Need Help ASAP: Brazilian Blue broken leg

[CreepinItReal]

My pterinopelma sazimai has broken a leg. I was feeding it a cricket tonight. She was half leaned up on the wall of her enclosure. I had the cricket in the tongs and was lowering it down to her (this was my first time feeding her like this - I usually drop the cricket in the enclosure and let her do her thing but I decided to do it how I've seen some people feed their Ts by basically handing them the cricket in the tongs. Probably a noob mistake on my part...). She lunged for it and it made me jump so she didn't get the cricket. But in the process I believe she broke her leg. She slowly walked into her hide after it happened and I noticed one of her front legs was twitching and appeared limp. She's in her hide now and I see blood (?). I feel absolutely dreadful. The picture I've attached shows blood on her leg and blood that's dripped on the ground. I also attached a video of when it happened. I dunno if videos work on here but guess we'll find out.

Should I do anything? I don't want to stress her out further. She's in her hide and if I attempted any help I'd have to make her leave her hide and I doubt she wants to do that. Do you think she'll die or be okay or it'll grow back when she molts? I know sometimes they bite off a broken leg. She's still small. Not matured yet. Does that mean she has a better chance of it growing back? Assuming this doesn't kill her. Sigh. I'm so worried.

 

[Pyroxian]

Hard to see very clearly, but in general leg injuries are not an issue for a T. Keep an eye on it, if the leaking stops do nothing. If it keeps up, you can try applying corn starch to staunch the flow (but with a spider that quick....). If it's bothering the spider, it will drop the leg by itself (closing a valve at the base) and regrow over the next couple moults.
I don't tong feed for this reason, plus the risk of fang damage on the metal...

 

[CreepinItReal]

Hard to see very clearly, but in general leg injuries are not an issue for a T. Keep an eye on it, if the leaking stops do nothing. If it keeps up, you can try applying corn starch to staunch the flow (but with a spider that quick....). If it's bothering the spider, it will drop the leg by itself (closing a valve at the base) and regrow over the next couple moults.
I don't tong feed for this reason, plus the risk of fang damage on the metal...

The leaking didn't appear to continue to flow. I'd love to apply some corn starch or a dab of super glue to the wound but she's in her hide now and I don't wanna stress her out or cause her to bleed out more. She's typically pretty calm. She just gets excited when it's feeding time haha. I'm watching her closely. I can't see everything that's going on when she's inside her hide but I'm seeing her chelicerae moving quite a bit. I'm wondering if she's already begun amputating the leg (been about an hour and a half since the injury occurred).

I always drop the cricket into her enclosure and let her do her thing. Tonight was the first time I decided to try something different and attempt feeding her how I've seen some other people feed their Ts...by basically bringing the cricket to them and letting them grab it from the tongs. I thought maybe she'd prefer that...but looking back now that feels stupid and like a noob mistake. Definitely won't attempt tong feeding anymore in the future. Thank you for your input and advice! I appreciate it so much! Will keep this thread posted as to what happens to her.

 

[Pyroxian]

The leaking didn't appear to continue to flow. I'd love to apply some corn starch or a dab of super glue to the wound but she's in her hide now and I don't wanna stress her out or cause her to bleed out more. She's typically pretty calm. She just gets excited when it's feeding time haha. I'm watching her closely. I can't see everything that's going on when she's inside her hide but I'm seeing her chelicerae moving quite a bit. I'm wondering if she's already begun amputating the leg (been about an hour and a half since the injury occurred).

I always drop the cricket into her enclosure and let her do her thing. Tonight was the first time I decided to try something different and attempt feeding her how I've seen some other people feed their Ts...by basically bringing the cricket to them and letting them grab it from the tongs. I thought maybe she'd prefer that...but looking back now that feels stupid and like a noob mistake. Definitely won't attempt tong feeding anymore in the future. Thank you for your input and advice! I appreciate it so much! Will keep this thread posted as to what happens to her.

I would consider super glue a last resort measure, it's far too easy to get it where you don't want it or to glue the old exoskeleton to the newly forming one underneath, which could be fatal at the next moult. If the flow stopped on its own, that's a very good sign, just let things progress and consider it a cheap lesson in the dangers of tong feeding. And again, leg injuries are typically a complete non-issue and more often than not if it is the rare leg injury that doesn't stop, the T can and will just drop the leg. Scary, sure, but nothing to worry about.

 

[CreepinItReal]

I would consider super glue a last resort measure, it's far too easy to get it where you don't want it or to glue the old exoskeleton to the newly forming one underneath, which could be fatal at the next moult. If the flow stopped on its own, that's a very good sign, just let things progress and consider it a cheap lesson in the dangers of tong feeding. And again, leg injuries are typically a complete non-issue and more often than not if it is the rare leg injury that doesn't stop, the T can and will just drop the leg. Scary, sure, but nothing to worry about.

Sage wisdom/advice! I will consider super glue a later resort then. That makes sense. And yes, lesson learned. Truly, thank you so much for your helpful comments.

 

[viper69]

A few things

1. I think your screenname is very clever!
2. Your "bright" idea- not at all clever
3. I'm bookmarking this post because time and time again we get tong feeders defending their stupid actions. Your mistake will serve as a lesson for 2 things

A. Don't watch YouTube, and follow along w/the crowd without first applying critical thinking skills
B. Don't tong feed.

Do you think she'll die

No one can predict this. Unlikely, but it's possible!

by basically bringing the cricket to them and letting them grab it from the tongs.

I have to ask this question- WHY did you do this? I don't care that you saw it on YouTube, or that you thought your T would "like" it.--- WHY, and I'm serious, WHY would you SPOON feed a WILD animal that is perfectly capable, after millions of years of evolution, of hunting on its own?

Why do you think a T needs YOUR help to eat in this context? I'm curious what your rationale was.

I thought maybe she'd prefer that

Because they have this option in the wild??

looking back now that feels stupid and like a noob mistake

You are correct but...below

Definitely won't attempt tong feeding anymore in the future

I'm glad you learned. It's a shame about your cherished pet however.

Ts do just fine without us out in the wild, I know that sounds like a crazy, crazy notion. But believe it or not, they actually are doing just fine without us.

Does that mean she has a better chance of it growing back?

Given that it's young, and not an adult, what it means is that it will molt more frequently, thus the leg will grow back faster than if it was an adult. As you MAY know, adult Ts molt less frequently.

plus the risk of fang damage on the metal..

Couldn't agree more, great way to potentially kill your T, esp if both fangs are lost/damaged severely.

 

[CreepinItReal]

1. Thank you for the screen name compliment. I'm quite proud of it.
2. Yep, I realized it wasn't very clever. I own my mistake.
3. I'm not surprised some tong feeders defend their actions. I'm not about to defend my action of attempted tong feeding. I did however want to explain my thought process behind it (which I will do so below).

A. I wouldn't say I was following along with the crowd without first applying critical thinking skills. I've had this p. sazimai for a little over a year. I never tong fed until last night due to curiosity and wondering if it would be more efficient, plus perhaps a more calm way to do things. I say that because often times when I drop the cricket in the enclosure to feed the T the cricket frantically crawls under a fake rock or a plant while trying to escape and it gets stuck or just sits there for a couple hours. I then have to dig it out and disrupt my T's peace and her hard work of making herself at home in her enclosure (I would hate to ruin one of her epic, architectural burrows/tunnels). In doing so, it sometimes causes her to lose interest in eating for a couple hours till things chill out again. I never leave crickets in my T's enclosure since I know crickets can be savage. So believe me when I say I had good intentions in mind. However, due to my still learning (as we all are in our own ways), I had to learn this lesson the hard way (as we all do sometimes). Now that I have learned I'm just going to stick with how I've been feeding her for the past year (dropping the cricket in and letting the T do her thing). And no, Ts doing just fine without us does not sound like a crazy, crazy notion to me lol. I never thought she wouldn't be able to. However, I am aware some wild animals kept in captivity don't quite know how to do things they normally would know how to do if they were truly from the wild and not captive raised. That also was kind of in the back of my mind. Not AS much though because well...this is eating. A very basic skill. So yeah, tong feeding isn't necessary. I'd rather chase a cricket down or dig it out of a tight spot and cause some disruption every now and then rather than risking my T getting hurt.

With all this in mind, no need to over-scold me, talk down on me, or make me feel dumb...as I feel you did =/ This is a community and I don't think speaking to each other like that is necessary. I've been very aware that it is a wild animal. I never believed she needed my "help" in this way. "Spoon" feeding wasn't what I had in mind. I gave my reasoning above and I think it was understandable. Particularly for someone still learning and willing to do anything to possibly make their spider happier. Also, some Ts are very skittish and I thought perhaps she'd be less likely to retreat to her hide this way. It was an experiment and I had goodwill in mind. Just turned out to be something I had to learn....as we all do sometimes. I'm sure you've made mistakes with your Ts too and that's okay. Empathy, you know? But I hope someone reading this in the future finds this thread helpful and that it makes them feel not so alone in this type of mistake.

With all this in mind, immediately after the incident happened I hurriedly made my post on Arachnoboards. I was kiiiiiiiiind of freaking out, in case you didn't notice lol. I was worried for her and just needed some encouragement as well as helpful advice. Someone to pretty much be like "It's probably gonna be okay, dude." Such as the user Pyroxian kindly and professionally did.

Anyway, my T did indeed swiftly amputate her entire leg. No more bleeding. And I think she ate it lol the leg is no where to be found. She's a pretty metal, brave little T. I'm honestly inspired by her <3 Not even 24 hours after the incident and she's conducted surgery on herself, stopped the bleeding, eaten a cricket, been out of her hide several times already and she's acting like her normal self. I left a pre-killed cricket in her enclosure about 2 and a half hours after the incident. When I woke up today the cricket was gone. So I was relieved to see that she was still interested in eating.

Anyway, I am finished writing my above novel lol. Thanks for reading this far if you did. Viper69, I appreciate your input and wanting to help. I got something out of it. Perhaps just work on your presentation haha. See you around!

 

[viper69]

1. Thank you for the screen name compliment. I'm quite proud of it.
2. Yep, I realized it wasn't very clever. I own my mistake.
3. I'm not surprised some tong feeders defend their actions. I'm not about to defend my action of attempted tong feeding. I did however want to explain my thought process behind it (which I will do so below).

A. I wouldn't say I was following along with the crowd without first applying critical thinking skills. I've had this p. sazimai for a little over a year. I never tong fed until last night due to curiosity and wondering if it would be more efficient, plus perhaps a more calm way to do things. I say that because often times when I drop the cricket in the enclosure to feed the T the cricket frantically crawls under a fake rock or a plant while trying to escape and it gets stuck or just sits there for a couple hours. I then have to dig it out and disrupt my T's peace and her hard work of making herself at home in her enclosure (I would hate to ruin one of her epic, architectural burrows/tunnels). In doing so, it sometimes causes her to lose interest in eating for a couple hours till things chill out again. I never leave crickets in my T's enclosure since I know crickets can be savage. So believe me when I say I had good intentions in mind. However, due to my still learning (as we all are in our own ways), I had to learn this lesson the hard way (as we all do sometimes). Now that I have learned I'm just going to stick with how I've been feeding her for the past year (dropping the cricket in and letting the T do her thing). And no, Ts doing just fine without us does not sound like a crazy, crazy notion to me lol. I never thought she wouldn't be able to. However, I am aware some wild animals kept in captivity don't quite know how to do things they normally would know how to do if they were truly from the wild and not captive raised. That also was kind of in the back of my mind. Not AS much though because well...this is eating. A very basic skill. So yeah, tong feeding isn't necessary. I'd rather chase a cricket down or dig it out of a tight spot and cause some disruption every now and then rather than risking my T getting hurt.

With all this in mind, no need to over-scold me, talk down on me, or make me feel dumb...as I feel you did =/ This is a community and I don't think speaking to each other like that is necessary. I've been very aware that it is a wild animal. I never believed she needed my "help" in this way. "Spoon" feeding wasn't what I had in mind. I gave my reasoning above and I think it was understandable. Particularly for someone still learning and willing to do anything to possibly make their spider happier. Also, some Ts are very skittish and I thought perhaps she'd be less likely to retreat to her hide this way. It was an experiment and I had goodwill in mind. Just turned out to be something I had to learn....as we all do sometimes. I'm sure you've made mistakes with your Ts too and that's okay. Empathy, you know? But I hope someone reading this in the future finds this thread helpful and that it makes them feel not so alone in this type of mistake.

With all this in mind, immediately after the incident happened I hurriedly made my post on Arachnoboards. I was kiiiiiiiiind of freaking out, in case you didn't notice lol. I was worried for her and just needed some encouragement as well as helpful advice. Someone to pretty much be like "It's probably gonna be okay, dude." Such as the user Pyroxian kindly and professionally did.

Anyway, my T did indeed swiftly amputate her entire leg. No more bleeding. And I think she ate it lol the leg is no where to be found. She's a pretty metal, brave little T. I'm honestly inspired by her <3 Not even 24 hours after the incident and she's conducted surgery on herself, stopped the bleeding, eaten a cricket, been out of her hide several times already and she's acting like her normal self. I left a pre-killed cricket in her enclosure about 2 and a half hours after the incident. When I woke up today the cricket was gone. So I was relieved to see that she was still interested in eating.

Anyway, I am finished writing my above novel lol. Thanks for reading this far if you did. Viper69, I appreciate your input and wanting to help. I got something out of it. Perhaps just work on your presentation haha. See you around!

@CreepinItReal Love that name, had to use it as a tag!

I thoroughly appreciate the time you took out of your busy day to explain your thought process, few people take the time; I read it all. I was serious, and thus your answer to my question deserves my complete attention to each word.

I'm glad you wrote, this gave me a lot of insight that previously was not possible.

I couldn't tell you were freaking out. I was merely reading text. I did see ASAP, but many people put that for no good reason at all. I knew you were concerned, but I wouldn't have said freaking out.

and wondering if it would be more efficient, plus perhaps a more calm way to do things

Having your T kill crickets is the the most efficient

to feed the T the cricket frantically crawls under a fake rock or a plant while trying to escape and it gets stuck or just sits there for a couple hours

The above reason here I'm glad you mentioned. This is why I asked you seriously as opposed to not caring at all. This makes a lot of sense, I can see why people think this. In point of fact, Ts many times (without us knowing) are in fact resting. It's only evident when they are surprised, such as when a prey items is presented. Provided your T is hungry, as long as you drop the cricket at a reasonable distance, yours sounds jumpy (not uncommon for this species), its reaction is not relevant. For example, sometimes when I drop a crix in with my Avics, they are either caught off guard, or don't like the position they are in relative to the Tprey. However, once they realize what is going on, they either have dinner, or pull an Avic defensive movement, and I pull the crix.

I then have to dig it out and disrupt my T's peace

Do not worry about this. Living in the wild, where you are food for SOMETHING, is far worse than captivity, of course, they don't know this.

it sometimes causes her to lose interest in eating for a couple hours till things chill out again

See above regarding my Avic. In short, they don't need to eat right away. If you provide a proper size prey item, you can leave a crix in there overnight. A hungry T will take it out. I've had a cricket become roommates with one of my Avics, and a week later I hear the clatter of legs trapping a cricket.

I never leave crickets in my T's enclosure since I know crickets can be savage

See above

I am aware some wild animals kept in captivity don't quite know how to do things they normally would know how to do if they were truly from the wild and not captive raised.

Understood, I'm aware of this as well. It is not something that applies to these animals however fortunately.

Anyway, my T did indeed swiftly amputate her entire leg. No more bleeding

EXCELLENT

And I think she ate it lol the leg is no where to be found

Food is scarce, never know when you will have a meal. Geckos eat their own skin- proteins are precious resources.

 

[cold blood]

for future reference....ts have a "valve" at the base of each leg that they will close off in cases of injury....therefore theres little need to help stop a bleeding leg...its not a potentially fatal injury for the most part.

Cornstarch and other emergency procedures should be relegated to body injuries.