P. metallica going into death curl - How can i help her??

Blazedape

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Purchased this P metallica mid August. My first P metallica but I've kept other Poecilotheria in the past. When unboxing and moving the tarantula into its enclosure I noticed she was slow (especially for a pokey) she just sort of plodded out and after a while made her way into the cork bark.

I have never seen her eat, I have tried roaches and crickets, She would sort of slap them or just curl up, Thought maybe she was in premolt?. I would still try with a feeder weekly just to see if she was hungry. Time passed and she showed no sign of preparing for molt, not webbing, not even hiding properly just sitting on the inside of the cork tube. Eventually started to get worried and left a roach in overnight, it seemed to disappear so I assumed she had eaten them. tried this for a few weeks but it became apparent she was not eating them, had to remove a couple, and found 2 dead, so she may have just been killing and leaving them. At this point she would just completely ignore feeders, even letting them walk over her legs.

Over the last few days I noticed she was out of the cork bark more, just sat on the glass or outer cork bark but she didn't look right, sitting crunched up. She never really sat in a pokey stance but she would normally be spread out.

The attached picture was from last night, I got home from work today and she was worse, still holding on to cork bark but obviously going into death curl. She can still walk and climb but slow and lumbering. I do not have a picture of her in her current state.- as soon as I saw her I made up an ICU and scooped her up and put her in.

What could have caused this? and what else can i do to help her!?!

I've seen her drink! and the water bowl is always full. (White things in the water bowl are Springtails)

She is in a modified Exo Terra with a plastic top with drilled holes.

Part of the substrate is moist and she is kept at the same temp as the other tarantulas.
 

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Liquifin

Arachnoprince
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ICU's are bad and should not be used unless you have a severe dehydrated tarantula. What you have bought is an old spider that is closing in on its days. What you are describing are old specimen behaviors, some people may disagree with me or have different opinions or perspectives on this matter. Older specimens and those older specimens that have passed in my experience have shown similar traits and behaviors before passing. Hopefully I'm wrong, but it seems she is quite an old specimen for a Poecilotheria.
 

Blazedape

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ICU's are bad and should not be used unless you have a severe dehydrated tarantula. What you have bought is an old spider that is closing in on its days. What you are describing are old specimen behaviors, some people may disagree with me or have different opinions or perspectives on this matter. Older specimens and those older specimens that have passed in my experience have shown similar traits and behaviors before passing. Hopefully I'm wrong, but it seems she is quite an old specimen for a Poecilotheria.
It was purchased as a sub-adult though? damn I shouldn't use the ICU?? that's all I could find online that I could do to help :bigtears: I brought her online from a very reputable breeder in the EU.
 

Liquifin

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It was purchased as a sub-adult? damn I shouldn't use the ICU?? that's all I could find online that I could do to help :bigtears:
Like I said, I don't have definite answers, just speculation so hopefully I'm wrong here. And yes, ICU's shouldn't be used for a tarantula unless they're severely dehydrate or shriveled because ICU's just causes humidity death traps otherwise.
 

Blazedape

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Like I said, I don't have definite answers, just speculation so hopefully I'm wrong here. And yes, ICU's shouldn't be used for a tarantula unless they're severely dehydrate or shriveled because ICU's just causes humidity death traps otherwise.
In a way, I hope you're not wrong. I'd rather her be old and dying naturally than because of illness or something I've done - she is supposed to be sub-adult though :(
 

cold blood

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Curling has one basic cause...dehydration.

Now you say you have seen it drink multiple times...couple that with the lack of eating despite killing and it leads to one potential sad conclusion....it failed to molt its sucking stomach. In these cases we see exactly what you are experiencing....food interest but not actually eating, and frequent drinking. Ts normally drink VERY infrequently...seeing a t drink often is a red flag...see, if a t drinks, it shouldn't need to drink again for a significant amount of time...going back repeatedly indicated its thirst isn't being quenched by its drinking...in fact, its likely not drinking, but going through the motions as a result of a dehydration it can do little about. Without a functioning sucking stomach, the act of drinking is just as impossible as the act of eating.

I suggest keeping the enclosure much damper than usual, just to decrease the amount of moisture the t might otherwise lose in a drier environment.

If this is indeed the sac, all you can do is wait and hope it eventually molts successfully.

I gotta say, its not the first time I have heard of a t with a sucking stomach issue being sold while it is still in good shape.

In a way, I hope you're not wrong. I'd rather her be old and dying naturally than because of illness or something I've done - she is supposed to be sub-adult though :(
if its a sub adult, its not old age....I have had a lot of old ts, none of which act or acted any differently than young ts aside from those dying mature males....but they don't act like yours is at all. They stumble around losing their precision.
 

Blazedape

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Curling has one basic cause...dehydration.

Now you say you have seen it drink multiple times...couple that with the lack of eating despite killing and it leads to one potential sad conclusion....it failed to molt its sucking stomach. In these cases we see exactly what you are experiencing....food interest but not actually eating, and frequent drinking. Ts normally drink VERY infrequently...seeing a t drink often is a red flag...see, if a t drinks, it shouldn't need to drink again for a significant amount of time...going back repeatedly indicated its thirst isn't being quenched by its drinking...in fact, its likely not drinking, but going through the motions as a result of a dehydration it can do little about. Without a functioning sucking stomach, the act of drinking is just as impossible as the act of eating.

I suggest keeping the enclosure much damper than usual, just to decrease the amount of moisture the t might otherwise lose in a drier environment.

If this is indeed the sac, all you can do is wait and hope it eventually molts successfully.

I gotta say, its not the first time I have heard of a t with a sucking stomach issue being sold while it is still in good shape.
This might Make sense, she might have been drinking a lot - I only saw it a few times but I actually thought the water bowl was leaking at one point and replaced it as it was almost empty every evening. However she doesn't show any food interests, when I first got her she used to sort of slap feeders with her legs or curl up and hide, recently just ignoring it altogether. I put her in ICU because she looked in even worse shape than in the picture above (curling legs further under) and I just wanted to do something to help somehow. should I take her out ICU?
 
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cold blood

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I actually thought the water bowl was leaking at one point and replaced it as it was almost empty every evening.
What you saw was the wicking effect.....ts dont drink that much water....any bit of webbing on the edge, even if its barely discernable, will draw water out of the bowl.
should I take her out ICU?
I never use ICUs...as I said, just dampen up her enclosure and leave her there.
 

Blazedape

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What you saw was the wicking effect.....ts dont drink that much water....any bit of webbing on the edge, even if its barely discernable, will draw water out of the bowl.

I never use ICUs...as I said, just dampen up her enclosure and leave her there.
Ok, I've just dampened the enclosure, Removed the ICU lid, and left it in her enclosure. she can climb out if she wishes. I just wanted to help her :(
 

Blazedape

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Unfortunately, she didn't make it :'( she hadn't moved far from where I'd left her when I put her back in. I just hope she didn't suffer, and that is wasn't of my doing :( RIP girl
 

Jess S

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Sorry for your loss. From your description, sounds like it wasn't in good shape when you received it.
 

cold blood

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Unfortunately, she didn't make it :'( she hadn't moved far from where I'd left her when I put her back in. I just hope she didn't suffer, and that is wasn't of my doing :( RIP girl
Sorry to hear that. I certainly don't think it was anything you did.
 
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