- Joined
- Dec 22, 2004
- Messages
- 3,885
In the right circumstances (humidity, bad container) yes, certainly. If kept safely in a hight box with clean, smooth walls - not before the next ice age (I wonder what that movie is gonna be about
)
Roaches - Blatta lateralis
- Thread starter Charlie_Scorp
- Start date
)
- Joined
- Oct 20, 2006
- Messages
- 146
Oh dear...and my thread started so well.....lol
No, Im still confident they're a good choice but only time will tell. Too late now anyway..they'll be here tomorrow and the fun shall begin. I'll let you know what my guys think...
..lolNo, Im still confident they're a good choice but only time will tell. Too late now anyway..they'll be here tomorrow and the fun shall begin. I'll let you know what my guys think...
- Joined
- Dec 22, 2004
- Messages
- 3,885
Don't worry. They're very good roaches. Just work out some safe procedure for feeding so that non of them escape while you try feeding them off. That is in my opinion the only real problem with those. The main thing to remember: NEVER!!!! grab them by the legs to transfer them into the tank! Every second time you do that the legs will rip off and the roach will still be out of sight in no time.Oh dear...and my thread started so well...
No, Im still confident they're a good choice but only time will tell. Too late now anyway..they'll be here tomorrow and the fun shall begin. I'll let you know what my guys think...
- Joined
- Oct 20, 2006
- Messages
- 146
Oh dear, Im clearly going to be posting in a month asking how the hell I get rid of 2000 roaches in my house..lol!!
Fear not! I shall be cautious..
Fear not! I shall be cautious..
- Joined
- Sep 21, 2006
- Messages
- 666
with respect to scorpion eating... a lot of my scorpions don't like being watched! especially my little h. franzwerneri scorplings... in the spirit of ambush predators, they run like hell if they run into anything else moving in their containers... however, if they're in their hide with their chelae just barely sticking out, and something ventures near, that's an entirely different story!
i think that as long as they aren't being stressed by light, or having a large unknown thing looming over them (a person), scorpions are actually quite good at detecting prey. just as long as it doesn't burrow directly into the substrate as i hear b. dubia are prone to doing!
also, personally, i guess depends on where you live, but i just don't see b. lateralis infesting unless you live in a warm humid climate... without some sort of substrate to lay their oothecae on/in they dry out way too quickly, which i think really limits their ability to infest.. i would be much much more worried about an n. cinerea infestation given the glass-climbing and live-birthing!
the occasional b. lateralis (as well as cricket) escapee eventually finds its way to my bathroom due to the higher humidity, but guess what? there's nothing in my bathroom for them to eat!
cheers!
- munis
i think that as long as they aren't being stressed by light, or having a large unknown thing looming over them (a person), scorpions are actually quite good at detecting prey. just as long as it doesn't burrow directly into the substrate as i hear b. dubia are prone to doing!
also, personally, i guess depends on where you live, but i just don't see b. lateralis infesting unless you live in a warm humid climate... without some sort of substrate to lay their oothecae on/in they dry out way too quickly, which i think really limits their ability to infest.. i would be much much more worried about an n. cinerea infestation given the glass-climbing and live-birthing!
the occasional b. lateralis (as well as cricket) escapee eventually finds its way to my bathroom due to the higher humidity, but guess what? there's nothing in my bathroom for them to eat!
cheers!
- munis
what was this thead about?
i had forgotten the original post! i have to share my experience with B lateralis. [they look an awful lot like the nasty infesting roaches! those are usually Blattella germanica, the german cockroach, in my area. ]
B lateralis will definely get away from you sooner or later. they are good at getting out of containers even if they can't climb the walls (not very well, at least). also, as Cirith Ungol noted, they will drop their legs to get away, and it is very tempting to try a transfer with a leg grip - almost always ends in escape. finally, they are fast! and have a good chance of outrunning you to reach safety.
however, if you have a warm enclosure that you use to house your animals, they seem to stick around and try to get back into where the warmth humidity and food is. i have had escapee B lateralis end up in my dubias mysteriously- figure out that they were climbing into the container, under the insulation i had on the outside.
so, on to my solution. [actually, i have a big problem with Argentine Ants (supercolony in our neighborhood) and so my solution is mainly intended to deal with them, but also fixes the roaches. I use boric acid powder, a common ingredient in roach dusting poison. i put a layer of the dust entirely around the shelves that house both my roach colonies and my Ts. it stops the ants from getting in and kils any roaches that cross it, either on their way in or out. if a roach gets loose while i am feeding the Ts - table close by - then they invariably head for the shelve and cross the boric acid. it takes a while for them to die, but they are a goner for sure if they cross over the powder.
i was worried that some boric acid would get into my containers, or into my Ts containers, carried by ants or roaches, or from my handling. in about 6 months of using it, i have not noticed an ill effects and everybody, including the roaches in the colonies, are thriving. boric acid is recognized as one of the most effective roach control strategies, both because of its relative low toxicity to humans and other animals, and to its long residence once applied.
i have had a few ant incursions - I HATE THAT - but it is always because the sneaky devils found a new way around the boric acid. they have been known to travel long distances on electrical cords to bridge the boric acid moat. :evil:
so, without boric acid, i would have to sell all my widows and Ts because they would be ant food in about a day, any time of year, if it weren't for the boric acid. that reminds me, i need to buy another bag of it (i have used about 2 oz in 6 months - not bad). As a side benefit, i am absolutely certain that any roaches that escape will be history.
another big difference between the Blattella germanica and the B lateralis that makes them less likely to infest is that the B germanica reportedly carry their egg cases until just before they hatch, whereas the B lateralis just drop theirs. in my experience, they dry out pretty fast and few, if any, would ever hatch (both due to the dryness and low temperatures). even in my colony, i need to collect the egg cases to keep them from shriveling up from the dry (partially due to the heating i use too probably).
So, i am not worried about infestation. Fortunately, my wife buys it for now. i am in trouble (and so are the roaches!) if one shows up anywhere else in our house!
Oh, and the Ts love them, as do the widows. the only critter i have that absolutely won't eat them is my trapdoor spider. i haven't seen him to ask him why though!
i had forgotten the original post! i have to share my experience with B lateralis. [they look an awful lot like the nasty infesting roaches! those are usually Blattella germanica, the german cockroach, in my area. ]
B lateralis will definely get away from you sooner or later. they are good at getting out of containers even if they can't climb the walls (not very well, at least). also, as Cirith Ungol noted, they will drop their legs to get away, and it is very tempting to try a transfer with a leg grip - almost always ends in escape. finally, they are fast! and have a good chance of outrunning you to reach safety.
however, if you have a warm enclosure that you use to house your animals, they seem to stick around and try to get back into where the warmth humidity and food is. i have had escapee B lateralis end up in my dubias mysteriously- figure out that they were climbing into the container, under the insulation i had on the outside.
so, on to my solution. [actually, i have a big problem with Argentine Ants (supercolony in our neighborhood) and so my solution is mainly intended to deal with them, but also fixes the roaches. I use boric acid powder, a common ingredient in roach dusting poison. i put a layer of the dust entirely around the shelves that house both my roach colonies and my Ts. it stops the ants from getting in and kils any roaches that cross it, either on their way in or out. if a roach gets loose while i am feeding the Ts - table close by - then they invariably head for the shelve and cross the boric acid. it takes a while for them to die, but they are a goner for sure if they cross over the powder.
i was worried that some boric acid would get into my containers, or into my Ts containers, carried by ants or roaches, or from my handling. in about 6 months of using it, i have not noticed an ill effects and everybody, including the roaches in the colonies, are thriving. boric acid is recognized as one of the most effective roach control strategies, both because of its relative low toxicity to humans and other animals, and to its long residence once applied.
i have had a few ant incursions - I HATE THAT - but it is always because the sneaky devils found a new way around the boric acid. they have been known to travel long distances on electrical cords to bridge the boric acid moat. :evil:
so, without boric acid, i would have to sell all my widows and Ts because they would be ant food in about a day, any time of year, if it weren't for the boric acid. that reminds me, i need to buy another bag of it (i have used about 2 oz in 6 months - not bad). As a side benefit, i am absolutely certain that any roaches that escape will be history.
another big difference between the Blattella germanica and the B lateralis that makes them less likely to infest is that the B germanica reportedly carry their egg cases until just before they hatch, whereas the B lateralis just drop theirs. in my experience, they dry out pretty fast and few, if any, would ever hatch (both due to the dryness and low temperatures). even in my colony, i need to collect the egg cases to keep them from shriveling up from the dry (partially due to the heating i use too probably).
So, i am not worried about infestation. Fortunately, my wife buys it for now. i am in trouble (and so are the roaches!) if one shows up anywhere else in our house!
Oh, and the Ts love them, as do the widows. the only critter i have that absolutely won't eat them is my trapdoor spider. i haven't seen him to ask him why though!
I think whether they will infest or not depends on your house/lifestyle.
I've found that the females won't lay eggs when it gets into the mid 70'sF. They eggs don't really hatch in the mid 70's either and definitely not in the low 70's. They also need fairly high humidity to hatch. 78F seems to be about the low point for reproduction IME. How well they do would depend on whether they had a food and water source. They definitely need a good water source to grow.
If you have a heated humid bug/herp room I guess the eggs could (?) hatch. Survival of the nymphs would depend on a good water and food source. If your house is pretty clean and you don't leave dog/cat/rodent food out I wouldn't be too concerned.
I've got a few hundred nymphs that I keep in the 62-69F range and they have probably molted once in the past 3 months. The majority of them haven't even molted at those temps yet. If you're in England I definitely wouldn't be too concerned.
I've found that the females won't lay eggs when it gets into the mid 70'sF. They eggs don't really hatch in the mid 70's either and definitely not in the low 70's. They also need fairly high humidity to hatch. 78F seems to be about the low point for reproduction IME. How well they do would depend on whether they had a food and water source. They definitely need a good water source to grow.
If you have a heated humid bug/herp room I guess the eggs could (?) hatch. Survival of the nymphs would depend on a good water and food source. If your house is pretty clean and you don't leave dog/cat/rodent food out I wouldn't be too concerned.
I've got a few hundred nymphs that I keep in the 62-69F range and they have probably molted once in the past 3 months. The majority of them haven't even molted at those temps yet. If you're in England I definitely wouldn't be too concerned.
- Joined
- Aug 10, 2005
- Messages
- 137
I LOVE BLAT LATS!!! With that said here is the main reason I love them:
They don't burrow into the substrate, like some roaches, when you put them in your T's/scorp's cage.
Out of the dozen or so types of roaches I raise these are my absolute favorite feeder roaches.
Rizzolo: I use the same barrier method against ants and escapees except I use Sevin dust and it does the trick.
In regard to scorps eating them: The only scorp I had a problem with were my WC O. wahlbergii (sp) and I solved that by pulling the roaches heads off and putting it right at the entrance to the scorps burrow and then they ate them like candy.
- Joined
- Oct 20, 2006
- Messages
- 146
Well, mine arrived today safe and sound. I guess there must be 100 of them in all. The first thing that struck me is that they're quite handsome little fellows. I think they look really cool!
The bad thing is that I dont think I have any adults. Judging from this I would estimate that I have 40% 4rd instar, 30% 3rd and 30% 2nd with maybe 2-3 5th. How long do you think I will have to wait in this case for them to mature and for me to get some egg cases?? Im keeping them quite warm so hope this will help.
Thanks in advance,
Charlie
The bad thing is that I dont think I have any adults. Judging from this I would estimate that I have 40% 4rd instar, 30% 3rd and 30% 2nd with maybe 2-3 5th. How long do you think I will have to wait in this case for them to mature and for me to get some egg cases?? Im keeping them quite warm so hope this will help.
Thanks in advance,
Charlie
- Joined
- Sep 21, 2006
- Messages
- 666
2-3 months depending on your temperatures i'd say... if you're in a hurry, and are capable of ensuring humidity, you can go as high as 100*F
cheers!
- munis
cheers!
- munis
Well, mine arrived today safe and sound. I guess there must be 100 of them in all. The first thing that struck me is that they're quite handsome little fellows. I think they look really cool!
The bad thing is that I dont think I have any adults. Judging from this I would estimate that I have 40% 4rd instar, 30% 3rd and 30% 2nd with maybe 2-3 5th. How long do you think I will have to wait in this case for them to mature and for me to get some egg cases?? Im keeping them quite warm so hope this will help.
Thanks in advance,
Charlie
- Joined
- Oct 20, 2006
- Messages
- 146
Im also a day gecko keeper. Humidity is my middle name!
Okay, thats a bit of a shame but I'll whack the temp up and see how I fare.
BTW, does anyone know is these can be pathenogenic or whether there is a wingless male morph?
Okay, thats a bit of a shame but I'll whack the temp up and see how I fare.
BTW, does anyone know is these can be pathenogenic or whether there is a wingless male morph?
your new B lats
that sure looks like a mature male on the far left of the picture. the one next to it might be a mature female, but looks small still. you might begin getting egg sacs before too long, but it will take several months for the colony to really kick in. for one thing, the eggs take forever to hatch out!
At 6 months, mine has exploded and my wife gave me the ultimatum to get rid of some. i cleaned out the cage last night because i finally got bunch of new egg flats. i was astounded at how many nymphs i have now (probably a half-gallon of small to medium nymphs! Unfortunately, my 6-year-old told his mom that i have "thousands of roaches," which is not an exaggeration. unfortunate use of words though!!
Be careful how you feed out of your colony. if you feed out to heavily, and indiscriminately, you will really slow it down. Best not to feed from it until you have egg cases hatching. Don't feed off the mature females (hard not to because they are so much fatter than the males) and leave some mature males. Try and get as many mature roaches as possible in your colony and feed off only the nymphs until it gets rockin'.
i use the egg case incubators and i attribute the success of my colony to them. otherwise, i don't think nearly as many egg cases would hatch. there are other benefits too: you can separate the generations so that you don't have to fool around to sort them out for feeding, you have less intergenerational inbreeding (not sure this matters) and you can more easily keep your original colony intact and then rotate in the next generation as the originals get old. then you have to have multiple containers though - too much hassle for me.
that sure looks like a mature male on the far left of the picture. the one next to it might be a mature female, but looks small still. you might begin getting egg sacs before too long, but it will take several months for the colony to really kick in. for one thing, the eggs take forever to hatch out!
At 6 months, mine has exploded and my wife gave me the ultimatum to get rid of some. i cleaned out the cage last night because i finally got bunch of new egg flats. i was astounded at how many nymphs i have now (probably a half-gallon of small to medium nymphs! Unfortunately, my 6-year-old told his mom that i have "thousands of roaches," which is not an exaggeration. unfortunate use of words though!!
Be careful how you feed out of your colony. if you feed out to heavily, and indiscriminately, you will really slow it down. Best not to feed from it until you have egg cases hatching. Don't feed off the mature females (hard not to because they are so much fatter than the males) and leave some mature males. Try and get as many mature roaches as possible in your colony and feed off only the nymphs until it gets rockin'.
i use the egg case incubators and i attribute the success of my colony to them. otherwise, i don't think nearly as many egg cases would hatch. there are other benefits too: you can separate the generations so that you don't have to fool around to sort them out for feeding, you have less intergenerational inbreeding (not sure this matters) and you can more easily keep your original colony intact and then rotate in the next generation as the originals get old. then you have to have multiple containers though - too much hassle for me.
- Joined
- Sep 21, 2006
- Messages
- 666
i'm experimenting with 2" of soil (NYR's "Inverte-mix") substrate in my main colony, seems to be good at holding moisture and virtually odourless... no conclusive results yet, but seems promising!
cheers!
- munis
cheers!
- munis
Just wanted to add that you made a good decision buying roaches even if they take time to rear, I may follow suit... I had a cricket drown in a gatoreade bottle cap last night, the scorpion is smaller than the cricket and he gets out of the cap just fine, pretty ridiclous huh.
- Joined
- Oct 22, 2006
- Messages
- 2,301
While my scorps may look down on lats with distain, I'd like to point out that my uropygid (vinegaroon) loves them. Must be closer to tarantulas than scorpions .
.- Joined
- Dec 14, 2005
- Messages
- 112
i'm currently waiting for the arrival of 100 b. laterallis and am hoping that my Ts will take them down with no problems. i currently am using mealworms with no problem but i am getting bored of not being able to watch them hunt their food. i did not want crickets so opted for roaches. here's to starting a colony.
- Joined
- Jun 5, 2006
- Messages
- 456
How long does it takes the egg case to hatch?
thanks.
-.Raul
thanks.
-.Raul