Poecilotheria miranda

Vayu Son

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"Poecilotheria miranda ³Four-Spotted Ornamental², CB¹02, 1/2²-3/4², (A/F/A/V), HOT! HOT! HOT! Months of hype and all the rave, this incredible Pokie has made many foam at the mouth just looking at pictures of it! First-time offering! Very, very, very high-white Poecilotheria with purple/pink highlights! Very white knees, purple/pink femurs, a four-spotted abdomen - outrageous!!! For serious collectors only. Exact price will be determined upon import. Expect retail price to over $200 easily. This will be the U.S. hobby¹s highest priced species as a spiderling to-date no doubt. Limited supply. Advanced reservations being taken now for an expected offering date of Jan. 20. $100 deposits required before Jan. 10. Inquire. See a pic at: http://www.birdspiders.com/archive/3/0123.htm"



thought you guys might be interested to hear that. Any word on how you came by em todd?


-V
 

JacenBeers

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That is the most beautiful spider I have ever seen and I will never ever own one.
 

Weapon-X

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re

would'nt that suck to buy 1 or 2 and wind up with all males, man i know of course i want one , but i'll have to wait until they are more established in the hobby, who knows maybe i'll get lucky, but i'm sure that won't be for a long long long time, heck i'm happy i'll at least have a chance in the near future, wonder how much p. mettalica is gonna run?--Jeff
 

Martin H.

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.


IMHO it is VERY similar to P. formosa – only a black band on the patella of leg I & II is missing, the black band on leg III & IV is reduced to a black stripe and the black band on the femurs are more distinct. Is it really worth to pay for these slightly differences that much more when you can get P. formosa for a few bucks (overhere P. formosa slings cost only about 3 - 5 $ each!!)??
...or are the prices just as high because of the Poecilotheria hype and that P. miranda is (at the moment) still rare? If you can wait a few years, you can save a lot of money. See the prices of the formerly rare species like P. ornata, P. formosa, P. rufilata which dropped in the cellar.

BTW, the P. miranda on the photo on Rick West's website is fresh molted. A fresh molted P. formosa has even a more bluish to purple shine!

just my two cents,
Martin

www.spiderpix.com
 

invertepet

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I think there is a distinct difference between formosa and miranda, at least based on the pics of miranda I've seen. There's decidedly less dark grey, the abdominal pattern is different and there is that missing patella band which changes the look of the spider quite a bit, IMHO.

Freshly molted formosa usually need just-so lighting to bring their purple iridescence out. The violet/scarlet hues in that pic are very intense and different than the purple/lavender highlights you get from fresh-molted formosa, regalis or even fasciata.

Over here, you can't get a formosa spiderling for $5 (nor just about any other spider except perhaps G. rosea hatchlings). I see your point about waiting, but that's true of any new species. Cobalt blues were expensive once, as were Greenbottles and many other spiders. Then again, miranda may never come again. India is quite closed.

bill
 

Chris

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Very cool looking spider... I will have to start hunting for a way to get some!

Stay tuned...
 

Vayu Son

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><

Ive never seen the spider, but the day I pay $200+ for a spider im not damn sure is gonna breed for me is the die i stamp "im stupid and made out of money" on my head.

-V
 

LaRiz

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I tend to hold back my comments regarding P. miranda and P. metallica.
P. miranda look sort of like a more banded P. regalis. Don't let the purple sheen of that pic fool you. Most Poecilotheria cast this bluish purple iridescence. I've seen this sheen in P. regalis.
I agree with Martin in that P. miranda is similar to P. formosa. Perhaps they are closely related in the same way P. ornata and P. rufilata may be closely related.
Also, if you look at P. metallica, they resemble a shiney blue P. subfusca, for the very few that have seen an adult specimen, you may agree with me on that.
There is way too much hype for both these species, which, no doubt will, increase the price. US dealer aren't the blame for this. The people breeding these things see and hear the hype and set prices accordingly.
Yes, India has been closed, but that didn't stop smugglers from obtaining a few P. miranda to play with. This is starting to feel like deja-vu (Poecilotheria rufilata).
Will P. miranda cost $15 in 10 years? I would say, probably.
 

conipto

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Interesting people's opinions on this. I also don't think I'll be too into the miranda/metallica bit too much. I guess all Rick's complaining in the chat room managed to get through to me. I have a problem with smuggling, and all the uncoolness surrounding what seems like forcing these two species into the hobby. My want for these two poke's doesn't blind me to the reality of how they were obtained in the first place, and condoning that can only lead to disaster later down the road. What happens when 20/20 does some special a few years down the road, and researches where this spider that bit a little kid in a pet shop and put him in a coma(assuming all this venom stuff is true) came from, and The T hobby gets a swift kick in the ass because bubba wubba talks about europeans smuggling them out. I'd just rather not be party to this kind of activity, even indirectly.

Bill
 

invertepet

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I don't want to start a moral debate, but as a hobbyist (not a dealer) I have no problem whatsoever with keeping and breeding smuggled Poecilotheria, which are direly threatened by the fastest defoliation of rain and monsoon forests on earth (India is among the worst offenders of deforestation)... Than watch them be extinguished along with the thousands if not millions of undescribed invertebrate species that have been rendered extinct over the last 20 years.

Yes, rufilata may have been an illegal import. But they're firmly established in captive breeding programs now across Europe and the USA (I disagree with Rick that captive breeding programs can never work in the long term). In a few more years, our hobby may be the last that remains of Poecilotheria spiders on the planet. India as a whole puts far more effort into exploiting and destroying their fauna than they do preserving it. Their export restriction simply seals the door on captive propagation of species that very well may be gone in the near future.

Sorry to sermonize on this, but I stand in very strong opposition to the idea that standing by while species are eliminated from native lands is better than a relative handful being distributed to devoted hobbyists to breed. I feel the 'evil pet trade' is the lesser of the two 'evils' in this case. I'm rather sure more Poecilotheria have already perished in India under the steel treads of bulldozers than could ever be 'over' collected and sold as pets.

Just my opinion, of course.

bill
 

phoenixxavierre

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to be extinct or not to be extinct?

Bill,

Very well put and very valid points.
I agree with you wholeheartedly! While I understand the importance of the animal thriving in it's natural environment, with the current exploitation of it's habitat I don't see it happening in the long run.

Paul
 

conipto

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Originally posted by invertepet
I feel the 'evil pet trade' is the lesser of the two 'evils' in this case. I'm rather sure more Poecilotheria have already perished in India under the steel treads of bulldozers than could ever be 'over' collected and sold as pets.

Just my opinion, of course.
I agree with this and your other point on being in captivity better than not being at all.. However, I still see no reason to support smuggling efforts. Be it that country or the next, those breeders are more than likely NOT doing it for the survival of the species.

Bill
 

Chris

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Originally posted by invertepet
I don't want to start a moral debate, but as a hobbyist (not a dealer) I have no problem whatsoever with keeping and breeding smuggled Poecilotheria, which are direly threatened by the fastest defoliation of rain and monsoon forests on earth (India is among the worst offenders of deforestation)... Than watch them be extinguished along with the thousands if not millions of undescribed invertebrate species that have been rendered extinct over the last 20 years.

Yes, rufilata may have been an illegal import. But they're firmly established in captive breeding programs now across Europe and the USA (I disagree with Rick that captive breeding programs can never work in the long term). In a few more years, our hobby may be the last that remains of Poecilotheria spiders on the planet. India as a whole puts far more effort into exploiting and destroying their fauna than they do preserving it. Their export restriction simply seals the door on captive propagation of species that very well may be gone in the near future.

Sorry to sermonize on this, but I stand in very strong opposition to the idea that standing by while species are eliminated from native lands is better than a relative handful being distributed to devoted hobbyists to breed. I feel the 'evil pet trade' is the lesser of the two 'evils' in this case. I'm rather sure more Poecilotheria have already perished in India under the steel treads of bulldozers than could ever be 'over' collected and sold as pets.

Just my opinion, of course.

bill
I agree with you completely Bill, and not as a dealer... as a naturalist.
 

Code Monkey

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The problem with "taking the high road" is that some of the people here on this board and others are some of the most dedicated, most conscientious people you will find in regards to the tarantuala hobby.

If one of us had the interest, money, and opportunity to obtain these "smuggler derived" species and didn't "because that would be wrong", well, that would be a shame.

The smuggler isn't going to stop doing his job because it's how he's feeding his family.

The importer who overlooks the fact that there's almost no conceivable way these spiders came from where the smuggler says they did isn't going to stop importing them because he knows there's buku dollars in them eight legs.

The larger hobby isn't going to pass them up either.

One way or another, in demand species will continue to be imported and sold so long as there is a market for it, and whether any one of us buys those Ts won't affect the number imported one bit. On the other hand, if some of us did buy those Ts, there are good odds those Ts would be bred, and the offspring propogated through the hobby.

Nothing changes by taking the high road, but a lot can change by taking the middle road.
 

conipto

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Originally posted by Martin H.
btw, do you keep specimens of Acanthoscurria geniculata, A. brocklehursti, Vitalius cristatus, Poecilotheria rufilata, ... ?

all the best,
Martin

www.spiderpix.com
No, but not out of any moral standpoint. Eh, screw it you guys are right, they'll be here sooner or later anyways. In five years everyone will say 'What the hell are you talking about' if I go into a tirade about this so.... High Road/Low Road... Whatever. Give me the pretty spiders, I give up ;)

Bill
 

Vayu Son

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><

*rick enters the board with an uzi*

"I hope you guys slept well, because today you die!!"


-V
 

invertepet

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Originally posted by monantony
There you go Conipto.... Come over to the dark...er slightly grey side
Tony
It's the variegated black and white striped side! :D

b
 
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