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More Parabuthus ID's

Discussion in 'Scorpions' started by Ice Cold Milk, Mar 30, 2008.

  1. Ice Cold Milk

    Ice Cold Milk Arachnobaron Old Timer

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    All specimens collected near Springbok, South Africa (near the Namibian border). Unfortunately, all the specimens given to me were male :(
    I am near certain of the ID's of the 1st scorpion and last scorpion, and given the location, i think i may have a color-morph i've never seen before of the 2nd scorpion...


    so have at it, please. I'm by no means an expert at ID'ing them, so any input is welcome before i start tackling the tedious job of using scientific journals to ID them :)
    I've got some more morph's/species to ID, but will save that for another thread so that things don't get too complicated.
    (pics are in pairs)
    -=ICM=-
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    Last edited: Mar 30, 2008
  2. Austin S.

    Austin S. Arachnoprince Old Timer

    Whatever they are, they are absolutely stunning, especially specimen 2 (the darker one). Wish we had things like that in Oklahoma!!! :rolleyes: Can't help you with the ID, sorry bud.
     
  3. Galapoheros

    Galapoheros ArachnoGod Old Timer

    Yeah that dark one with the light legs, I like that one. Sorry, can't ID those, thanks for the pics.
     
  4. Michiel

    Michiel Arachnoking Old Timer

    I would say P.leavipes (not P.liosoma and maybe P.namibensis, but it seems to miss the dorsalventral line across the tergites, but still an option), P.granulatus and P.slechteri.....that's my shot at it. :D Very nice specimens BTW!
     
  5. magikscorps

    magikscorps Arachnoknight

    OMG...............wish I was there:D
     
  6. bluefrogtat2

    bluefrogtat2 Arachnoangel Old Timer

    amazing

    totally spectacular specimens.look at those tails.amazing.remind me alot of liosoma.have no idea on id but sure wish i was there
    andy
     
  7. K3jser

    K3jser Arachnobaron

    Well first 2 pictures is Parabuthus liosoma 0.1, iam pretty sure about that one :D

    and 3rd and 4th picture iam geussing Parabuthus pallidus 1.0


    and the last pictures its some color veriant of Parabuthus transvaalicus 0.1


    :D
     
  8. bluefrogtat2

    bluefrogtat2 Arachnoangel Old Timer

    liosoma

    wish some of my liosoma looked like either of the first two pics?incredible greenish coloration.sweet scorps
    andy
     
  9. CID143ti

    CID143ti Arachnoknight Old Timer

    I really don't think the first one is a P. liosoma. I always thought they were not from that area but more towards the east African areas. I could see the first scorp being a very clean colored P. raudus but that is just a guess. What size is it? Leeming says that P. leavipes is a smaller Parabuthus. What do you think it is?

    I wonder if the second scorpion is P. granulatus since the sting is so small.

    I bet that the third is a P. villosus. Reason saying that Leeming also states that they can be black with yellow legs depending on where they are from. What do you think it is? If you look at the maps he provides all three scorps can be found in a similar locations.

    Just guessing but maybe someone with more info can shed some more light,

    W. Smith
     
    Last edited: Mar 31, 2008
  10. ftorres

    ftorres Arachnobaron Old Timer

    Hello,
    You do have some great scorpions, its a shame they all males.

    I think the species are as follow

    P leavipes
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    P granulatus
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    P schlechteri
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    Thanks for sharin these great pictures.

    francisco T
     
  11. Ice Cold Milk

    Ice Cold Milk Arachnobaron Old Timer

    Ok so here's what I think:

    the first one is pretty darn surely P. leavipes. The two I have are both full grown males, and are quite small for Parabuthus. It fits the range they were found in (liesoma's range is no nearer than 600km East of where these were found). It's not namibensis, these were found too far south.

    2nd one is baffling me... I am leaning towards P. granulatus, but as I said I've never seen a morph like this one. Thing about granulatus is that it's so widespread it makes it difficult to know exactly if you've stumbled on it. I really am wondering if it could be P. raudus, but b/c of the size of the sting i'm thinking granulatus.

    3rd one I'm leaning towards P. schlecteri. It's a full grown male, and isn't nearly as large as P. villosus males I've had, and isn't as hairy. It fits the known range of schlecteri. Also, it's much more shy and is eager to dig a lot more than the P. villosus i've kept. I counted the "granular keels on the fourth caudal segment", and it has more than 10 though... confusing!!!

    These things need to come with labels.

    By far my favorite of this batch are the P. leavipes. Y'all should hear them when they're angry! Their tail-clicking is much louder and quicker-in-succession than any other i've seen!

    -=ICM=-
     
  12. Skywalker

    Skywalker Arachnopeon

    Hi Matt,

    you should have shoot me an email about this! :p
    Great scorpions indeed and like others said it's a shame that they are all male :mad:
    I agree on the 2nd and 3rd scorpion being P.granulatus and P.schlechteri. But the first one is definitely not "P.leavipes". I asked Lorenzo Prendini about this species a while ago and he told me that it's a mistake in J.Leemings book. There is no species called P.leavipes.
    The scorpion on the first picture could be P.laevifrons but I have two females at home and pics of a male and your specimen doesn't look alike (ie the pedipalps are not bulbous enough). I'm pretty sure it's a P.raudus male. ;)
     
  13. Ice Cold Milk

    Ice Cold Milk Arachnobaron Old Timer

    Perhaps with the species in the first pics, i'm incorrect in saying it's a male??

    I'm not the best at sexing, either!
    can get pics of the ventral side if you'd like.

    How can it be P. raudus? these things look full grown and are quite small! AB member "Ceratogyrus" has a P. raudus (positively ID'ed by Ian Engelbrecht, probably), and it's like twice the size of these.

    -=ICM=-
     
  14. Skywalker

    Skywalker Arachnopeon

    Hi Matt,

    if possible please post a pic of the pectines of the first species. Then I can tell for sure what sex it is.
    I'm still leaning towards P.raudus. There's a big difference in size and coloration within one species if it's as widespread as P.raudus. Pics of the metasoma will help to ID the scorp. I will check the key now and tell you what to look for on your specimen or what pics I need.
     
  15. Michiel

    Michiel Arachnoking Old Timer

    Hi Peter,

    Are you sure of the the scorpion in the first picture? I am not dicussing your ID,because you know more of Parabuthus then I do, that's for sure. But the scorp does resemble the picture of P.leavipes in J.Leeming's book, with the half moon shaped light circle on the carapace. I also know that ID scorpions from pics alone is not very scientific and very hard :D But I am just interested in your thoughts.
    Maybe the name is incorrect, but the scorp is the same?
     
  16. Skywalker

    Skywalker Arachnopeon

    Ok Matt, besides the pics of the pectines here’s what else would be helpful:

    Pics of:
    metasomal segment II dorsal (stridulatory surface must be visible)
    metasomal segment IV ventral and lateral
    metasomal segment V ventral and lateral

    Can you please also take pics of the same metasomal segments of P.granulatus? I never had the opportunity to see a live specimen or get pictures of the segements so I hope you can do me this favour.


    @Michiel: I noticed the shape on the carapace too. It seems like it's typical to P.laevifrons, at least my specimen do have this shape and I did not see it on the pics of P.raudus (yes, I only have pics of P.raudus, unfortunately :mad: {D ) But to be able to say it for sure I need the pics of metasomal segment IV. The median lateral carinae is absent or more weakly developed as the dorsolateral and ventrolateral carinae in P.laevifrons and some other species.
     
  17. Ice Cold Milk

    Ice Cold Milk Arachnobaron Old Timer

    ok so to start is scorpion 1 and 2, their pectines.

    other pics are of the same scorp.
    I didn't get segment V very much...and couldn't get light for segment 2 (it's night here!!)

    can get better pics tomorrow, feel free to give pointers on sharper images, other areas etc to photograph.

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  18. Ice Cold Milk

    Ice Cold Milk Arachnobaron Old Timer

    doesn't look to me like missing or less developed granulation on segment IV...unless i'm looking at the wrong thing? :)

    I'll get around to photographing you P. granulatus tomorrow. It's late!
    It'll be worth it though, got 3 different color variants I can show you.
     
  19. Skywalker

    Skywalker Arachnopeon

    The first two pics show the pectines of a male Parabuthus sp. So your sexing was correct. What size are those scorpions? Perhaps they are subadults because for adult males of P.laevifrons the pedipalps are too small. I will send you a pic of a male via email.
    Can you post a clearer pic of metasomal segment IV ventral? I'm not sure if I see the granulation on the pic or not :D I will also send you a drawing out of a paper where you can see what to look for.
     
    Last edited: Apr 2, 2008
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