Help choosing a Fossorial/O.B. companion

Lucashank

Arachnosquire
Joined
Mar 8, 2017
Messages
71
Hello, everyone.

The Mission
To find an obligate burrower with an adult legspan of 2.5-5" or so that prefers mid-high levels of humidity.

The Situation
Attached is a picture of my enclosure and a 16.9oz water bottle for comparison. As of right now, it is the beginning of a moss terrarium and has moderate levels of humidity and enough ventilation to prevent much condensation on the walls. The temperature is kept from 72-75 degrees day/night, but I can change that if need be. The substrate is coco fiber, pressed until semi-firm, watered with reverse osmosis water and reaches an approximate height of 8".

My Research
With a bit of web searching, I have found that H. lividum, E. cyanognathus, E. uatuman, and Cyclocosmia truncata may fit the bill for this enclosure. I realize the C. truncata is a trapdoor spider.

My Request
General advice per the specifications of these creatures, and how they may be kept comfortably. Advice on other burrowing creatures, tarantula, true spider, or otherwise that may find comfort in this home is also welcome.

Further Information
I am not new to keeping exotic creatures, but the only tarantula I've owned was a C. cyaneopubescens so I am not aware of many humid loving burrowing tarantulas.
In the case of the H. lividum, I am well aware of the defensiveness and speed they possess, and this does not bother me, nor should it cause harm to the animal due to my actions.

I am aware that these specific creatures are generally "pet holes", and that is fine with me as well.

Thank you for getting this far in the post. If you have any comments/advice/suggestions, I would greatly appreciate them. Optimized-1463693767026.jpg
 

Walker253

Arachnobaron
Joined
Jun 12, 2016
Messages
556
How about a Haplocosmia nepalensis? Small, my female is about 3-3.5". After a molt, she gets a nice purplish hue. The H. himalayana gets a little bigger, closer to 4.5-5", also nice looking. Keep them damp and cooler than other asians.
 
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HybridReplicate

Spectrostatic
Joined
Jan 26, 2017
Messages
107
I very much like the idea & bought a couple one gallon glass jars for some insects I intend to keep, but I don't know that I would consider keeping a spider in there unless I replaced the lid with something perforated. I would also expect your moss to be torn up & quickly covered with substrate so you're going to have to make a choice between moss terrarium & spider home. I have read that the width of round enclosures should be 2-3x DLS, but since I have no OBs I'll leave spider recommendations to those with more experience.
 

Lucashank

Arachnosquire
Joined
Mar 8, 2017
Messages
71
How about a Haplocosmia nepalensis? Small, my female isabout 3-3.5". After a molt, she gets a nice purplish hue. The H. himalayana gets a little bigger, closer to 4.5-5", also nice looking. Keep them damp and cooler than other asians.
Wow, I have been unable to find any information on the nepalensis other than a very brief scientific study lol. I will make sure to look into them further, thank you.

And to HybridReplicate: I expect the earth to be disturbed, it wont bother me much, I have reasonable experience with vivariums/paludariums. And I was wondering about the dimensions in relation to the creature as well. I would assume that rule would be sufficient for a terrestrial tarantula, but I'm not sure about one that will rarely need explore.
 

BobBarley

Arachnoprince
Joined
Sep 16, 2015
Messages
1,480
If the goal is to keep a t with live moss like the stuff shown, keep in mind that the t may very well kill the moss by:

1) webbing densely all over it
2) pulling it into its burrow
3) ripping it apart
4) burying it
5) pooping on it (dunno if this would kill the moss)
etc...



With all that said, my vote is towards E. cyanognathus.
 

Hellblazer

Arachnosquire
Joined
May 13, 2016
Messages
134
I would use a different container with some more ventilation, unless that one has some that can't be seen in the pic.
 

Lucashank

Arachnosquire
Joined
Mar 8, 2017
Messages
71
If the goal is to keep a t with live moss like the stuff shown, keep in mind that the t may very well kill the moss by:

1) webbing densely all over it
2) pulling it into its burrow
3) ripping it apart
4) burying it
5) pooping on it (dunno if this would kill the moss)
etc...



With all that said, my vote is towards E. cyanognathus.
Haha yes, I suppose I would just have to live with it if my tarantula were to continuously vandalize the area. Can't do much about that :)
And that's what I forgot to write in, is that I would prefer light to no webbing. My GBB got me webbed out ;)
I was leaning towards the E. cyanognathus as well, I have just found less information on them opposed to the H. lividum. Do you have an E. cyanognathus?
 

BobBarley

Arachnoprince
Joined
Sep 16, 2015
Messages
1,480
I was leaning towards the E. cyanognathus as well, I have just found less information on them opposed to the H. lividum. Do you have an E. cyanognathus?
I have neither, but care for both is pretty much the same. Deep sub and moist sub with a water dish. Temps, like most t's, are fine in the 68-90ish range (room temp). Probably gonna get an Ephebopus in April, really nice genus.


Also, light to no webbing.... may be hard. Many fossorials are also heavy webbers and may just decide to web on your moss.
 

Lucashank

Arachnosquire
Joined
Mar 8, 2017
Messages
71
I would use a different container with some more ventilation, unless that one has some that can't be seen in the pic.
Luckily for me, the glass lid that came with it has slight deformities to the contour of the edges, allowing decent ventilation without being a tarantula sized hole.
 

HybridReplicate

Spectrostatic
Joined
Jan 26, 2017
Messages
107
I think excessive ventilation is a common misconception with fully planted vivariums for tarantulas. Tarantulas spend the majority of their lives in a stagnant burrow or enclosed web that allows for little air flow and ventilation. In all the vivariums the plants produce oxygen when they photosynthesise and thus scrub the air clean. Mold is kept at bay due to acidic properties of the soil and the addition of many species of detritivores including isopods, snails, and worms. So the combination of natural behavior and the natural ecological cycle the tarantulas do quite well. Plus if someone is truly worried, gas exchange does happen at the lids since each lid is not completely sealed. Also when they are opened for feeding purposes some gas exchange occurs.

In all my vases I have had breeding success for my dwarf species. I also have tanks with multiple generations living within. Never have I had a colony crash or found inexplicable deaths from the species within.
I recalled that there was a member who made gobstopping vivariums & kept spiders in some of them. They were all bioactive, with living plants & detritrivores, I would be curious if something similar could be safely accomplished without these elements.
 

Lucashank

Arachnosquire
Joined
Mar 8, 2017
Messages
71
I have neither, but care for both is pretty much the same. Deep sub and moist sub with a water dish. Temps, like most t's, are fine in the 68-90ish range (room temp). Probably gonna get an Ephebopus in April, really nice genus.


Also, light to no webbing.... may be hard. Many fossorials are also heavy webbers and may just decide to web on your moss.
Alright, I'm going to look into the E. cyanognathus some more and keep an eye out for some juveniles then. I loved watching my GBB grow from a sling, hopefully I can do something similar with this one. I guess if it decides to web the whole thing into a blizzard, I'll deal with it. This enclosure is ultimately for the tarantula anyways.

I appreciate everyone's responses, thank you.
 

HybridReplicate

Spectrostatic
Joined
Jan 26, 2017
Messages
107
Alright, I'm going to look into the E. cyanognathus some more and keep an eye out for some juveniles then. I loved watching my GBB grow from a sling, hopefully I can do something similar with this one. I guess if it decides to web the whole thing into a blizzard, I'll deal with it. This enclosure is ultimately for the tarantula anyways.

I appreciate everyone's responses, thank you.
Please provide period sitreps on your mission, I would love to replicate this if it works!
 

Lucashank

Arachnosquire
Joined
Mar 8, 2017
Messages
71
I recalled that there was a member who made gobstopping vivariums & kept spiders in some of them. They were all bioactive, with living plants & detritrivores, I would be curious if something similar could be safely accomplished without these elements.
Thank you for that link, it looks as though that user had a few containers that are the same as mine. And yes, the addition of some springtails or such creatures is nearly a necessity. They worked very well with my old gecko's paludarium in which space he shared with a crab and a couple green tree frogs, I rarely had to pick up after them at all. I plan on introducing some into the habitat, possibly springtails again or the rollie bugs.
 

Lucashank

Arachnosquire
Joined
Mar 8, 2017
Messages
71
Please provide period sitreps on your mission, I would love to replicate this if it works!
I plan on it. I'm curious about whether or not I should propagate a small fern into it. But since I have no experience with a burrowing species, I'm not sure if the root system, even if small, would interfere with the tarantula.
 

Chris LXXIX

ArachnoGod
Active Member
Joined
Dec 25, 2014
Messages
5,689
A "trick" I can give you that always worked (and still works) for me, when it comes to O.B Theraphosidae that needs a more humid environment, is, aside for preparing a week before the enclosure, to add a bit of vermiculite (fine grain only, not the "rough" one) in the substrate. Mix that. But as I've said, just a bit.

This helps in the long run to mantain the humidity level :-s
 

Lucashank

Arachnosquire
Joined
Mar 8, 2017
Messages
71
I had to go looking for the pic of my nepalensis female. Here ya go:
That's beautiful. Looks kind of similar to an X. immanis to me. I'll continue looking for more information on them. I don't think I've ever seen one for sale even.
 

HybridReplicate

Spectrostatic
Joined
Jan 26, 2017
Messages
107
I plan on it. I'm curious about whether or not I should propagate a small fern into it. But since I have no experience with a burrowing species, I'm not sure if the root system, even if small, would interfere with the tarantula.
In order to avoid the spider disrupting the plant I've seen people place a small pot in the substrate.
 
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