her might to pull it in with her. After I got that from her, I dropped in a small cricket, and she ran out of her burrow and tackled it with gusto. She was clearly very interested in food, yet she didn't open up her den.

Since then, I keep any small sling in the standard 2 oz deli cup with just enough substrate to prevent burrowing. I know it's extremely unlikely for them to die from not coming out of their burrow, but considering all the other pros involved with keeping them in smaller enclosures, it just seems like the smartest move
I did have it in something smaller for a brief period as suggested by Cold Blood... the only reason I moved it back is because it was very bolty and fast, so I thought I'd give it a bit more room and be able to catch it if it decided to bolt at any point when opening its enclosure in the future. It was recommended I went with something a little larger than a 2 oz deli container by an experienced keeper, someone who also had a mooreae. I am now deeply regretting not leaving it in the smaller container... I don't think I will ever get a sling as small as the mooreae again, very unfortunate event that has transpired here and I cannot stop blaming myself for things I could have done better.
 
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