Abyss
Arachnoknight
- Joined
- Apr 15, 2016
- Messages
- 281
Getting directly from here is always a safe choice.
I believe I was deceived
- Thread starter gobey
- Start date
As a former pet store owner I would like to weigh in on this but I will warn you right now it will be a long read. Keep in mind my use of the word "you" means the generic form of the word and is not meant as a response to anyone in particular. For starters I am going to assume that the shop has knowledge in the basic care of the slings. If a shop doesn't know how to care for its animals you you should not be shopping there. My points here are regarding ID purposes only. Before you go saying "how can you properly care for a sling if you don't know what species it is" I know plenty of advanced keepers who keep many many different species in pretty much the exact same way. I keep my vagans the same way I keep my smithi and I do very well with both.
Disclaimers completed, first off let me say there is no excuse for anyone selling any animal to not know what species it is. Having said that it may not be the fault of the shop owner. Yes, it is his responsibility to know what he is selling but what steps should he be expected to take to make sure his ID is accurate. If we are assuming that they are not tarantula experts beyond what it takes to care for them is it unreasonable for them to take the word of whomever they may have bought the animal from. I have purchased and sold animals at expos both for my own collection and for resale. I can't think of a single instance where I did not know what I was buying but I admit sometimes that knowledge came from the person selling it. When I first started selling slings I knew very little about them (I still don't when you consider how long I've been doing it but I do know what I sell and how to take care of it) When I started if a vendor had told me I was buying X, Y or Z I would have assumed I was buying X, Y or Z so me selling it as that, IMO, could be excused. Fortunately I was introduced to the T end of the pet business by two very reputable and well known individuals so I never felt any reason to question the IDs of the spiders I was buying. Once I became more knowledgeable about the pet trade in general and the people involved in it I began to severely limit the people I bought from to those I felt I could trust. Its not that I didn't do that from the start it's just that in the beginning I felt I could trust a great many more people than later experiences would dictate. In short I made it a point to deal with reputable and trustworthy people so I didn't feel the need to worry about mis-identification. Still, it does happen and that doesn't mean that every misidentified animal was an intent to deceive. Vials get mixed up, lids get switched and labels get washed off. It is entirely possible that this shop was selling that spider as a Mexican red knee because they were told by someone they trusted that it was a Mexican red knee. If that indeed was the case I would say that the fault lies not with the owner but the original seller. However, taking the issue up with them is most likely not possible so the resposibilty falls on the shop owner.
Notice I distinguish between "fault" and "responsibility." IMO the two are NOT synonymous. It was not my fault that you package was lost in the mail for 2 weeks and your spiders arrived dead but it was my responsibility to make sure you get what you paid for which was live spiders. I will not buy from anyone with a TOS that states they will not responsible for carrier error and I would never put that in my TOS. I paid you to deliver live spiders to me and you failed to do that. You are responsible, but I digress. Simply put the store sold you a "B smithi"and they have the responsibility to make it right. What that might entail I can't say, A partial refund? A free smithi? A store credit? I don't know, that's between the buyer and the seller. BUT. at what point does the buyer assume any degree of responsibility in this. If you say "I bought it because I relied on what they told me" are you any less at fault than the store owner who bought it and "relied on what the seller told him?" Then there becomes a question of time. How long should a buyer have to realize the animal was not identified properly? I know that sings can grow very slowly and that with some it may take a year to realize that a mistake was made, especially if you have no reason to expect on was made in the first place and are not looking for it. Still, it has been a year. That does not let the seller off the hook entirely but IMO it does mitigate the circumstances somewhat. Time is probably even more important when breeding comes into play. Lets say you buy a young "sexed male" as a potential mate for your female. A year or more goes by and you eventually realize that your male is in fact a female. Now with spiders that may be a good thing as females are generally more valuable than males but lets take snakes for example. Most snakes are relatively easy to sex but if you are looking for a male and you are sold a male or you buy a sexed pair as babies, grow them up for three years only to find out they are both the same sex a lot of time and money could have been invested. Would "you sold me these as a male and female three years ago, they are adults now and I had them sexed and they are both males, what are you going to do about it?" be a reasonable argument. I've seen it happen "why did you wait three years to sex them" the seller asked and the reply was "because you said you sexed them and they were a pair and I trusted you" it turned real ugly.
The bottom line is the seller is ultimately responsible for what they sell. If its sold as a male it should be a male and it shouldn't matter if a week goes by or a year it should still be a male. If they sell a B. smithi it should be a B. smithi. To the OP, I would hope that this store would offer you something to make up for their selling you the wrong spider but I would also hope that you would recognize your own, albeit understandable, culpability in the matter and be reasonable about it (It sounds to me like you would be) You say you've learned your lesson but I would urge you not to be so quick to discount ALL LPSs. I've seen breeders and "reputable" dealers intentionally mislead to make the sale as well. When asked the sex of a snake he was selling one breeder I knew would always ask "what are you looking for" and you know what? Every single time the snake he was selling was the sex the buyer was looking for. I even made a comment at one show (I was set up next to him so I was privy to the situation) "Four people were looking for a particular sex snake and each one they were interested just happened to be the sex they wanted. What are the odds of that" and he said "I know, right" Not all local pet store owners are shady and only in it to make a buck and if they are. like I said earlier you probably shouldn't be buying from them I think if you had been my customer you would be more than happy with the solution I would propose.
Unless that's you Jerry then you can just get bent I said I never wanted to hear from you again.
Disclaimers completed, first off let me say there is no excuse for anyone selling any animal to not know what species it is. Having said that it may not be the fault of the shop owner. Yes, it is his responsibility to know what he is selling but what steps should he be expected to take to make sure his ID is accurate. If we are assuming that they are not tarantula experts beyond what it takes to care for them is it unreasonable for them to take the word of whomever they may have bought the animal from. I have purchased and sold animals at expos both for my own collection and for resale. I can't think of a single instance where I did not know what I was buying but I admit sometimes that knowledge came from the person selling it. When I first started selling slings I knew very little about them (I still don't when you consider how long I've been doing it but I do know what I sell and how to take care of it) When I started if a vendor had told me I was buying X, Y or Z I would have assumed I was buying X, Y or Z so me selling it as that, IMO, could be excused. Fortunately I was introduced to the T end of the pet business by two very reputable and well known individuals so I never felt any reason to question the IDs of the spiders I was buying. Once I became more knowledgeable about the pet trade in general and the people involved in it I began to severely limit the people I bought from to those I felt I could trust. Its not that I didn't do that from the start it's just that in the beginning I felt I could trust a great many more people than later experiences would dictate. In short I made it a point to deal with reputable and trustworthy people so I didn't feel the need to worry about mis-identification. Still, it does happen and that doesn't mean that every misidentified animal was an intent to deceive. Vials get mixed up, lids get switched and labels get washed off. It is entirely possible that this shop was selling that spider as a Mexican red knee because they were told by someone they trusted that it was a Mexican red knee. If that indeed was the case I would say that the fault lies not with the owner but the original seller. However, taking the issue up with them is most likely not possible so the resposibilty falls on the shop owner.
Notice I distinguish between "fault" and "responsibility." IMO the two are NOT synonymous. It was not my fault that you package was lost in the mail for 2 weeks and your spiders arrived dead but it was my responsibility to make sure you get what you paid for which was live spiders. I will not buy from anyone with a TOS that states they will not responsible for carrier error and I would never put that in my TOS. I paid you to deliver live spiders to me and you failed to do that. You are responsible, but I digress. Simply put the store sold you a "B smithi"and they have the responsibility to make it right. What that might entail I can't say, A partial refund? A free smithi? A store credit? I don't know, that's between the buyer and the seller. BUT. at what point does the buyer assume any degree of responsibility in this. If you say "I bought it because I relied on what they told me" are you any less at fault than the store owner who bought it and "relied on what the seller told him?" Then there becomes a question of time. How long should a buyer have to realize the animal was not identified properly? I know that sings can grow very slowly and that with some it may take a year to realize that a mistake was made, especially if you have no reason to expect on was made in the first place and are not looking for it. Still, it has been a year. That does not let the seller off the hook entirely but IMO it does mitigate the circumstances somewhat. Time is probably even more important when breeding comes into play. Lets say you buy a young "sexed male" as a potential mate for your female. A year or more goes by and you eventually realize that your male is in fact a female. Now with spiders that may be a good thing as females are generally more valuable than males but lets take snakes for example. Most snakes are relatively easy to sex but if you are looking for a male and you are sold a male or you buy a sexed pair as babies, grow them up for three years only to find out they are both the same sex a lot of time and money could have been invested. Would "you sold me these as a male and female three years ago, they are adults now and I had them sexed and they are both males, what are you going to do about it?" be a reasonable argument. I've seen it happen "why did you wait three years to sex them" the seller asked and the reply was "because you said you sexed them and they were a pair and I trusted you" it turned real ugly.
The bottom line is the seller is ultimately responsible for what they sell. If its sold as a male it should be a male and it shouldn't matter if a week goes by or a year it should still be a male. If they sell a B. smithi it should be a B. smithi. To the OP, I would hope that this store would offer you something to make up for their selling you the wrong spider but I would also hope that you would recognize your own, albeit understandable, culpability in the matter and be reasonable about it (It sounds to me like you would be) You say you've learned your lesson but I would urge you not to be so quick to discount ALL LPSs. I've seen breeders and "reputable" dealers intentionally mislead to make the sale as well. When asked the sex of a snake he was selling one breeder I knew would always ask "what are you looking for" and you know what? Every single time the snake he was selling was the sex the buyer was looking for. I even made a comment at one show (I was set up next to him so I was privy to the situation) "Four people were looking for a particular sex snake and each one they were interested just happened to be the sex they wanted. What are the odds of that" and he said "I know, right" Not all local pet store owners are shady and only in it to make a buck and if they are. like I said earlier you probably shouldn't be buying from them I think if you had been my customer you would be more than happy with the solution I would propose.
Unless that's you Jerry then you can just get bent I said I never wanted to hear from you again.
gobey
Arachnoknight
- Joined
- Jun 20, 2014
- Messages
- 290
I agree 100% with everything you just said.As a former pet store owner I would like to weigh in on this but I will warn you right now it will be a long read. Keep in mind my use of the word "you" means the generic form of the word and is not meant as a response to anyone in particular. For starters I am going to assume that the shop has knowledge in the basic care of the slings. If a shop doesn't know how to care for its animals you you should not be shopping there. My points here are regarding ID purposes only. Before you go saying "how can you properly care for a sling if you don't know what species it is" I know plenty of advanced keepers who keep many many different species in pretty much the exact same way. I keep my vagans the same way I keep my smithi and I do very well with both.
Disclaimers completed, first off let me say there is no excuse for anyone selling any animal to not know what species it is. Having said that it may not be the fault of the shop owner. Yes, it is his responsibility to know what he is selling but what steps should he be expected to take to make sure his ID is accurate. If we are assuming that they are not tarantula experts beyond what it takes to care for them is it unreasonable for them to take the word of whomever they may have bought the animal from. I have purchased and sold animals at expos both for my own collection and for resale. I can't think of a single instance where I did not know what I was buying but I admit sometimes that knowledge came from the person selling it. When I first started selling slings I knew very little about them (I still don't when you consider how long I've been doing it but I do know what I sell and how to take care of it) When I started if a vendor had told me I was buying X, Y or Z I would have assumed I was buying X, Y or Z so me selling it as that, IMO, could be excused. Fortunately I was introduced to the T end of the pet business by two very reputable and well known individuals so I never felt any reason to question the IDs of the spiders I was buying. Once I became more knowledgeable about the pet trade in general and the people involved in it I began to severely limit the people I bought from to those I felt I could trust. Its not that I didn't do that from the start it's just that in the beginning I felt I could trust a great many more people than later experiences would dictate. In short I made it a point to deal with reputable and trustworthy people so I didn't feel the need to worry about mis-identification. Still, it does happen and that doesn't mean that every misidentified animal was an intent to deceive. Vials get mixed up, lids get switched and labels get washed off. It is entirely possible that this shop was selling that spider as a Mexican red knee because they were told by someone they trusted that it was a Mexican red knee. If that indeed was the case I would say that the fault lies not with the owner but the original seller. However, taking the issue up with them is most likely not possible so the resposibilty falls on the shop owner.
Notice I distinguish between "fault" and "responsibility." IMO the two are NOT synonymous. It was not my fault that you package was lost in the mail for 2 weeks and your spiders arrived dead but it was my responsibility to make sure you get what you paid for which was live spiders. I will not buy from anyone with a TOS that states they will not responsible for carrier error and I would never put that in my TOS. I paid you to deliver live spiders to me and you failed to do that. You are responsible, but I digress. Simply put the store sold you a "B smithi"and they have the responsibility to make it right. What that might entail I can't say, A partial refund? A free smithi? A store credit? I don't know, that's between the buyer and the seller. BUT. at what point does the buyer assume any degree of responsibility in this. If you say "I bought it because I relied on what they told me" are you any less at fault than the store owner who bought it and "relied on what the seller told him?" Then there becomes a question of time. How long should a buyer have to realize the animal was not identified properly? I know that sings can grow very slowly and that with some it may take a year to realize that a mistake was made, especially if you have no reason to expect on was made in the first place and are not looking for it. Still, it has been a year. That does not let the seller off the hook entirely but IMO it does mitigate the circumstances somewhat. Time is probably even more important when breeding comes into play. Lets say you buy a young "sexed male" as a potential mate for your female. A year or more goes by and you eventually realize that your male is in fact a female. Now with spiders that may be a good thing as females are generally more valuable than males but lets take snakes for example. Most snakes are relatively easy to sex but if you are looking for a male and you are sold a male or you buy a sexed pair as babies, grow them up for three years only to find out they are both the same sex a lot of time and money could have been invested. Would "you sold me these as a male and female three years ago, they are adults now and I had them sexed and they are both males, what are you going to do about it?" be a reasonable argument. I've seen it happen "why did you wait three years to sex them" the seller asked and the reply was "because you said you sexed them and they were a pair and I trusted you" it turned real ugly.
The bottom line is the seller is ultimately responsible for what they sell. If its sold as a male it should be a male and it shouldn't matter if a week goes by or a year it should still be a male. If they sell a B. smithi it should be a B. smithi. To the OP, I would hope that this store would offer you something to make up for their selling you the wrong spider but I would also hope that you would recognize your own, albeit understandable, culpability in the matter and be reasonable about it (It sounds to me like you would be) You say you've learned your lesson but I would urge you not to be so quick to discount ALL LPSs. I've seen breeders and "reputable" dealers intentionally mislead to make the sale as well. When asked the sex of a snake he was selling one breeder I knew would always ask "what are you looking for" and you know what? Every single time the snake he was selling was the sex the buyer was looking for. I even made a comment at one show (I was set up next to him so I was privy to the situation) "Four people were looking for a particular sex snake and each one they were interested just happened to be the sex they wanted. What are the odds of that" and he said "I know, right" Not all local pet store owners are shady and only in it to make a buck and if they are. like I said earlier you probably shouldn't be buying from them I think if you had been my customer you would be more than happy with the solution I would propose.
Unless that's you Jerry then you can just get bent I said I never wanted to hear from you again.
I'm making my stance in that I know the owner of this store actually. In fact he's really the only one there who knows anything about Tarantulas and has kept some himself and bred some G. porteri.
However... While after getting my first T (G. poerteri from an exotic animal booth at a horror convention) and my 2nd T (an A. avic from petco). I stopped going to him for advice as learning from both the boards here and reading TKG (the 1998 edition he sold me) started to teach me clearly more than he actually knew. He couldn't identify what I was talking about when I mentioned scientific names... Talked about overfeeding his spiders... And generally started to fall into the LPS stereotype... Even if he was enthusiastic about them.
I supported them because they were local and even encouraged people to get into the hobby, and he was a nice guy. I even bought their OBT. Paying too much for that too ($50 for an adult) but feeling ok that I supported a small business. However the OBT upon revealing itself when I got home... Was a mature male....
The best he could do was sell it to me for $35 he said because they paid that for it... I was offering to pay them $20 to give him a home anyway... But had to return him as a friend from here had a healthy female for $60 including shipping... He later offered me the OBT for free because they couldn't really sell him but I had no enclosure...
Their sister store is owned by someone else but carried the same name... Also sold me a mature male but it was my fault for not double checking... I kept him because I was able to enter a breeding project with the same buddy from here.
They seem to trust their employees with ordering these spiders too. Who also know much less than they claim about the animals.
So again. Buying that sling... I got only thinking it didn't matter if it was male... It was an indexed sling anyway and I was happy more about the species...
And again it was picked up at an expo by an employee and not the owner.
So it may be them... It may be the expo vendor... It may be a mix up...
I'm not so much trying to blame anyone even, as much as just the experience. I was thinking that I might take him in just to show it was mislabeled and they should be weary too. Because I know for a fact that the owner has a B. vagans himself and knows what they look like.
I trust the people I've done business with here before... And my one breeder friend... And the classifieds in general if only because it seems like the eBay of spiders.... The community here is quick to let anybody know if they've been buned.
The H. mac I refer to was ordered from here with someone I never did business with before. She was stuck in delivery hell and was routed back to the owner and then back to me. She was in transet for days and days as weather began to get a little cold for comfort.
The seller kept in constant contact with me and although there was no LAG in our original shipping method, since however it didn't ship in the time expected he still offered not only a refund if she arrived dead, but offered me 2 free 3 inch OBTs... Which as much as I didn't want to say no to free spiders... I didn't need more OBTs lol. 1 is enough... Mostly I just didn't want to go get 2 more enclosures...
But there's that responsibility you talked of
I just feel safer with certain methods... And since I don't expand my collection much. I'm not too concerned I guess.
CyclingSam
Arachnoknight
- Joined
- May 22, 2016
- Messages
- 214
Looks just like my B. Vagans Sling, but a bit bigger.
gobey
Arachnoknight
- Joined
- Jun 20, 2014
- Messages
- 290
Yeah I'm 100% certain it's a hobby Vagans.
I suppose I'm gonna raise the little guy out of curiousity and see if I enjoy the T.
It's not a T I would ever have purchased otherwise.
I will either keep or sell him I guess depending on it.
But I'm getting myself an emilia and want to cover the cost a bit lol. Grow up and be a girl vagans!!!
Somebody is interested in my bigger albopilosum... But even trying to sell them both together is like selling the two cheapest most common brachys around... A B. vagans sling is a freebie lol.
- Joined
- Feb 22, 2013
- Messages
- 3,292
It's not about commonality or cost! Albos and vagans are amazing spiders, even if they're dirt cheap. Trust me, you'll love your vagans
Honestly, it's one of my favorite species out there. I've raised three from sling to adulthood, and they're great. For the record, I traded my MM B. vagans for an M. robustum and two vagans slings
Jerry
Arachnobaron
- Joined
- Jan 1, 2016
- Messages
- 594
As a former pet store owner I would like to weigh in on this but I will warn you right now it will be a long read. Keep in mind my use of the word "you" means the generic form of the word and is not meant as a response to anyone in particular. For starters I am going to assume that the shop has knowledge in the basic care of the slings. If a shop doesn't know how to care for its animals you you should not be shopping there. My points here are regarding ID purposes only. Before you go saying "how can you properly care for a sling if you don't know what species it is" I know plenty of advanced keepers who keep many many different species in pretty much the exact same way. I keep my vagans the same way I keep my smithi and I do very well with both.
Disclaimers completed, first off let me say there is no excuse for anyone selling any animal to not know what species it is. Having said that it may not be the fault of the shop owner. Yes, it is his responsibility to know what he is selling but what steps should he be expected to take to make sure his ID is accurate. If we are assuming that they are not tarantula experts beyond what it takes to care for them is it unreasonable for them to take the word of whomever they may have bought the animal from. I have purchased and sold animals at expos both for my own collection and for resale. I can't think of a single instance where I did not know what I was buying but I admit sometimes that knowledge came from the person selling it. When I first started selling slings I knew very little about them (I still don't when you consider how long I've been doing it but I do know what I sell and how to take care of it) When I started if a vendor had told me I was buying X, Y or Z I would have assumed I was buying X, Y or Z so me selling it as that, IMO, could be excused. Fortunately I was introduced to the T end of the pet business by two very reputable and well known individuals so I never felt any reason to question the IDs of the spiders I was buying. Once I became more knowledgeable about the pet trade in general and the people involved in it I began to severely limit the people I bought from to those I felt I could trust. Its not that I didn't do that from the start it's just that in the beginning I felt I could trust a great many more people than later experiences would dictate. In short I made it a point to deal with reputable and trustworthy people so I didn't feel the need to worry about mis-identification. Still, it does happen and that doesn't mean that every misidentified animal was an intent to deceive. Vials get mixed up, lids get switched and labels get washed off. It is entirely possible that this shop was selling that spider as a Mexican red knee because they were told by someone they trusted that it was a Mexican red knee. If that indeed was the case I would say that the fault lies not with the owner but the original seller. However, taking the issue up with them is most likely not possible so the resposibilty falls on the shop owner.
Notice I distinguish between "fault" and "responsibility." IMO the two are NOT synonymous. It was not my fault that you package was lost in the mail for 2 weeks and your spiders arrived dead but it was my responsibility to make sure you get what you paid for which was live spiders. I will not buy from anyone with a TOS that states they will not responsible for carrier error and I would never put that in my TOS. I paid you to deliver live spiders to me and you failed to do that. You are responsible, but I digress. Simply put the store sold you a "B smithi"and they have the responsibility to make it right. What that might entail I can't say, A partial refund? A free smithi? A store credit? I don't know, that's between the buyer and the seller. BUT. at what point does the buyer assume any degree of responsibility in this. If you say "I bought it because I relied on what they told me" are you any less at fault than the store owner who bought it and "relied on what the seller told him?" Then there becomes a question of time. How long should a buyer have to realize the animal was not identified properly? I know that sings can grow very slowly and that with some it may take a year to realize that a mistake was made, especially if you have no reason to expect on was made in the first place and are not looking for it. Still, it has been a year. That does not let the seller off the hook entirely but IMO it does mitigate the circumstances somewhat. Time is probably even more important when breeding comes into play. Lets say you buy a young "sexed male" as a potential mate for your female. A year or more goes by and you eventually realize that your male is in fact a female. Now with spiders that may be a good thing as females are generally more valuable than males but lets take snakes for example. Most snakes are relatively easy to sex but if you are looking for a male and you are sold a male or you buy a sexed pair as babies, grow them up for three years only to find out they are both the same sex a lot of time and money could have been invested. Would "you sold me these as a male and female three years ago, they are adults now and I had them sexed and they are both males, what are you going to do about it?" be a reasonable argument. I've seen it happen "why did you wait three years to sex them" the seller asked and the reply was "because you said you sexed them and they were a pair and I trusted you" it turned real ugly.
The bottom line is the seller is ultimately responsible for what they sell. If its sold as a male it should be a male and it shouldn't matter if a week goes by or a year it should still be a male. If they sell a B. smithi it should be a B. smithi. To the OP, I would hope that this store would offer you something to make up for their selling you the wrong spider but I would also hope that you would recognize your own, albeit understandable, culpability in the matter and be reasonable about it (It sounds to me like you would be) You say you've learned your lesson but I would urge you not to be so quick to discount ALL LPSs. I've seen breeders and "reputable" dealers intentionally mislead to make the sale as well. When asked the sex of a snake he was selling one breeder I knew would always ask "what are you looking for" and you know what? Every single time the snake he was selling was the sex the buyer was looking for. I even made a comment at one show (I was set up next to him so I was privy to the situation) "Four people were looking for a particular sex snake and each one they were interested just happened to be the sex they wanted. What are the odds of that" and he said "I know, right" Not all local pet store owners are shady and only in it to make a buck and if they are. like I said earlier you probably shouldn't be buying from them I think if you had been my customer you would be more than happy with the solution I would propose.
Unless that's you Jerry then you can just get bent I said I never wanted to hear from you again.
What did I do
- Joined
- May 17, 2013
- Messages
- 260
@gobey I'm sorry you got deceived or misled but it's as @EulersK said the likes of vagans, albopilosum etc may be common and less expensive so does this make them bad or boring tarantulas?
The simple answer is no way not ever. I find the cheaper more common species are quite often the most enjoyable and entertaining to keep, I've never owned a B vagans so I have to rely on other keepers for my knowledge of this species but I do own several species of Brachypelma including albopilosum, schroederi, auratum, emilia, smithi, verdezi, albiceps,annitha and I truely believe each and every keeper should through their lifetime own at least 1 Brachypelma species just to experience the diversity of the genus.
Another way to look at cheap/common tarantulas is like this quite often we on these boards hear " I placed an order and got a free B albopilosum " is this just because they are cheap or is it because dealers/breeders know that they have a bit of everything ie big(ish) great eaters generally calm often understated beauty and will be of no great demand on inexperienced keepers but yet will bring enjoyment to even the most experienced of keepers
So don't fret man you may not have the spider you wanted but you have a spider you need
The simple answer is no way not ever. I find the cheaper more common species are quite often the most enjoyable and entertaining to keep, I've never owned a B vagans so I have to rely on other keepers for my knowledge of this species but I do own several species of Brachypelma including albopilosum, schroederi, auratum, emilia, smithi, verdezi, albiceps,annitha and I truely believe each and every keeper should through their lifetime own at least 1 Brachypelma species just to experience the diversity of the genus.
Another way to look at cheap/common tarantulas is like this quite often we on these boards hear " I placed an order and got a free B albopilosum " is this just because they are cheap or is it because dealers/breeders know that they have a bit of everything ie big(ish) great eaters generally calm often understated beauty and will be of no great demand on inexperienced keepers but yet will bring enjoyment to even the most experienced of keepers
So don't fret man you may not have the spider you wanted but you have a spider you need
Last edited:
gobey
Arachnoknight
- Joined
- Jun 20, 2014
- Messages
- 290
Not hating neccessarily... I've had 5 B. albopilosums actually... I love them. I think they're great Ts and the only reason I'm considering parting with one of mine is that I own 2 still and one of my friend's son wants a tarantula. And I would rather he got a healthy hardy and good beginner T than some grumpy, picky eatinfg, possibly older male porteri from a pet store. I think albopilosums aren't just cool Ts bit probably the best beginner T aside from maybe an E. sp red. But they're a little harder to find and pricey for an adult female comparatively. (slings grow so slow I wouldn't think a kid would enjoy it)
The vagans. I watched him scurry around last night. I suppose I was just not so thrilled to get another black T with a red bottom as I have quite a large and entertaining L. parahybana, but I also definitely thought about it and I certainly do enjoy raising slings. And I have had doubles of many species, (have 2 P. regalis) so why not 2 similar looking ones from different families?
And as I said... The smithi would have been cool. But I know would have taken forever to grow. And I really wanted an emilia more and was still on my wishlist. And now I have a 2 inch female on the way in a couple weeks. So... All is fair.
The tough part now is parting with this albopilosum actually. As I've put a lot of care into growing him and he has grown quite large over the past 2 years.
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- May 17, 2013
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- 260
I've had my smithi a little over 2 years and it's still only 1.5" after it's recent moult. My emilia is even worse I got her when I came back to the hobby in February 2013 and she is only just over 2" and she eats really well.
I hate having to part with a tarantula you've cared for I did it earlier this year with an Avicularia sp kwitara and an Avicularia sp pucallpa both were sold for almost 3 times what I paid but in the end I regretted it and I've since heard that they both died so it sucks even worse now
gobey
Arachnoknight
- Joined
- Jun 20, 2014
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- 290
That's kind of the one thing that worries me. The little guy would be going to an inexperienced home. Neither the child or father would be as knowledgeable as most of the folk here... And I think while it's easy to care for a Brachypelma... That they wouldn't be as keen to do something like sign up for the forums here. I tried to get him to in the first place to buy a T and recommended starter species.
But he asked instead if I had any I could sell.
Which wasn't really in my plans.
This albopilosum is just under 2 inches anyway... I also wonder if the child would enjoy it or be disappointed it's still not quite tarantula sized... Even though it will grow at a quicker rate than other Brachypelma.
The emilia I'm getting I'm ok with it growing slow. I'm happy it's already 2 inches and confirmed female.
I'm honestly still on the fence about selling mine... I might find one for sale here and put him in contact XD
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- May 17, 2013
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- 260
@gobey I can completely understand your reservations if it was me I'm pretty certain I'd be the same. Maybe though the exact opposite will happen and the child will be completely engrossed in watching his tarantula moult for the 1st time and witness it take down prey may fire the senses of the Father too and give them something to share and bond over as the years go by.
On the other hand if you aren't 100% comfortable selling your tarantula then you are well within your rights as a responsible keeper to keep hold of the tarantula or as a caveat tell them if they grow bored with it or just don't want it then it should be passed back to yourself.
The emilia you're getting won't disappoint you I personally think they are the most beautiful Brachypelma. The only thing that freaked me out about mine was when I sexed it and was overjoyed to learn it was female untill I realised she could live upto 35 years so she will be coming to the retirement home with me
On the other hand if you aren't 100% comfortable selling your tarantula then you are well within your rights as a responsible keeper to keep hold of the tarantula or as a caveat tell them if they grow bored with it or just don't want it then it should be passed back to yourself.
The emilia you're getting won't disappoint you I personally think they are the most beautiful Brachypelma. The only thing that freaked me out about mine was when I sexed it and was overjoyed to learn it was female untill I realised she could live upto 35 years so she will be coming to the retirement home with me
gobey
Arachnoknight
- Joined
- Jun 20, 2014
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- 290
Well hey. If the albopilosums are female too... Just about the same... My porteri is female. I just don't know how old she is.
Believe me Jerry, it was the first name that popped into my head when I was typing the comment. I had no idea it would hit so close to home. No offense to you or anyone other Jerry was intended.
- Joined
- May 17, 2013
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- 260
My G pulchra is a 6-6.25" and also female so I haven't got a clue about her age either, come to think of it my Thrixopelma sp cajamarca, Gbb and T cyaneolum are all also female and I've no idea of there age either these buggers need rings or something internal on the moult to determine age lol