handling agressive T's

Gesticulator

Arachnoangel
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Jun 8, 2005
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I love watching this guy handle T's!

http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=MeaninglessEndeavor

Wonder if he is on the board?
http://www.arachnoboards.com/ab/showpost.php?p=879426&postcount=1

[]Kaliningrad[];894900 said:
Well sooner or later these people that hold deadly tarantulas will get a hand full of poisin from the taranulas stinger.
Oh YES!!!!!;)

What it comes down to is your own comfort level and respect for your spiders. If the moment "strikes" and the T is mellow, it's your call. But watch that stinger!
 

phil jones

Arachnoprince
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i personally dont think they should be handled. they dont like it. it stresses them alot and they can and will bite sometimes.
not trying to put people down for it, i just dont see the point myself. if bitten, it can be worse than a bee sting. it depends on the person, how much venom is pumped into you and where your bitten. i can honestly say i dont want my obt anywhere near my face and as quick as they are your just kidding yourself if you think you can control it.
but you know ive seen people kiss cobras on the head to but i wouldnt do it.
i agree with all you said there is NO WAY i will hold any of my ( T ) no way and i give kissing a cobra a miss to LOL ._._._ phil
 

Meaningless End

Arachnoknight
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im gonna guess its my video you were talking about...

with me there is one thing that i understand.. eventualy i will be bitten.. Thats ok with me. I dont want to be bittin but i realize that when handling the faster more venomous T's thats just one of the risks that i take. Its not going to kill you just REALY REALY REALY REALY REALY REALY suck.. But ive been sort of wanting to get up a good bite report anyway so i guess its not that huge of a deal.

(god i hope its not the maculata that gets me)

Brandon.
 

Becky

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I handle my "aggressive" spiders as well. This should only be done under supervision of another person since you are not accustomed to it. Once you get more used to it, then you can do it alone.

Note: All spiders are venemous and should not be handled by immature people.

Here's the way you do it though, take the T out of it's residing enclosure by putting it in a small container. The chances of them biting and being aggressive goes down dramatically once removed from their enviornment. Once that's done, open the container it's in and plop into onto your hand gently. That's the way I do it and always have.

But whats the point?? If the T quietens down when its out of its environment its coz its not happy or comfortable... surely thats reason enough not to handle it?!

I just don't c the point in handling any T's really...... they're display animals not "pets" they don't enjoy being cuddled etc... infact it stressed them out more often than not. Quite a few don't like the feel of skin either.. Not to mention the risk of it bitin you and you reacting badly to the venom, or the spider panicking and runnin off or jumping off and damaging itself.... i don't think its worth the risk to person nor spider...

I know that some people handle their T's like they would a pet mouse..... but its a totally different sort of animal and i really dont c the need.....
 

Becky

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im gonna guess its my video you were talking about...

with me there is one thing that i understand.. eventualy i will be bitten.. Thats ok with me. I dont want to be bittin but i realize that when handling the faster more venomous T's thats just one of the risks that i take. Its not going to kill you just REALY REALY REALY REALY REALY REALY suck.. But ive been sort of wanting to get up a good bite report anyway so i guess its not that huge of a deal.

(god i hope its not the maculata that gets me)

Brandon.
Oh so you're the fool that handles all them spiders on cam?? Yea.. seen a few of your vids and hated every single one of them... for one.. you and your friend c it as a game, and as fun to p*ss the spider off and then handle it... That maculata girl (who's gorgeous) was frightened to death. They threat posture for a reason.. its to say go away, not to give us humans more reason to annoy them and make them look big and scary then let people see how cool we are for handling them... *yawns* Only people that know nothing about T's and their behaviour will say "omg you're so cool for handling them spiders!!!" People who really care for and keep T's (as i've noticed by the comments on the videos) will think its appalling and disgusting, like i do!
The maculata hasn't even got a suitable setup!!! It's a arboreal spider in a terrestrial tank with nothing but a water bowl..no hide, no nothing...
It's wrong!
I really do hope you get bitten! By somethin like a pokie that will do you some damage! (Pokie vid "this girl doesnt like the feel of skin" **i know lets make her walk on my arm!!** :wall: :wall: :evil:

People like you annoy me.. takin pleasure in purposely annoying a spider...you shouldn't be allowed 2 keep the poor things. If that was someone teasing a dog, or tricking a bear (e.g. bear dancing) there'd be laws against it or something legal done about it...... Its out of order.

I respect my T's for the beautiful, wild creatures that they are. All of mine live as naturally in captivity as they can (e.g. burrowers have plenty of substrate and arboreals have plenty of height and things to web on and hide in/behind) Other people should too...
 

JMoran1097

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How come i always see pics of people handling really venomous T's here and on youtube? especially usambara baboon's... they're a no no handling spider! what if you get bitten? how can people trust these tarantula's when clearly they don't want to be messed with?

x x x:confused:
while it's not wise to handle such arachnids with a predetermined manner, some T's that are labeled as "aggressive" can actually build up a trust with their owner. i've seen a few photos of owners holding their baboons or cobalt blues. i suppose it kinda depends on how much experience one's had and how long they have owned the spider. however, there is not a single T that can be too predictable. any T, no matter how docile it may seem, has the potential to bite and inject venom. it's not really wise to handle any T, but if you want to take the risk and do so, that's your choice. we all have different reactions to the venom and sometimes the spider may just "dry bite," but i've heard it just feels like a splinter or bee sting.
 

Becky

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while it's not wise to handle such arachnids with a predetermined manner, some T's that are labeled as "aggressive" can actually build up a trust with their owner.QUOTE]

That is incorrect...a spider will not learn to trust a person..it's not in their nature... They don't have the brain capacity to remember things like that (no offence spidies! :D)

It's experience (and a bit of stupidity) when it comes to handling things like lividum, P. murinus etc And i personally wouldnt do it..too many risks to both T and handler.
T's read vibrations, so a nervous person who is panicking a bit is more likely to be be bitten than someone who is confident.
 

JMoran1097

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while it's not wise to handle such arachnids with a predetermined manner, some T's that are labeled as "aggressive" can actually build up a trust with their owner.QUOTE]

That is incorrect...a spider will not learn to trust a person..it's not in their nature... They don't have the brain capacity to remember things like that (no offence spidies! :D)
i get what you are saying, but that's not what i meant. i was referring to psychological conditioning which i'm pretty sure is prevalent in anything that is used to a routine. for instance, i've seen T's that will respond to something as simple as the lid to their enclosure opening which normally means "feeding time." i'm sure the same goes for them recognizing a human hand and possibly them associating the hand with a way out of the enclosure. see my point? i could still be wrong.
 

mr_jacob7

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I handle both my Ts. they're G. rosea, which isn't saying much, i know. however, i will probably hold some of the aggresive Ts when i get them. I'm still kinda new to the hobby.

If you do get bit tho, you really have to bite your lip, and not flinch. that'd stink to fling em, because you know you always have to forgive the spider with their cute little :B faces... *smacks self* ahem... stop with the girlie talk, jake!
 

Taceas

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Becky, I believe the word you are searching for is "see". :rolleyes:

As for the subject of handling more venomous tarantulas for fun, I also don't see the point in it. I also don't see the point in handling G. rosea or B. smithi for fun. But that's just me.

I'm working on 20 something tarantulas now and can gladly say I've never once handled any of them. And no, I'm not including cupping to new larger enclosures.

For one, I don't think it benefits the spider at all.

For two, I prefer to look at them doing their thing in their home.

For three, I prefer to not have a heart attack because one did the "lightning" thing and ended up on my head or in my shirt.

For four, I don't want to accidentally harm them should they decide to bite me or scare me in other ways (I've accidentally killed mice when they've bitten me by instinctively flinging my hand and oops, they smoosh on walls).

What stupid things other people do is just that, stupid things other people do, it has no bearing on me whatsoever. People will do what they want despite all of the logical reasoning and coercion you can try. Just do your thing, and if people want to get bitten on the face or other sensitive area by an OBT or Pokie, well all I can say is they had it coming.
 

KaineSoulblade

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May 24, 2007
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JMoransaid; while it's not wise to handle such arachnids with a predetermined manner, some T's that are labeled as "aggressive" can actually build up a trust with their owner.QUOTE]

That is incorrect...a spider will not learn to trust a person..it's not in their nature... They don't have the brain capacity to remember things like that (no offence spidies! :D)

It's experience (and a bit of stupidity) when it comes to handling things like lividum, P. murinus etc And i personally wouldnt do it..too many risks to both T and handler.
T's read vibrations, so a nervous person who is panicking a bit is more likely to be be bitten than someone who is confident.
They don't bond to a particular person per sey. They are not cats or dogs by any means. But my T's are living proof, that if you raise them from slings with a lot of handling and interaction, that not only do they NOT get stressed. But they don't throw up threat postures and they don't express any behaviors other than normal and healthy ones. When you can open an enclosure and get a spider to walk to your hand and get on it without treating it like food, you can see its become a part of thier life style. It doesn't hurt them in any way. My oldest is over 10 years old now, healthy and striking.

If I open an enclosure to say 'hi' and handle, if I don't get any positive reactions I let them sleep, or sit, or continue whatever they are doing. I definately don't think its wise to start poking them with sticks and tweezers to get them to be nice for handling, most likely the opposite. So again in my personal experience and those I know well, Tarantulas can most definately get accustomed to being handled in a comfort zone, if not thier owners.
 

ShadowBlade

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Just do your thing, and if people want to get bitten on the face or other sensitive area by an OBT or Pokie, well all I can say is they had it coming.
I had a P. striata run up my shorts once.

But my T's are living proof, that if you raise them from slings with a lot of handling and interaction, that not only do they NOT get stressed. But they don't throw up threat postures and they don't express any behaviors other than normal and healthy ones.
See, while they don't really 'remember' the events of handling, their instinct is to adapt, and with repeated handling and no damage, the smell and stimuli of handling gets written in as 'not a threat'.

But, when you know what you're doing, you don't have to get spiders 'accustomed' to it for years. I've handled WC longipes with no problem. Its all about experience. I will recommend handling of defensive species to NO ONE. Because bites suck, and if you can't keep up with the fast ones, the moment they're out of the cage, you're sunk.
When you're ready, its only up to you.

-Sean
 

Becky

Arachnolord
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If I open an enclosure to say 'hi' and handle, if I don't get any positive reactions I let them sleep, or sit, or continue whatever they are doing. I definately don't think its wise to start poking them with sticks and tweezers to get them to be nice for handling, most likely the opposite. So again in my personal experience and those I know well, Tarantulas can most definately get accustomed to being handled in a comfort zone, if not thier owners.

Thats fair enough... but what im saying is, if you watch that guys Heteroscodra maculata vid... he purposely annoys the spider until she runs up the tweezers and jumps on to him, before jumping off of his hand onto the floor......
I don't see the point in handling T's anyway... i c them as display animals... one of the few animals that can live near "naturally" in captivity. If one wanders out onto me or whatever fair enough, but it gets put straight back in (the only 2 of my collection that've done this is Grammostola aureostriata, which i held when i first got her coz she was my first T. A 2" juvie... but when i watched them in their tanks..i don't handle anymore. And my Psalmopoeus cambridgei wouldnt go into its new house when rehousing and ran out onto me lol Oh and when my GBB sling runs acrossmy bedroom floor lol!) I prefer them in their natural state and in peace :)

I prefer to see my T's in a threat posture if i put a foot out of place... natural defence system etc.. but i dont annoy them on purpose.
 

KaineSoulblade

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See, while they don't really 'remember' the events of handling, their instinct is to adapt, and with repeated handling and no damage, the smell and stimuli of handling gets written in as 'not a threat'.

But, when you know what you're doing, you don't have to get spiders 'accustomed' to it for years. I've handled WC longipes with no problem. Its all about experience. I will recommend handling of defensive species to NO ONE. Because bites suck, and if you can't keep up with the fast ones, the moment they're out of the cage, you're sunk.
When you're ready, its only up to you.

-Sean
I agree with this 100%. Experience does also match accustomization. I prefer the accustomed or "bonding" of raising them like that for my personal T's. But when working with someone elses T or a wild one its experience.

I also wouldn't advise holding extremely defensive ones. Though even those guys have individual personalities. I was super surprised to have seen a OBT as lax as a rose, slow moving too if you can beleieve that. But even then I was leery of its capabilities.
 

NBond1986

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Apr 24, 2007
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sorry, but I just really LOVE to break appart arguements and address every part.....it's boredom. Before I continue, just let me tell you that a LOT of people will disagree with me on this. And don't take what I say as an insult or anything. I mean no harm. Some stuff might come out wrong.


Oh so you're the fool that handles all them spiders on cam?? Yea.. seen a few of your vids and hated every single one of them... for one.. you and your friend c it as a game, and as fun to p*ss the spider off and then handle it...
Hmm....I disagree. Completely.
They are making videos to show the rest of the world these magnificent creatures. Also, have you ever seen a video that could give you an appreciation for the speed of a H. maculata? No, you haven't. You've only seen it in real life. But there are plenty of uneducated people out there who have no idea of the speeds and agility that a T can be capable of.


That maculata girl (who's gorgeous) was frightened to death. They threat posture for a reason.. its to say go away, not to give us humans more reason to annoy them and make them look big and scary then let people see how cool we are for handling them... *yawns*
There were some people who responded similarly to the video. But you obviously didn't take the time to read his responses. And even if he WAS pissing it off on purpose, he wasn't hurting it.


Only people that know nothing about T's and their behaviour will say "omg you're so cool for handling them spiders!!!" People who really care for and keep T's (as i've noticed by the comments on the videos) will think its appalling and disgusting, like i do!
Well, I will gladly admit that I was one of those ignorant fools who commented. I only have about 30 T's and a few years (maybe 10 years?) of experience. So who am I to say "omg you're so cool..."
I am not worthy.

And might I add that there are several highly respected and dignified people in the T keeping hobby that also handle their T's and think that it is an awesome experience.
But for the sake of not bringing them into the topic, I could name some for you.


The maculata hasn't even got a suitable setup!!! It's a arboreal spider in a terrestrial tank with nothing but a water bowl..no hide, no nothing...
It's wrong!
Actually.....once again, read the comments on that video. The spider DID have a very suitable setup, but they had temporarely removed the arboreal hide and everything.


I really do hope you get bitten! By somethin like a pokie that will do you some damage!
Well, that's not very nice. Also....you are obviously not thinking straight. That would not be good for the hobby....and that might affect YOU. But I'm fine with it.


(Pokie vid "this girl doesnt like the feel of skin" **i know lets make her walk on my arm!!** :wall: :wall: :evil:
So what? He should tell people, educate people, let them know whats going on.
There are plenty of naturalists that go around holding snakes and stuff for educational purposes and will often say things like "oh yeah, she's really pissed off, doesn't like being held" (God bless Steve Irwin, RIP)


People like you annoy me.. takin pleasure in purposely annoying a spider...you shouldn't be allowed 2 keep the poor things. If that was someone teasing a dog, or tricking a bear (e.g. bear dancing) there'd be laws against it or something legal done about it...... Its out of order.
Well, I wouldn't compare it to those other awful things....but I do get your point. I get your stance, and your train of thought. Believe me, I understand. I just disagree with the extremity of your views. You should try to find a common medium.


I respect my T's for the beautiful, wild creatures that they are. All of mine live as naturally in captivity as they can (e.g. burrowers have plenty of substrate and arboreals have plenty of height and things to web on and hide in/behind) Other people should too...
So do mine. I love making them feel as at home as possible.....

But sometimes they'll still come out for a stroll....yes, even the pokies, baboons, and haplopelmas.
 
Last edited:

ShadowBlade

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I also wouldn't advise holding extremely defensive ones. Though even those guys have individual personalities. I was super surprised to have seen a OBT as lax as a rose, slow moving too if you can beleieve that. But even then I was leery of its capabilities.
Exactly, its the unpredictablility that makes them so bad.

I handle all species, but I won't recommend it to anyone. Because its ultimately up to you, no one else can say when you're ready.

And always keep it safe for the spider.

-Sean
 

Becky

Arachnolord
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Hmm....I disagree. Completely.
They are making videos to show the rest of the world these magnificent creatures. Also, have you ever seen a video that could give you an appreciation for the speed of a H. maculata? No, you haven't. You've only seen it in real life. But there are plenty of uneducated people out there who have no idea of the speeds and agility that a T can be capable of.


To see video's of these magnificent creatures i'd much rather see them in a natural set up, hiding in a tube web rather than stressed and unhappy.
So we should let people know the speed of the maculata by watching some dude annoy it so that it runs onto him out of fear?
I appreciate some people will not know the speed these animals are capable of... but chuck a cricket in with a hungry maculata and see it run just as fast, if not better. My pokies and arboreal africans dive bomb from the side of the tank onto food if they haven't eaten since a moult etc... much rather c that....


There were some people who responded similarly to the video. But you obviously didn't take the time to read his responses. And even if he WAS pissing it off on purpose, he wasn't hurting it.

But pissing it off on purpose is stressing it out, and could therefore lead to hurting it... it flew off his hand straight onto the floor... potential for a ruptured abdomen... safe? Happy spider? think not.....


Well, I will gladly admit that I was one of those ignorant fools who commented. I only have about 30 T's and a few years (maybe 10 years?) of experience. So who am I to say "omg you're so cool..."
I am not worthy.


I wouldn't say he was well cool even if i was worthy..simply because it is not well cool..



Actually.....once again, read the comments on that video. The spider DID have a very suitable setup, but they had temporarely removed the arboreal hide and everything.

To piss it off and handle it... yea great... People campaign about keeping spiders and inverts in captivity anyway, seeing that... can u blame them?



Well, that's not very nice. Also....you are obviously not thinking straight. That would not be good for the hobby....and that might affect YOU. But I'm fine with it.

It won't affect me coz i dont handle mine. If one jumps on and bites me, don't blame it..but i won't be pissing it off before hand. I am thinking straight :) Maybe it'd make him a little bit more aware of what they r aware of.




So what? He should tell people, educate people, let them know whats going on.
There are plenty of naturalists that go around holding snakes and stuff for educational purposes and will often say things like "oh yeah, she's really pissed off, doesn't like being held" (God bless Steve Irwin, RIP)


Yep agree with that. I loved Steve Irwin personally..but he did it all for conservation and preservation of species... not for bloody youtube... he was a professional... can't really compare him and his work to the work of 2 guys and a video camera laughing about it...



Well, I wouldn't compare it to those other awful things....but I do get your point. I get your stance, and your train of thought. Believe me, I understand. I just disagree with the extremity of your views. You should try to find a common medium.

Thats fair enough. Common medium being what exactly?



So do mine. I love making them feel as at home as possible.....

But sometimes they'll still come out for a stroll....yes, even the pokies, baboons, and haplopelmas.


Why?
 

NBond1986

Arachnosquire
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Apr 24, 2007
Messages
148
Exactly, its the unpredictablility that makes them so bad.

I handle all species, but I won't recommend it to anyone. Because its ultimately up to you, no one else can say when you're ready.

And always keep it safe for the spider.

-Sean
Very well said! I wholeheartedly agree. I don't recommend it to anyone either. But do what you will.
 

Meaningless End

Arachnoknight
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Oct 9, 2006
Messages
252
where do i start..

first we where at no point purposly pissing off the t. what we were doing is testing its attitude to see if it was going to put up with us handling it or not... you say i poke at them with sticks to make them mad but that is far from the truth.. i use tongs to check the attitude before sticking my hand in the tank.. i would never use my hand to get a T out of a tank.. that is how you get bit.. we wernt even going to handle her at that point but she shot up the tongs and came out on her own so we went from there.

i would type more and i will respond latter but im at work and need to get off the computer....

my goal is to show that not all rules are true when working with dangerous T's... just because because they can bite you dosent mean they will and i want people to be able to apreciate the speed and agility that theise animals are capable of... everything else Nbond alwready coverd
 
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