researching 1st tarantula

[Chris LXXIX]

Im still a bit confused about the breed / species thing. I definitely need to do more research.

Forget about the "breed" word when Theraphosidae are concerned is a good first step ;-)

 

[AmberDawnDays]

Forget about the "breed" word when Theraphosidae are concerned is a good first step ;-)

Thanks!

 

[Andrea82]

Thanks!

Don't beat yourself up about it
I think it is great you're doing research and asking questions before you get a T!

And welcome to the addiction...there is no such thing as keeping just one

 

[Walker253]

I think I definitely will get a g. pulchra eventually, but maybe it won't be my 1ST one. There are so many that I want.
Just curious what you love most about your g. pulchra?

She's stunning. Other colors aside, that velvet black appearance stands out. She's always out. She eats so well and is so docile.

I agree about the jet black. That's what really pulls me towards wanting one so much. I hear they are expensive. Does $400 for a fully grown female sound right? That's what I've found.

Do you have a recommendation for where I can purchase one? I have gone back and forth a bit, but I know I want one for sure.

I'm still thinking it will be a few months before I can swing it though. I gotta get through Christmas first!

$400 seems about $100 to high. I've seen 2 at $300 recently. However, they are highly desirable and the market could easily be $400 because people don't want to sell larger females causing them to be much rarer. In addition to that, it's a species that's harder to breed anyway and they don't have large numbers of slings.

I have the same issue with Christmas. Good thing, if you found that tarantula before Christmas, you'll find one after Christmas.

 

[EulersK]

Im still a bit confused about the breed / species thing. I definitely need to do more research.

I was also unsure about how many were actually captive breed or not because while researching some said captive breed and some didn't.

Breeds apply to an animal of the same species. With dogs, a schnauzer and a chihuahua are the same species (Canis lupus familiaris), so they are breeds. Simply a variant of genetics within the same species. With tarantulas, they are literally different animals - like a lion compared to a tiger. Sure, they're closely related, but they are very much different animals.

In taxonomy, all tarantulas are of the family Theraphosidae. The next step down is genus (plural "genera"), and the next step down from that is species. How we refer to tarantulas actually makes life very easy. We refer to them by their scientific name (not "Latin" name, as not all names are in Latin!). The scientific name will always tell you the genus and the species. You'll notice that members of the same genus look very much alike, but again, they are different species.

For example, here is a Brachypelma emilia:

And here is a Brachypelma boehmei:

So, just by the name, you know that they are closely related. Notice the similar appearance (other than coloration). Stocky build, large abdomen, flat carapace, and so on.

-----------------

As another example, here is a Chilobrachys fimbriatus:

And here is a Chilobrachys andersoni (not the best picture, I know):

With them, you'll notice very long legs, a teardrop shaped abdomen, and a small carapace-to-body ratio. Again, closely related, but different species.

----------------

One more example. Here is a Euathlus sp. "Green":

And here is a Euathlus truculentus:

I'll leave pointing out similarities to you. Notice how on the first species I brought up something new - the species name is in quotations, and it's not scientific at all. When a new species is discovered, it can often take over a decade to formally recognize the animal as a unique species. Just because the coloration is different doesn't mean it's another species. While research is being done, we treat the "Green" as the species to avoid cross-breeding with other species. You would pronounce this as "Euathlus species green", and it's a very common trait in the hobby. There's not much money to be had in tarantula taxonomy, so many species are stuck in limbo with these pseudo-scientific names until someone gets around to studying them. A great example is actually this species. There is another species called Euathlus sp. "Blue" that looks darn near identical, except the femurs are blue instead of green. They very well may be the same species and simply color morphs, but we don't know, so for now we keep them separate. More commonly, it's not the coloration of the spider that is referenced, but rather where specifically it was discovered.

Unlike breeds, different species should never be bred with each other. Only members of the same species should mate. This is to ensure the integrity of the bloodline, as a large part of this hobby is conservation. Some of the species we keep are critically endangered in the wild, and ensuring clean bloodlines is the only way to keep them from blinking out of existence... so to speak. You can learn more about scientific names in a short video here and you can learn more about localities here.

Finally, concerning captive bred versus wild caught... it depends on the species. Some species are almost exclusively wild caught if you bought it as an adult - G. rosea and A. chalcodes come to mind. The commonality of them in the wild combined with their ridiculously slow growth rate makes them prone to being wild caught. This also makes them cheaper (learn more about the value of spiders here). Others grow very quickly, such as B. vagans, so you're pretty much guaranteed to get a captive bred spider. At the end of the day, one is not necessarily better than the other. Wild caught spiders have the downfall of possibly being infected with parasites or actually gravid ("pregnant"), but that's about all.

As I'm sure you can gather by now, this is less about having a pet and more about having a little piece of education living with you. These creatures aren't for everyone, but just given your desire to learn and research, I think you'll fit in quite nicely here. You've got some great beginner species there, here's a few more to consider before you make the jump. Enjoy your eight-legged buddy, learn from it, and never stop researching in this hobby. More and more information is uncovered every year, and this hobby will definitely keep you busy!

Welcome to the hobby. You'll want to buy some shelves.

 

[Chris LXXIX]

Welcome to the hobby. You'll want to buy some shelves.

You deserved an 'award' rating only for that statement. But don't forget also:
"Getting started in the tarantula hobby is rough. I get it. I do, really. But you're likely trying too hard."

 

[AmberDawnDays]

Breeds apply to an animal of the same species. With dogs, a schnauzer and a chihuahua are the same species (Canis lupus familiaris), so they are breeds. Simply a variant of genetics within the same species. With tarantulas, they are literally different animals - like a lion compared to a tiger. Sure, they're closely related, but they are very much different animals.

In taxonomy, all tarantulas are of the family Theraphosidae. The next step down is genus (plural "genera"), and the next step down from that is species. How we refer to tarantulas actually makes life very easy. We refer to them by their scientific name (not "Latin" name, as not all names are in Latin!). The scientific name will always tell you the genus and the species. You'll notice that members of the same genus look very much alike, but again, they are different species.

For example, here is a Brachypelma emilia:
View attachment 226389
And here is a Brachypelma boehmei:
View attachment 226392
So, just by the name, you know that they are closely related. Notice the similar appearance (other than coloration). Stocky build, large abdomen, flat carapace, and so on.

-----------------

As another example, here is a Chilobrachys fimbriatus:
View attachment 226391
And here is a Chilobrachys andersoni (not the best picture, I know):
View attachment 226390
With them, you'll notice very long legs, a teardrop shaped abdomen, and a small carapace-to-body ratio. Again, closely related, but different species.

----------------

One more example. Here is a Euathlus sp. "Green":
View attachment 226393
And here is a Euathlus truculentus:
View attachment 226394
I'll leave pointing out similarities to you. Notice how on the first species I brought up something new - the species name is in quotations, and it's not scientific at all. When a new species is discovered, it can often take over a decade to formally recognize the animal as a unique species. Just because the coloration is different doesn't mean it's another species. While research is being done, we treat the "Green" as the species to avoid cross-breeding with other species. You would pronounce this as "Euathlus species green", and it's a very common trait in the hobby. There's not much money to be had in tarantula taxonomy, so many species are stuck in limbo with these pseudo-scientific names until someone gets around to studying them. A great example is actually this species. There is another species called Euathlus sp. "Blue" that looks darn near identical, except the femurs are blue instead of green. They very well may be the same species and simply color morphs, but we don't know, so for now we keep them separate. More commonly, it's not the coloration of the spider that is referenced, but rather where specifically it was discovered.

Unlike breeds, different species should never be bred with each other. Only members of the same species should mate. This is to ensure the integrity of the bloodline, as a large part of this hobby is conservation. Some of the species we keep are critically endangered in the wild, and ensuring clean bloodlines is the only way to keep them from blinking out of existence... so to speak. You can learn more about scientific names in a short video here and you can learn more about localities here.

Finally, concerning captive bred versus wild caught... it depends on the species. Some species are almost exclusively wild caught if you bought it as an adult - G. rosea and A. chalcodes come to mind. The commonality of them in the wild combined with their ridiculously slow growth rate makes them prone to being wild caught. This also makes them cheaper (learn more about the value of spiders here). Others grow very quickly, such as B. vagans, so you're pretty much guaranteed to get a captive bred spider. At the end of the day, one is not necessarily better than the other. Wild caught spiders have the downfall of possibly being infected with parasites or actually gravid ("pregnant"), but that's about all.

As I'm sure you can gather by now, this is less about having a pet and more about having a little piece of education living with you. These creatures aren't for everyone, but just given your desire to learn and research, I think you'll fit in quite nicely here. You've got some great beginner species there, here's a few more to consider before you make the jump. Enjoy your eight-legged buddy, learn from it, and never stop researching in this hobby. More and more information is uncovered every year, and this hobby will definitely keep you busy!

Welcome to the hobby. You'll want to buy some shelves.

I love all the info you've given me here. I definitely want to learn more and more. It's all so fascinating. I have so much more to research and learn before I make the plunge. I want one now as in yesterday, but I dont want to choose wrong.

Thanks for helping me!

 

[AmberDawnDays]

You deserved an 'award' rating only for that statement. But don't forget also:
"Getting started in the tarantula hobby is rough. I get it. I do, really. But you're likely trying too hard."

I often try too hard and over think EVERYTHING.

 

[AmberDawnDays]

@EulersK
I watched the video on YouTube about the value of spiders. I take it by the name that is you in the video? I notice you have bunches of videos. I'll have to check them out later.

 

[EulersK]

@EulersK
I watched the video on YouTube about the value of spiders. I take it by the name that is you in the video? I notice you have bunches of videos. I'll have to check them out later.

Every link that I posted is of my channel. Shameless self-promotion! It's good information though, I swear

 

[AmberDawnDays]

Every link that I posted is of my channel. Shameless self-promotion! It's good information though, I swear

I havent gone through all the links yet, but I will.

 

[YagerManJennsen]

Breeds apply to an animal of the same species. With dogs, a schnauzer and a chihuahua are the same species (Canis lupus familiaris), so they are breeds. Simply a variant of genetics within the same species. With tarantulas, they are literally different animals - like a lion compared to a tiger. Sure, they're closely related, but they are very much different animals.

In taxonomy, all tarantulas are of the family Theraphosidae. The next step down is genus (plural "genera"), and the next step down from that is species. How we refer to tarantulas actually makes life very easy. We refer to them by their scientific name (not "Latin" name, as not all names are in Latin!). The scientific name will always tell you the genus and the species. You'll notice that members of the same genus look very much alike, but again, they are different species.

For example, here is a Brachypelma emilia:
View attachment 226389
And here is a Brachypelma boehmei:
View attachment 226392
So, just by the name, you know that they are closely related. Notice the similar appearance (other than coloration). Stocky build, large abdomen, flat carapace, and so on.

-----------------

As another example, here is a Chilobrachys fimbriatus:
View attachment 226391
And here is a Chilobrachys andersoni (not the best picture, I know):
View attachment 226390
With them, you'll notice very long legs, a teardrop shaped abdomen, and a small carapace-to-body ratio. Again, closely related, but different species.

----------------

One more example. Here is a Euathlus sp. "Green":
View attachment 226393
And here is a Euathlus truculentus:
View attachment 226394
I'll leave pointing out similarities to you. Notice how on the first species I brought up something new - the species name is in quotations, and it's not scientific at all. When a new species is discovered, it can often take over a decade to formally recognize the animal as a unique species. Just because the coloration is different doesn't mean it's another species. While research is being done, we treat the "Green" as the species to avoid cross-breeding with other species. You would pronounce this as "Euathlus species green", and it's a very common trait in the hobby. There's not much money to be had in tarantula taxonomy, so many species are stuck in limbo with these pseudo-scientific names until someone gets around to studying them. A great example is actually this species. There is another species called Euathlus sp. "Blue" that looks darn near identical, except the femurs are blue instead of green. They very well may be the same species and simply color morphs, but we don't know, so for now we keep them separate. More commonly, it's not the coloration of the spider that is referenced, but rather where specifically it was discovered.

Unlike breeds, different species should never be bred with each other. Only members of the same species should mate. This is to ensure the integrity of the bloodline, as a large part of this hobby is conservation. Some of the species we keep are critically endangered in the wild, and ensuring clean bloodlines is the only way to keep them from blinking out of existence... so to speak. You can learn more about scientific names in a short video here and you can learn more about localities here.

Finally, concerning captive bred versus wild caught... it depends on the species. Some species are almost exclusively wild caught if you bought it as an adult - G. rosea and A. chalcodes come to mind. The commonality of them in the wild combined with their ridiculously slow growth rate makes them prone to being wild caught. This also makes them cheaper (learn more about the value of spiders here). Others grow very quickly, such as B. vagans, so you're pretty much guaranteed to get a captive bred spider. At the end of the day, one is not necessarily better than the other. Wild caught spiders have the downfall of possibly being infected with parasites or actually gravid ("pregnant"), but that's about all.

As I'm sure you can gather by now, this is less about having a pet and more about having a little piece of education living with you. These creatures aren't for everyone, but just given your desire to learn and research, I think you'll fit in quite nicely here. You've got some great beginner species there, here's a few more to consider before you make the jump. Enjoy your eight-legged buddy, learn from it, and never stop researching in this hobby. More and more information is uncovered every year, and this hobby will definitely keep you busy!

Welcome to the hobby. You'll want to buy some shelves.

This needs to be a sticky.

 

[Andrea82]

Every link that I posted is of my channel. Shameless self-promotion! It's good information though, I swear

It is! Since you made those videos, it is much easier to send new keepers on the right track! Nothing shameless about promoting your videos, since they live up to your promotion and then some

 

[Andrea82]

This needs to be a sticky.

His videos too, i think.
@ratluvr76 what do you think?

 

[AmberDawnDays]

Cats can be a problem . They are remarkably good predators who are able to notice even the smallest movement . If they get the idea that there is something small and crawling around they will find it . I have heard of them knocking enclosures off of shelves or tables . In a cat versus a T scenario the cat always wins . My advise to keep your T in a place where the cats won't have access .

I have 3 cats and only the youngest is interested in my bird and rat. He is such a stinker. He would probably be the one to take interest in any spider I aquire. I will definitely have to think of where to keep my spidey friend when I get one.

 

[BorisTheSpider]

I have 3 cats and only the youngest is interested in my bird and rat. He is such a stinker. He would probably be the one to take interest in any spider I aquire. I will definitely have to think of where to keep my spidey friend when I get one.

I once had a locking screen 30 gallon aquarium with a breeding pair of forest scorpions. And I'm not sure how the cat did it but somehow it pried the top off and got in . it ate both the Scorpions and was laying in there when I got home. Me and my then girlfriend had a little chat about the cat. After that I started keeping my arachnids in an out-of-the-way room where I could close and lock the door .

 

[mistertim]

@EulersK
I watched the video on YouTube about the value of spiders. I take it by the name that is you in the video? I notice you have bunches of videos. I'll have to check them out later.

His tarantula videos are great. Just stay away from the "age restricted" section of his youtube channel.

 

[cold blood]

Im still a bit confused about the breed / species thing. I definitely need to do more research.

I was also unsure about how many were actually captive breed or not because while researching some said captive breed and some didn't.

All I could think when I quoted this was how much time it was going to take to explain the breed vs species...man @EulersK , you da man, that was a great post that saved me a lot of time and effort So much easier to say, "see post #25".

As for the second part, pretty much when you buy a sling its almost always CB, now if its a rare or new species, it may have parents that were wild caught or only be a few generations from it, but the spiders we get don't generally come flooding through with regularity (as its quite expensive), we breed so that we can keep them in the hobby without relying on taking from the wild, legally or otherwise.

Captive breeding is basically the backbone of the hobby, its very different than it was way back when it was new in the 70's and 80's. A lot of people that are outside the hobby, however, do still assume its the same as it always was, its definitely not. There are dozens of species that are either endangered or about to go extinct in the wild, yet the hobby is flush with them because we've been breeding them in our homes for decades while their homes were clear cut in the wild.

CITES kind of started this shift in the 70's, as it outlawed the taking of Brachypelma from the wild, therefore requiring that current stocks be bred or they would basically be gone from the hobby in time...as you can see its been quite successful as just about every Brachy species is available somewhere, be it here in the US or in Europe somewhere.

I agree about the jet black. That's what really pulls me towards wanting one so much. I hear they are expensive. Does $400 for a fully grown female sound right? That's what I've found.

Do you have a recommendation for where I can purchase one? I have gone back and forth a bit, but I know I want one for sure.

I'm still thinking it will be a few months before I can swing it though. I gotta get through Christmas first!

I agree, that's a bit high. People who pay that amount are either rich or ignorant IMO.

As for where to go to buy, I will be frank, there isn't just one or a few good reliable places to purchase tarantulas, there's literally hundreds of them. The classifieds section is a great place to start (actually its one of the only places I look). The first classifieds section is "premium", these are typically your larger dealers. The one below that is also a for sale/trade section where you find smaller dealers, individuals selling parts or all of their collections or breeders themselves. Buying direct from breeders has many advantages.

Every single seller has a corresponding review section (its required), become familiar with it, you will see that most of these sellers have pretty good if not great reputations. The one thing I will say, NEVER buy arachnids from a reptile dealer, buy from arachnid dealers who specialize in arachnids. Many of the worst places to buy from are "popular" reptile dealers that pop up first on searches...be warned.

@EulersK
I watched the video on YouTube about the value of spiders. I take it by the name that is you in the video? I notice you have bunches of videos. I'll have to check them out later.

Be wary of you tube videos, unless you are familiar with the person (like EulersK or louisef for example) or are directed to a video by someone you trust, be wary of learning from you tube. Most of those vids are flawed, many severely flawed in many ways, but if you weren't already knowledgeable in the hobby, you might not ever know.

The best way to gauge pricing is to view sellers and dealer price lists. Simple browsing.

Every link that I posted is of my channel. Shameless self-promotion! It's good information though, I swear

I love seeing the good ones, and yours can/will many people, so who cares who promotes them, as long as someone promotes the right videos!...so self promote away.

 

[Venom1080]

sad. not too sure why you'd share this..

 

[Paiige]

Me and my then girlfriend had a little chat about the cat. After that I started keeping my arachnids in an out-of-the-way room where I could close and lock the door .

Fortunately I haven't had any problems with my cat...he doesn't seem to notice any of my Ts at all actually. He DOES, however, LOVE crickets, so during feeding time I have to keep an eye on him.