New ivory millipede owner with habitat questions

Jabarto

Arachnopeon
Joined
Jun 14, 2021
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12
Hi all, new poster here but I've been lurking for a while since I've been getting super into vivariums and arthropods lately.

I recently got my first set of ivory millipedes and I want to be sure I'm housing them properly. I currently have 4 of them in a 10 gallon aquarium. It has a screen top that I've mostly covered with plastic wrap until I can get some plexiglass to make a better lid. The substrate consists of ~5" of ABG mix from NEHERP, on top of a 2" LECA drainage layer separated by a screen. There's a layer of terrarium moss and magnolia leaves on the surface along with a small piece of cork bark. For food I've been giving them Repashy Bug Burger and Morning Wood, and I've recently introduced springtails to the setup.

My concern is with food, mostly. From what I understand, ABG mix is specifically designed to degrade slowly, so I'm wondering if it was a mistake to use that for millipedes since they need most of their food to be well rotted. I also want them to reproduce at some point and I've read that they're more inclined to lay eggs if there's lots of edible material in the substrate. I've considered getting some Traeger pellets to mix in and let rot, would that be a worthwhile addition? And will magnolia leaves work for leaf litter?

They don't SEEM uncomfortable in any way, but you know, they're bugs. It's hard to read them, and I really want the creepy crawlies to thrive. So, I'd welcome any advice from the vets around here. I can post pictures of the setup too, if that would help.
 

Jabarto

Arachnopeon
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Jun 14, 2021
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12
One other thing about ivories; from what I've read they mostly breed between April and June, and I've seen a few of mine in the middle of what appears to be mating. Would they still be in the tail end of their breeding season, or does that whole concept go out the window in a captive environment?
 

Matts inverts

Arachnoangel
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ABG should not be used, that is for a tropical terrarium that has to drain. I use ABG in my gecko terrariums because it doesn’t rot and helps support plants. You can still add plants but you shouldn’t overwater. You should have used millipede soil mix. You shouldn’t have used a drainage layer, it isn’t needed. Here is a @mickiems substrate mix.
I have been mixing my own substrate and changing it a little each batch to improve it. This is the mix I have been happy with for a year or so. It seems fussy with all the rinsing, baking etc., but my losses are almost 0 and all but 1 mature species have produced pedelings (I most likely had pedelings there but also isopods and I never saw pedelings - you do the math :anxious:). This isn't the only substrate recipe that works, but this is the one that works for me. I mix it 30 gallons at a time, so 10+ gallons of each portion and then about 1/3 gallon of calcium. I know that isn't mathematically accurate, but I'm an artist not an engineer. I keep it moist to the point you can almost squeeze a drop of water out of it, but you can't. If you put a handful in a paper towel, the paper towel shouldn't have an obvious wet spot. I stir through it when it is not being used to prevent anaerobic bacteria and I add springtails to each new set up.

MILLIPEDE SUBSTRATE MIX

33%

COIR: It holds moisture and texture better than anything else I have found. Great for tunneling and making molting and birthing chambers. Color lightens as it dries making it a good indicator of substrate moisture content.

33%
LEAF PORTION:
Green Envy Leaf™ compost: (Or any other ORGANIC leaf compost). I bake it at 250° for two hours. Any bagged product may have plastic and metal pieces in it, so I go through it thoroughly. This compost makes up about 2/3 of the leaf portion.
Leaf Litter: I rinse in water; then I let the leaves air dry. After they dry, I bake them for two hours at 250°. I cover the pans (to prevent flyaway leaves, for safety sake) with foil (shiny side out to reflect more heat). Then I crumble them into the mix. (I also add leaves on the top.) I use all or mostly oak, but also small quantities of apple, beech, birch, hickory, maple, rose, viburnum, walnut and other hardwoods. This is the other 1/3 portion of the leaf portion.

33%
WOOD PORTION:
Traeger Oak Pellets: Since these are very small chips, they decay more quickly than other wood sources. I soak them first. They increase 3 X their volume when soaked. Anything to add variety can’t be a bad thing; possibly adding trace nutrients.
Aspen Shreds: I think this adds a good texture to the overall mix. It also decays quickly. (If my enclosures become too wet, I add aspen to help dry them out.)
Hardwood: If close to decaying, I put apple, cherry, hickory, maple and oak in my pressure cooker at 15 pounds pressure for 45 minutes. It should crumble nicely. I use both light and dark rotting wood, but I choose only wood that had isopods and others living within it. If not close to decay, I run the wood through a small chipper reserved for “millipede safe” woods only. I treat it the same as I treat my leaves: rinse and bake at 250° for two hours.
*Each of the wood components are of different sized particles and so all break down at different time intervals; adding a “time release” characteristic. By that I mean each source will become available for food at different periods.

1%
CALCIUM ADDITIVES:
I mix: Ground Cuttlefish Bone, Bird Grit, Oyster Shell Flour, caliche, egg shells (crushed and baked at 200˚ for 20 minutes). I also crumble shed skins from healthy reptiles into the mix. I add this to the mix and I also sprinkle it on the substrate about 2X a month.
This mix is awesome and is used by many millipede keepers. This mix is perfect other than the choir, this can be replaced by peat or compost or safe organic soil. They might still be breeding. If you have a 10 gallon, I would use moss like frog moss and hang some Spanish moss to make it like their native habitat. Make sure to get it chemical free like from a reptile shop.
 

Jabarto

Arachnopeon
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Jun 14, 2021
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I appreciate the advice. So given that I already DO have the ABG/drainage layer set up, how bad have I done messed up, as it were? Is it to the point that I should rip it all out and start over?

Also for reference, I put a drainage layer in because I live in an arid region and figured that would help regulate the humidity in the enclosure. I've heard people suggest compost and potting soil but I've also heard those are total crapshoots as far as containing fertilizer, etc. that isn't good for the critters.
 

Matts inverts

Arachnoangel
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866
The drainage needs to come out. It doesn’t help with humidity, it mostly helps so water doesn’t sit in the substrate. For millipedes, this isn’t a problem because it isn’t a dart frog or a mourning gecko, it doesn’t have 85 percent humidity with water everywhere. Since you have to replace the substrate, I would take out the drainage layer. I recommend adding a couple handfuls of sphagnum moss because it helps keep humidity. Adding plants like moss, bromeliads, and tropical plants like pothos adds water which helps with humidity. Also, adding compost like worm castings are safe if there isn’t any fertilizer. It should say organic or no additives. If you can’t use that, reptisoil also works as a filler. Magnolia leaves work for leaf litter but oak, maple, aspen, and cottonwood are some of the best. You have to make sure that nothing has any kind of chemical. Good luck with your new friends.
 

Jabarto

Arachnopeon
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Jun 14, 2021
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Thank you again.

Man I've been stressing myself a lot worrying about these little buggers but I guess it's not so bad. I can still use the ABG for a proper terrarium elsewhere, and it sounds like the new substrate won't cost much and actually be simpler than what I had in mind to begin with. Call it a learning experience I suppose!
 

Matts inverts

Arachnoangel
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If you have a left over tank and some ABG left over, I can trade you a couple mourning geckos🙂 good luck with them. A tip that really helps is if you ferment soil, do it outside. I tried making flake soil and it got overly wet and molded and may have caused some brain issues. Other than that, keeping them is super easy.
 

Jabarto

Arachnopeon
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Just FYI I took the advice and built a new enclosure for them. The substrate is made from reptisoil with Traeger pellets, hickory chips, magnolia leaves, and a bit of coconut fiber to fill it out. I'm going to try and hot-glue some finer mesh over the air holes but this is just to keep them from getting out for the time being.

200009775_496907814966466_6867902067277202473_n.jpg
 

Jabarto

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Welp, one of the millipedes is dead. He went downhill pretty soon after being put in there. Maybe this wasn't the best idea.
 

Madnesssr

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Welp, one of the millipedes is dead. He went downhill pretty soon after being put in there. Maybe this wasn't the best idea.
I am sorry for your loss. I can tell you what has worked for me with my millipede.

First let’s start with what hasn’t worked. I avoid coco fiber in all forms as well as dry sphagnum moss. I have experienced impaction deaths from both.

I use flake soil that I make as my substrate. I make mine using traeger oak pellets, wheat bran, and yeast. I allow it to ferment until its smell changes to an earthy smell and the soil is dark. The time this takes can range based on heat the ambient temperature, but usually it is several months. Once it has fermented, I add in rotting hardwood, crushed egg shell, and leaves and it is good to go. I top off my substrate with more rotting hardwood, lichen, and loads of leaves. I usually put a clump of live moss on the damp end.

I have done experiments where I have used a 50/50 ratio of organic top soil and flake soil vs pure flake soil. The millipede that I had on flakes soil grew more quickly.

With ivory, it is imperative that you do not overwater. They are found in Florida and can not tolerate a soggy substrate. I keep one end damp and the other end fairly dry.
 

Arachnomum

Arachnopeon
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Nov 4, 2018
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Hello everyone! I am ten years old and have had one millipede before. It was an giant gold millipede (orthoporus gold). It died and for a long time I did not get another one. But now after carful research I have found a good species, the ivory millipede (chicobolus spinigerus). I have a question about it: I already know the temperature range but I still need to know the humidity range. Can you help me with that?
 

Arthroverts

Arachnoking
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Humidity is, generally speaking, not important for millipedes, rather the soil moisture. With principally all millipedes (excepting some desert-dwelling species like Orthoporus) the substrate should be moist to the touch, but not to the point where if you squeeze it in your hand water will come out.

Thanks,

Arthroverts
 

Jabarto

Arachnopeon
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As long as this thread is back on the front page I figure I'll post an update. Aside from that one death my ivories are doing well. I've since gotten a few more and I also got a couple of n. Americanus that are (temporarily) sharing the bin. I have a batch of flake soil brewing and it's getting nice and hot, although the lack of easy access to oak is concerning. There are very few deciduous trees where I live that aren't in heavily sprayed city spaces, and traeger discontinued their oak pellets last year, apparently.
 

Jabarto

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I had another two deaths recently and I have no idea why. They had plenty of substrate with loads of newly bought oak leaves and traeger pellets, with supplemental food on top of that. Only thing I can think of is the heat since it's been 80-85 degrees Fahrenheit in my house due to the heatwave.

I gotta say millipede husbandry is a really stressful hobby. There's so little information and even fewer places to find it, and they require such specific conditions that are unlike anything any other pet requires. I've spent so much money and effort on them and after a couple months now it's still a complete crapshoot on whether any of them will be alive in two weeks.
 

Elytra and Antenna

Arachnoking
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I gotta say millipede husbandry is a really stressful hobby. There's so little information and even fewer places to find it, and they require such specific conditions that are unlike anything any other pet requires. I've spent so much money and effort on them and after a couple months now it's still a complete crapshoot on whether any of them will be alive in two weeks.
I have stocks that are 20-25 years old and have never found them stressful compared to almost anything else I've ever kept. Also, there are resources for information. https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/millipeds-in-captivity-orin-mcmonigle/1113515782
 

Matts inverts

Arachnoangel
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I gotta say millipede husbandry is a really stressful hobby. There's so little information and even fewer places to find it, and they require such specific conditions that are unlike anything any other pet requires. I've spent so much money and effort on them and after a couple months now it's still a complete crapshoot on whether any of them will be alive in two weeks.
It’s easy if you got it down. If you get an orthoporus, they are super easy and cheap if you get discount, use a cheap tub, and use things you already have. I used aspen that I had for my hamster that passed. You can get a huge bag for 10 bucks on Amazon or from a feed store. You can even go to a local forest and collect a ton of rotten hard wood, leaf litter, and some bark or seed pods for decoration and hide.
 

Jabarto

Arachnopeon
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I recently ordered some oak pellets from home depot that seem to work well. Camp Chef Oak Premium Hardwood BBQ Wood Pellets
Thanks for the tip. In the meantime I've made do with the Traeger signature blend, which is maple and cherry, but I'll definitely keep an eye out for those.

I have stocks that are 20-25 years old and have never found them stressful compared to almost anything else I've ever kept. Also, there are resources for information. https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/millipeds-in-captivity-orin-mcmonigle/1113515782
I have actually picked up a copy of your book since I made this thread (plus the one on isopods, incidentally). Admittedly these are the first invertebrates I've kept aside from springtails and dwarf white isopods (which are pretty much easy mode).

I know I probably sound all whiny from what I've posted in this thread, but I really do appreciate all the advice. It's just frustrating not knowing quite where things are going wrong - or if it's just a fluke. I have confirmed recently that my pedes were wild caught so who knows what kind of health they were in when they were found/shipped. In any case I really want to give my pets long, healthy lives and I don't take it well when they don't thrive.

It’s easy if you got it down. If you get an orthoporus, they are super easy and cheap if you get discount, use a cheap tub, and use things you already have. I used aspen that I had for my hamster that passed. You can get a huge bag for 10 bucks on Amazon or from a feed store. You can even go to a local forest and collect a ton of rotten hard wood, leaf litter, and some bark or seed pods for decoration and hide.
I initially shied away from O. Ornatus because I wanted to breed them, but I can't deny that I like the bigger 'pedes and if they're that easy I might try some out.

Gathering materials is tricky though. I live in northern Colorado, trees are scarce for the most part and the forests we do have are mostly conifers. I don't know where to find good broadleaf trees around here except maybe aspens (the towns are full of oak and maple trees but I'm sure they spray those like crazy).
 

Elytra and Antenna

Arachnoking
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Thanks for the tip. In the meantime I've made do with the Traeger signature blend, which is maple and cherry, but I'll definitely keep an eye out for those.
I would suggest aspen bedding or almost any hardwood over those two. I have found maple very poor for wood eaters and cherry may be no better. Of course I can't know everything that might work or doesn't work, only what I've found successful.
 

Madnesssr

Arachnoknight
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Thanks for the tip. In the meantime I've made do with the Traeger signature blend, which is maple and cherry, but I'll definitely keep an eye out for those.



I have actually picked up a copy of your book since I made this thread (plus the one on isopods, incidentally). Admittedly these are the first invertebrates I've kept aside from springtails and dwarf white isopods (which are pretty much easy mode).

I know I probably sound all whiny from what I've posted in this thread, but I really do appreciate all the advice. It's just frustrating not knowing quite where things are going wrong - or if it's just a fluke. I have confirmed recently that my pedes were wild caught so who knows what kind of health they were in when they were found/shipped. In any case I really want to give my pets long, healthy lives and I don't take it well when they don't thrive.



I initially shied away from O. Ornatus because I wanted to breed them, but I can't deny that I like the bigger 'pedes and if they're that easy I might try some out.

Gathering materials is tricky though. I live in northern Colorado, trees are scarce for the most part and the forests we do have are mostly conifers. I don't know where to find good broadleaf trees around here except maybe aspens (the towns are full of oak and maple trees but I'm sure they spray those like crazy).

If you send me a message, I can help with reliable sources.
 
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