New federal law may make keeping scorpions and tarantulas impossible.

[BeakerTheMighty]

Hey all. Something pretty scary I just found out about. There is a new bill being put before congress in late april that is going to severely restrict the transportation, keeping, and breeding of non-native species in the u.s. My understanding of it is that under this bill we could no longer import any non-native species of scorps and tarantulas (not to mention most reptiles, fish, birds, and other inverts available in the hobby), could no longer captive breed any non native scorpion, or transport them between states. This will actually apply to any non-native animal that is not specified as an exception. Needless to say this could effectively kill the scorpion and tarantula keeping hobbies. I strongly encourage everyone to go read the bill and check it out for themselves. The very future of our hobby may be at stake. The bill is called H.R. 669 and you can find info on it at this site.
http://www.pijac.org/i4a/pages/index.cfm?pageid=175

 

[ftorres]

Hello,
Here is another link.

http://www.nohr669.com/

 

[Gracilis]

thats a bunch of crap... damn them... hey Tabor what do ya say to this?

 

[Kathy]

Hey now, I'm just starting to get interested in this whole scorpion stuff. Geesh, I guess I won't be able to go into the bark scorpion business if this goes in effect. :}

 

[T.ass-mephisto]

Hey now, I'm just starting to get interested in this whole scorpion stuff. Geesh, I guess I won't be able to go into the bark scorpion business if this goes in effect. :}

thats not correct kathy.
if this goes into effect the fact that you are living within the natural habitat of the bark scorpions means you would be sitting on a gold mine as importing non-native scorpions would become illegal demand for native scorpions would go up because people within the hobby would most likely want to continue the hobby with what they can get/sell/breed/trade with. so even if this goes into effect you as of now could still keep bark scorpions native to your area, however it would steal the chance for you to expand into the world of scorpions and tarantulas fully.

 

[kupo969]

I know this is mainly a scorpion/tarantula forum, but that applies to ALL ANIMALS. So if you keep any herps, such as: Reptiles, amphibians, mammals (not 100% sure on this one), etc., that are not native. Anything native will most likely pass. Go and petition it, and check on it every day.

 

[Naga]

Technically, no animals other than dogs or cats would be allowed and available in the pet trade, aside from native species. That means that herp collectors will have the choice of the green anole, or a few sorts of gecko. It also means that every form of fish tank, aquarium and fish pond in the US would be void of life. I doubt they'll pass on such a standoff issue. Any animal owner in general will be effected by this, save for cats and dogs. For some reason, I can't see them voiding ALL US pet shops as businesses though... But then again, in your typical American household, you'll find cats, dogs and fish. They'll change it to allow fish

 

[winter_in_tears]

oh man, that sucks! If the hobby will be only limited to native species, how many known native species of scorpion are in the USA?

 

[What]

How about keeping this in one thread?

Also, check page two for my posts... The bill is not as evil as people are trying to misdirect you to believe.

All the bill does is make the animals you keep currently that are non-native illegal to sell across state lines until they are placed on either the approved list or unapproved list. With the drive the exotic animal hobby has behind it, this process will probably be completed quickly as the majority of widespread herps pose almost no danger to native ecosystems.

All the animals you have at the time of the bill passing will still be legal for you to keep. The bill does not take away any of your animals.

Edit:
Winter, there are 100+ species, with 4(or 5 depending on who you believe) being bark scorpions and the majority of them being Vaejovids.

 

[Elytra and Antenna]

How about keeping this in one thread?
The bill is not as evil as people are trying to misdirect you to believe.

All the bill does is make the animals you keep currently that are non-native illegal to sell across state lines until they are placed on either the approved list or unapproved list.

You apparently haven't read the bill. Introduced species are not considered native (all our feeders including crickets would be illegal). Anything not on the approved list is illegal and can result in a sentence of up to five years per animal (Lacey Act). There is no explanation of what paperwork you'd have to produce to prove that your animals were purchased prior to the law. Few hobbyists have adequate documentation.

 

[saxman146]

Well, we could just dump all of our scorps in the backyard and have them documented as native in the next ohhhhh......8 days or so. I don't know about you guys, buy I found my parabuthus villosus under a rock at my grandma's house. It would probably take me a while to find another though.

 

[BeakerTheMighty]

How about keeping this in one thread?

Also, check page two for my posts... The bill is not as evil as people are trying to misdirect you to believe.

All the bill does is make the animals you keep currently that are non-native illegal to sell across state lines until they are placed on either the approved list or unapproved list. With the drive the exotic animal hobby has behind it, this process will probably be completed quickly as the majority of widespread herps pose almost no danger to native ecosystems.

All the animals you have at the time of the bill passing will still be legal for you to keep. The bill does not take away any of your animals.

Edit:
Winter, there are 100+ species, with 4(or 5 depending on who you believe) being bark scorpions and the majority of them being Vaejovids.

I hoped this could be in two threads as they are in different sections of the forum, and I want to bring peoples attention to it (I personally never saw the other thread and never would have as I don't visit that forum)

I gotta disagree with you on this one man. I work for a reptile shop and this is a serious threat to the hobby. The average person who only wants a scorpion or two shouldn't have a problem with it, but honestly, apathy is whats going to kill this. The idea of well, I can still keep my pet, it doesn't effect me. However, if you want to move out of state with a non-native species not on the approved list, you can't and most importantly, literally the vast majority of exotic pets in the trade come from outside this country. I would bet that under this law most reptile shops and invert shops would have a lot to fear. Furthermore, what about the transportation of animals under the law. A good portion of people come from areas where collecting scorpions is difficult or impossible. While you might still have your a pet and a number of people would probably still keep and breed some non native scorpions illegally, I hardly see why this is justified, and why we should just accept it because it won't effect us until we want another pet.

 

[saxman146]

It seems ludicrous to say 'If you already have these animals in your posession prior to April 23, 2009 it is legal for you to posess them after the bill is passed.' So apparently if you were born in the 1930s you can sell marijuana since you would not be under the same laws everyone else would be, right?The whole thing sound like BS. Maybe I interpret wrong.

 

[What]

I gotta disagree with you on this one man....pet.

That was my gut reaction as well, then I realized that the whole point of the bill was to protect other areas of our ecosystems from possible damage while imposing fines for releasing animals. And after reading through the bill it became quite apparent that what I had been hearing was misinformation and the bill is not at all as extreme as people are claiming.

To save myself some typing... go read my posts in the other thread, they cover most of the questions that people have...

@ Saxman: Think of this more like the Assault Weapon Ban, the guns people had when the bill passed were grandfathered because it is far less work to let the people who have the guns/animals already keep them but to restrict what else was coming in/being distributed... So basically damage control after what happened in the Everglades to ensure it does not happen elsewhere.

 

[tabor]

while this is scary, i doubt it will pass, i doubt anyone will even vote on it. 1000's of bills are introduced to Congress (to be more specific, the house of represntatives) if they some how pass it, it still has to go through the senate.

now, if it wins in the House, that's when i would start getting concerned.

i doubt they will put many resources into enforcing this... lets see... terrorism, border control, the economy... nope! bugs are way more important than all those! :wall:

 

[tabor]

while this is scary, i doubt it will pass, i doubt anyone will even vote on it. 1000's of bills are introduced to Congress (to be more specific, the house of representatives) if they some how pass it, it still has to go through the senate.

now, if it wins in the House, that's when i would start getting concerned.

i doubt they will put many resources into enforcing this... lets see... terrorism, border control, the economy... nope! bugs are way more important than all those! :wall:

 

[alexi]

haha well said. We'll just go rogue.

 

[Envyizm]

This bill is another example of our hard earned tax dollars at work :? . I agree with tab all the way. This bill isnt very likely to pass. If it does and if our tax dollars get wasted to enforce this I will be playing cards with all of you guys in jail for comensary :}.

 

[tabor]

It will not pass on its own... no one has anything to gain from signing it besides MAYBE a Florida congressman. If it EVER passes, or any bill like it, it will be tacked on to a much larger bill, like say a tax return. This is reffered to as "pork".

I can't remember what the main bill was, but lets just say it was Bush's bill for extra financing for the military in '06. Now, everyone is going to vote for this, and they did. But to "sweeten" the deal for other Senators and such, there were tons of minor bills attached to it, including one banning online gambling.

So, those who wouldnt vote for it (ie opposed to the war), voted for it anyways because republicans threw in pork like that so the Senator could go home and be like "See look what i did for you guys! reelect me!"

if a bill like this is ever passed it will be randomly attached to a much larger bill, and more than likely you wont even know about it until it's too late.

but like i said, even if it does pass they aren't going to allocate the funds to enforce it. Drugs, war, money... all three going on right now, no one cares about bugs.

 

[Naga]

Yeah. That'd probably be it. There's little reason this would pass straight. Passing this straight would mean every man or woman without a cat or dog would have to catch their pets on their own. Heh