Identify this Spider, please

Biollantefan54

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Yep, that's a Philodromid, the only dangerous spider you probably have to worry about are Latrodectus and even then they not are going to run out and chase you
 
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Biollantefan54

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If you're in California, you don't have to worry about any of those. Hobo spiders and wolf spiders are completely harmless
 

Lucashank

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Yep, that's a Philodromid, the only dangerous spider you probably have to worry about are Latrodectus and even then they are going to run out and chase you
The only reaction I've ever gotten when bothering a Latrodectus is they make a hasty retreat. I've never heard of one going after a person. It was always interesting to me the way they can differentiate between possible predators and prey.

If you're in California, you don't have to worry about any of those. Hobo spiders and wolf spiders are completely harmless
Absolutely not trying to hound you, but I'm fairly sure that "hobo spider" bites are known to cause dermonecrosis. Not very sure about the Lycosidae/Hogna, though.
 

Lucashank

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Are Hobo Spiders aggressive? I've read that their vemon is powerful but do they bite frequently?
I seriously doubt they would go out of their way to touch you. Even as a child, I would try to catch every spider and play with it, and almost all would run away.
The only time I've ever been bitten by a spider was when I had to sleep on a couch that was left outside in the Arkansas summer that had become a home to a large amount of spiders I never identified. I got pretty sick afterwards, needless to say.
Just go by the "Don't touch" rule, and you'll generally be fine.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure that most bites happen in situations like the spider is in your slipper, or in your bed, or went up your pant leg or shirt and you accidentally squeeze it.
 

schmiggle

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According to Wikipedia, the toxicity of hobo spider bites is ambiguous:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hobo_spider

As far as I know, you're generally right about the "stuck in a pant leg" rule, but I think there are a few species that are exceptions (though the ones I'm thinking of are large and not native to North America).
 

Lucashank

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According to Wikipedia, the toxicity of hobo spider bites is ambiguous:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hobo_spider

As far as I know, you're generally right about the "stuck in a pant leg" rule, but I think there are a few species that are exceptions (though the ones I'm thinking of are large and not native to North America).
If you read the full article that you linked, in the 'Toxicity and Aggression' section, it states "This laboratory study has led to the proposal that in some parts of the U.S. nearly all bites attributed to the brown recluse spider are in reality the hobo spider's bite.[8] The CDC and other U.S. government agencies[9] have also used this same study as the basis for a report claiming that the hobo spider bite causes necrosis in humans,[10]"

Edit: Although considering I have no legitimate proof at this time disputing the ambiguity, I will agree with you.

Edit again: This article seems to conflict with itself often on this subject. It's actually pretty funny, I guess.
 
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KenTheOtherBugGuy

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...or in your bed...
Whoa, whoa... I guess I'm be sleeping on the hammock with the trees burning to flames... lol

Back in my kid years, in Philippines, I would just catch all spider I see and make them fight on a stick and never got bitten. But, when we got here in Cali, I found out about Redback Spiders and yeeeh, I became unsure of every true spiders out in the world.
 

Lucashank

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Whoa, whoa... I guess I'm be sleeping on the hammock with the trees burning to flames... lol

Back in my kid years, in Philippines, I would just catch all spider I see and make them fight on a stick and never got bitten. But, when we got here in Cali, I found out about Redback Spiders and yeeeh, I became unsure of every true spiders out in the world.
Well I think being bit by a spider is pretty unlikely anyways. But when I'm in an area that has more insects and such, I always check my shoes, sheets, toilet, and give my clothing a shake.
Although I'm sure anyone could say it is a bit paranoid.
 

KenTheOtherBugGuy

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Well I think being bit by a spider is pretty unlikely anyways. But when I'm in an area that has more insects and such, I always check my shoes, sheets, toilet, and give my clothing a shake.
Although I'm sure anyone could say it is a bit paranoid.
No, that would be called safety... I definitely would be doing that also, especially my bed... Thanks:smug:
 

schmiggle

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This article seems to conflict with itself often on this subject. It's actually pretty funny, I guess.
Yes, that's sort of what I meant. :p I assume it contradicts itself because the research does.
 

chanda

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Absolutely not trying to hound you, but I'm fairly sure that "hobo spider" bites are known to cause dermonecrosis. Not very sure about the Lycosidae/Hogna, though.
Are Hobo Spiders aggressive? I've read that their vemon is powerful but do they bite frequently?

Hobo spiders are not aggressive. Like most spiders, they prefer to run and hide. They are a member of the Agelenidae (funnel weavers) and, like other Agelenids, will retreat into their funnel web when approached. When people encounter hobo spiders, it is usually males (who are wandering around in search of a mate rather than tucked away in a web retreat.) They will still try to run away, though - and they are speedy little critters! They are only likely to bite when accidentally trapped between human skin and another surface, such as clothing or bedding.

Hobo spiders are also not particularly dangerous. The CDC no longer includes them on their list of potentially medically significant spiders in the US, leaving only the black widows and brown recluse. https://www.cdc.gov/niosh/topics/spiders/types.html

The fear of hobo spiders is based on a lot of bad anecdotal evidence. Basically, someone sees a hobo spider (or what they think is a hobo spider) or hears that hobo spiders can be found in their area. Later, they develop some sort of mysterious lump, bump, lesion, or sore and immediately assume that a hobo spider was to blame. The truth is that there is no proof that hobo spider bites cause necrotic wounds. There was one study (in rabbits, not people) that suggested that hobo venom could cause dermonecrosis - but attempts to replicate the study have failed to yield necrotic wounds. Necrotic wounds are far more likely to be caused by bacterial infections or other underlying illness than by spider bite. (The brown recluse gets a similar bad rap - in most cases of alleged recluse bites, no spider was actually seen. Someone just developed a lesion or necrotic wound and assumed that a recluse was the cause.) http://ipm.ucanr.edu/PMG/PESTNOTES/pn7488.html

My mom is a perfect example. For years, she told everyone who would listen how bad the hobo spiders in her house were and that she frequently suffered from bites. Hobo spiders did, in fact, live in her basement, so everyone accepted the story - until she came down with a particularly bad case of "bites." Just the fact that it was multiple bites strongly suggests that spiders weren't to blame. It would be rare for spiders to bite multiple times or attack en masse. First, she was telling us that the bites were red, sore, and swollen, with a little blister-like area at the top that would eventually turn into an open sore, though hers were not necrotic. But then it really got weird. She started talking about the venom "going away" and "coming back." Bites would heal, then recur at the same location. But the real kicker was when she said how the venom would spread. She could see little red lines radiating from the original bites where the "venom" was spreading under her skin, and then new lesions would pop up on the surrounding tissue. This was what sounded the alarm bells for my sister and I - we bullied her into seeing a doctor about it with a barrage of emails about MRSA and other nasty bacterial infections (which is, of course, what she actually had). When she finally saw the doctor and took a course of strong antibiotics, all the "bites" cleared up! (Yet, a year later, when she had another round of "bites," her first thought was still spiders! We had to persuade her all over again to go see the doctor and get antibiotics.)
 
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chanda

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Yep, that's a Philodromid, the only dangerous spider you probably have to worry about are Latrodectus and even then they are going to run out and chase you
I think you mean "are not going to run out and chase you"? ;)
 

Ungoliant

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Are Hobo Spiders aggressive? I've read that their vemon is powerful but do they bite frequently?
The hobo spider (Eratigena agrestis, formerly known as Tegenaria agrestis) is not medically significant, contrary to what some sources say. (Like most spiders, they are technically venomous and are capable of biting in self defense, but they have not been proven to be dangerous to people.)

It's interesting to note that in Europe, where these spiders are native, they are not considered dangerous.

Additionally, the common name "aggressive house spider" was coined by someone who mistranslated the Latin name. Agrestis means "of the field," not "aggressive."


Mandy of Spiders.us said:
Research has recently (2011) shown that the hobo's venom does not destroy mammalian cells and that their fangs did not carry bacteria (findings here). Who knows what will happen with additional research but, to date, there's been no verified case of this spider biting a human... and all research and arachnological opinion points to it being no more dangerous than any other regular ol' spider. (And if the hobo were established in NY or anywhere else outside of the northwest region, arachnologists would know about it. Things do get transferred around, and that's how the hobo got here in the first place from Europe... but right now there are no established populations in the east.)
Spiders.us said:
  • Please note that there is currently no solid scientific evidence suggesting that the venom of this species is of medical significance in humans (the work of Darwin Vest dealt with rabbits and, so far, subsequent researchers have been unable to repeat his results).
  • Recent research published in 2014 reported the first verified bite from a hobo spider, which resulted in pain, redness, and twitching in the calf muscle which went away after 12 hours (McKeown et al. 2014). It may take some time for researchers to gather more instances of verifiable hobo spider bites in order to find out more about the toxicity, or lack thereof, of its venom. Until that time, it would seem practical, based on all the evidence at hand, to consider the hobo spider a non-medically significant species.
  • Research published in March of 2011 "confirms previous results and provides further evidence that the hobo spider is not a spider of medical concern" (Gaver-Wainwright et al. 2011); it was found that the venom of the hobo spider did not kill mammalian cells (was not necrotic) and that spider specimens exposed to MRSA did not transfer the bacteria.

Summary of sources (with links) from Reddit:

Reddit said:
I'm just going to get it all out here, tag this page and refer people to this thread in the future.

There is no scientific evidence to support that hobo spiders are any more dangerous than other spiders, including other species of Tegenaria. This myth only exists in the U.S. The spiders are considered harmless in their native Europe, and in Europe there have been documented bites without necrosis.

To establish causality, you need evidence that one thing is associated with the other. In this case, "one thing" is the spider bite, and "the other" is necrosis. A spider bite is established when you see/feel a spider biting and catch it in the act, and subsequently identify the species. There was one documented bite in a Spokane woman who had another medical condition that coincidentally is associated with dermonecrotic lesions. That doesn't count. In another incident, they blamed a spider they found on a railroad track beside the victim's house. Please. When you get a necrotic lesion, you can't just search the neighborhood and blame the nearest arthropod. This is not how science works. Also, these incidents were some 20 years ago. If anything, the population of hobos has increased and spread since then. If the threat is worth warning people about, you would expect evidence that anyone has been bitten - but there isn't any. Not a single instance.

One study in rabbits found that their venom causes necrosis in rabbits (well, in one species of rabbit but not another species). Rabbit physiology is different from human physiology, and several venoms are known to affect some mammals and not others. Furthermore, in that study, the spiders could not even be provoked to bite. The researchers tried their best to piss off the spiders and get them to bite, and they wouldn't. The researchers ended up extracting the venom and injecting it into the rabbits themselves. Thus, the amount of venom administered in a real bite may not be comparable - if you can even get one to bite.

For the spider to be harmless in Europe, but necrotic in the Pacific Northwest, some theories were proposed:

1) the separate populations evolved different venoms

2) they carry different microbes that are responsible for lesions or

3) arachnophobic Americans were quick to latch onto early erroneous reports and repeated them so much they became common knowledge.

Theories 1 and 2 were debunked by Binford, et al, 2001.

Theory 3 is also supported by the fact that physicians in states/provinces where hobos do not exist attribute necrotic wounds to hobo spiders. Hobos get blamed where hobos do not exist, just like brown recluses get blamed even in Alaska, several thousand miles away from any brown recluse.

For more on this topic see:

Bennett & Vetter, 2004 "Erroneous attribution of dermonecrotic lesions to brown recluse or hobo spider bites in Canada."

Gaver-Wainwright et al., 2011 - study showing hobo venom is not hemolytic and contains no pathogenic bacteria.

Vetter et al., 2003 on the distribution of T. agrestis versus where bites are reported.

A good summary of evidence at Utah extension.

British Columbia Ent Society with a summary of Binford.

Mod /u/quaoarpower attempts to provoke bite from hobo spider.

And that, my friends, is why we don't list T. agrestis among the "dangerous" spiders on the sidebar.
 

Biollantefan54

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I think you mean "are not going to run out and chase you"? ;)
Hahahaha, yes, I always forget that crucial word! As stated above hobo spiders are not dangerous, just a bunch of bad stories with no evidence. Black widows are probably really the only spider that can hurt you a lot, but even then only if you get one to bite you. Loxosceles reclusa can mess you up pretty bad but it doesn't always cause a severe reaction as portrayed on the news. Wolf spiders and any other spider you can think of that lives here are not dangerous.
 

The Snark

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Just a FYI and reminder. While medically significant venoms are rare and confined to a limited number of spiders, Latrodectus and Reclusa in the US, bacterial infections, especially 'super bug' infections, are becoming more commonplace. Any puncture wound which draws blood should be suspect. The major transmission agents of these infections is from poor hygiene and handling paper money.

Thus a harmless sparassid giving you a munch and not paying attention can result in a necrotic or even systemic infection.

And the handy dandy solution to this is go buy several bottles of alcohol. Touch money, a splash on your hands and rub thoroughly, puncture wound; clean them hands before dealing with it. I carry a bottle of alcohol everywhere. One in my med pack, one in each vehicle, one at home, one in the wife's office and so on. Easily reduce the bacteria you come in contact with by 99%.
And if you do get a puncture wound that bleeds, follow up with povidone Iodine and scrub the injury HARD!
 
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