Dying C fasciatum?

Sterlingspider

Arachnobaron
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My fasciatum is acting really strangely lately and I'm not sure if I should leave her alone or get her into an ICU enclosure.

I've had her for a bit over two years now and she's about 4.5 inches. About three times over the course of the time I've had her she has burrowed in for several months, shed in the burrow and came out eventually a bit ravenous but none the worse for wear. She seemed to burrow in the last time around mid October but she left a little tunnel open so she's eaten a couple of the crickets I've offered during the last several months and I regularly change her water and occasionally dampen the substrate for humidity.

She finally came out a couple of weeks ago and I was a bit surprised because not only was I expecting her to have shed in the burrow (which she didn't) but she was extremely gorged looking. Her abdomen is almost twice the size of her prosoma and the small patch of skin I can see through the mirror patch is very pale (so it's not an imminent shed)

Normally she doesn't move around a lot, but she barely moves around at all now. I found her pretty curled up a couple of nights ago but after a bit of gentle prodding she opened up and moved. I wet the substrate under her hoping maybe it was a bit of dehydration (not supported by the gorged abdomen I know, but worth a shot) but she didn't respond to it that I could see. She looked a bit better though sluggish and has refused two crickets.

I noticed a little while ago that she looked kind of weird again, on closer look while she isn't all the way curled she looks like she's starting to curl, especially with the front legs and she is not responsive to prodding at all at the moment. There is no evidence of injury and her cage is so shallow I couldn't imagine how she would fall anyway. All of my Ts are kept very close together and no one else is exibiting any weird behavior.

I'd rather not stress her by moving her to an ICU if she's just being inscrutable (also when she does want to move she's FAST) but by the same token she is one of my first two spids (and one of my prettiest) and I'd rather not lose her. Furthermore if there is something weird going on I'd rather not pass it along to the others.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.
 

Hedorah99

Arachnoprince
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My fasciatum is acting really strangely lately and I'm not sure if I should leave her alone or get her into an ICU enclosure.

I've had her for a bit over two years now and she's about 4.5 inches. About three times over the course of the time I've had her she has burrowed in for several months, shed in the burrow and came out eventually a bit ravenous but none the worse for wear. She seemed to burrow in the last time around mid October but she left a little tunnel open so she's eaten a couple of the crickets I've offered during the last several months and I regularly change her water and occasionally dampen the substrate for humidity.

She finally came out a couple of weeks ago and I was a bit surprised because not only was I expecting her to have shed in the burrow (which she didn't) but she was extremely gorged looking. Her abdomen is almost twice the size of her prosoma and the small patch of skin I can see through the mirror patch is very pale (so it's not an imminent shed)

Normally she doesn't move around a lot, but she barely moves around at all now. I found her pretty curled up a couple of nights ago but after a bit of gentle prodding she opened up and moved. I wet the substrate under her hoping maybe it was a bit of dehydration (not supported by the gorged abdomen I know, but worth a shot) but she didn't respond to it that I could see. She looked a bit better though sluggish and has refused two crickets.

I noticed a little while ago that she looked kind of weird again, on closer look while she isn't all the way curled she looks like she's starting to curl, especially with the front legs and she is not responsive to prodding at all at the moment. There is no evidence of injury and her cage is so shallow I couldn't imagine how she would fall anyway. All of my Ts are kept very close together and no one else is exibiting any weird behavior.

I'd rather not stress her by moving her to an ICU if she's just being inscrutable (also when she does want to move she's FAST) but by the same token she is one of my first two spids (and one of my prettiest) and I'd rather not lose her. Furthermore if there is something weird going on I'd rather not pass it along to the others.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.
I just have to ask, are you sure its a she? The wandering and eventually petering out sounds a lot like a male looking for a mate.
 

Sterlingspider

Arachnobaron
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I just have to ask, are you sure its a she? The wandering and eventually petering out sounds a lot like a male looking for a mate.
Yep, she's a she.

No "boxing gloves", very visible spermathecae on all the moults I've seen since she was already 3" when I got her.

She doesn't wander though, barely moves in fact unless she's avoiding something (at which point she is like the wind, but with tap shoes on). Usually she just chills in a specific corner of her tank unless she's hunting.

I keep the temp in here to the low to mid 70s and she's in one of those low profile kritter keeper type deals on coconut bedding with no evidence of mites or fungus.

For reference she's eaten *exactly* three crickets since October 11th and looks like she gorged on that many twice a week since then.
 

Hedorah99

Arachnoprince
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Yep, she's a she.

No "boxing gloves", very visible spermathecae on all the moults I've seen since she was already 3" when I got her.

She doesn't wander though, barely moves in fact unless she's avoiding something (at which point she is like the wind, but with tap shoes on). Usually she just chills in a specific corner of her tank unless she's hunting.

I keep the temp in here to the low to mid 70s and she's in one of those low profile kritter keeper type deals on coconut bedding with no evidence of mites or fungus.

For reference she's eaten *exactly* three crickets since October 11th and looks like she gorged on that many twice a week since then.
Sorry I cannot be of more help now but I am at a loss. Hopefully someone else can give you some insight. Sorry :(
 

Sof

Arachnoknight
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Is she wild caught or captive bred? Wild caught tarantula's can be infected with different types of parasites that will eventually come out. You might have seen some pics here on the forum. I'm not saying thats the case for yours, but its a possibility if its wild caught.
 

Sterlingspider

Arachnobaron
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Is she wild caught or captive bred? Wild caught tarantula's can be infected with different types of parasites that will eventually come out. You might have seen some pics here on the forum. I'm not saying thats the case for yours, but its a possibility if its wild caught.
Parasites are my main worry since I don't know her provenance (the swollen abdomen is really worrying in that regard). I got her as a young adult from a local reptile store. You would figure two years would be long enough for that sort of thing to show up though. :(
 

Sterlingspider

Arachnobaron
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Picture

So I buckled down and transferred her to an ICU setup just a little while ago. It says something that the tarantula that used to bolt if you looked at her the wrong way didn't even react to being picked up with a spatula.

I took a couple of pictures of her, this one shows her position and relative abdomen size the best I think. She uncurled a bit when I picked her up but I think you can still see why I'm worried. She was holding herself up a bit before but now she's got her belly flat to the little pile of substrate I picked up with her. Just as a reminder she's only eaten three crickets in as many months and she's since curled back up a bit.

Poor thing, you can really see the two facing heart shapes on her abdomen that gave her her name (Loveybutt). I'll be really sad to lose her, I've grown pretty attached to her and she is definitely one of my prettiest.
 

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Sof

Arachnoknight
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Wow her abdomen is huge, I hope she gets well. I'd hate to lose my c.fasciatum, shes probably my fave in my collection. How old do you think yours is?
 

Talkenlate04

ArachnoGod
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Hey question do you notice any type of sweet smelling odor coming from her when you open the ICU?
 

OldHag

ArachnoHag
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I had a fasciatum do the samething! She got huge, so I found her a male, she was very receptive to him.... then about a month later she just died :( Very large abdomen too..
 

Sterlingspider

Arachnobaron
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Well I went to transfer her into a fresh ICU. I'm going to give her one more night before I start talking in the past tense about her but I'm pretty sure she's gone already. I wish there was something I could do to be sure but it's not like I can hold a mirror under her booklungs. I had an A seemani spiderling go pretty much exactly the same way exactly a year ago now and I think the swelling keeps them from doing a really obvious deathcurl, it took several days before I was sure that one went too.

She hadn't moved at all from where she was yesterday. No reaction whatsoever to being picked up, no "muscle tone", didn't even react to being rolled over onto her back (that part was accidental). :8o

While she was on her back I gave her a once over, nothing coming out of her mouthparts, no obvious injuries though she is so swollen her epigastric furrow is sort of gaping and she has a small bald patch on her underside presumably where her body touched the ground which I had never noticed before.

Sof: I've had her for two years and I think she was a young adult when I got her, so I figure she's probably about 3 or 4. It's hard to tell for sure though because they're a somewhat small sp. so I can't judge based on the growth rate of my other tarantulas, I have a P cancerides who at a year and a half old is within a shed or two of the same size

talkenlate04: There was no smell in the ICU beyond the little bit of substrate I picked up

Thanks for your help and well wishes.
 

Snipes

Arachnoprince
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She does have water available right? At this point, my only suggestin would be to put her over a cap of water and wait for another day before declaring her dead. If she truly dies, maybe you should preserve her so that if someone can, they can do an autopsy and figure out what happened. How long do C/D. fasciatum live anyways?
talkenlate-were you thinking nemotodes?
 

Sterlingspider

Arachnobaron
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She does have water available right? At this point, my only suggestin would be to put her over a cap of water and wait for another day before declaring her dead. If she truly dies, maybe you should preserve her so that if someone can, they can do an autopsy and figure out what happened. How long do C/D. fasciatum live anyways?
talkenlate-were you thinking nemotodes?
She's on extremely damp paper towel in the ICU tank, I've placed her on water several times but she hasn't reacted to it at all. She's pretty much curled at this point and completely non responsive since Tuesday night so I'm giving her the night to be sure but I'm pretty much convinced she's dead already.

I've thought about getting her necropsied but I wouldn't know where to send her and the only posts on the board that came up on necropsy were for diskinetic syndrome.
 

Snipes

Arachnoprince
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She's on extremely damp paper towel in the ICU tank, I've placed her on water several times but she hasn't reacted to it at all. She's pretty much curled at this point and completely non responsive since Tuesday night so I'm giving her the night to be sure but I'm pretty much convinced she's dead already.

I've thought about getting her necropsied but I wouldn't know where to send her and the only posts on the board that came up on necropsy were for diskinetic syndrome.
Until you find someone i would just suggest freezing her. You could start a thread and ask for someone who would like to do a necropsy. I jsut know that it would drive me mad to not know, I am sorry for your loss and I hope my condolenses are premature :( .
 

Windchaser

Arachnoking
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Sorry for your loss. I didn't want to say anything earlier because it wouldn't have helped the situation any but I have heard of tarantulas actually be the walking dead. In other words, they were still alive yet were dead in the respect that their bodies were actually starting to decay already. I have no idea what caused the death of your tarantula but I would venture a guess the the enlarged abdomen was caused by gases given off as it was beginning the decaying process. This type of walking dead can be seen with parasites quite often. The tarantula is effectively dead but still holding on as the parasites begin consuming it from the inside out.
 

Sterlingspider

Arachnobaron
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Sorry for your loss. I didn't want to say anything earlier because it wouldn't have helped the situation any but I have heard of tarantulas actually be the walking dead. In other words, they were still alive yet were dead in the respect that their bodies were actually starting to decay already. I have no idea what caused the death of your tarantula but I would venture a guess the the enlarged abdomen was caused by gases given off as it was beginning the decaying process. This type of walking dead can be seen with parasites quite often. The tarantula is effectively dead but still holding on as the parasites begin consuming it from the inside out.
Thank you Windchaser.
When this happened with the spiderling a year ago the abdomen tore a bit when I was getting rid of the body. The fluid that came out was all water clear and there was no naked eye evidence of parasites so I chalked it up to either an infection or a blockage being most likely.

I'm assuming it's the same here, the only parasite vector I could see it being is crickets but she didn't even eat any. There's no evidence of anything in her water or substrate.

I think I'm going to call the local university bio dept and see if there's anyone who can do a necropsy.
 

Hedrus

Arachnopeon
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Dec 12, 2006
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B smithi with seemingly same problem...

I just recieved a spider (B smithi) a few days ago that had a huge abdomen and was very lethargic. Tonight I am afraid she is dead. I do not know if she was wild caught or captive bred. Its almost exactly like what I am reading in your thread. I am so upset. Such a pretty tarantula. All the other tarantulas I got in my order are doing great and very healthy. I almost wonder if you can over feed a tarantula? Maybe thats how a blockage happens? But in my case there are so many unanswered questions about the spider that I will never know. I know for sure I did not kill the tarantula. Its setup is like my B auratum and boehmei and they are doing great. I am sorry for your loss and that I now have had a similar situation occur.
 

Windchaser

Arachnoking
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I just recieved a spider (B smithi) a few days ago that had a huge abdomen and was very lethargic. Tonight I am afraid she is dead. I do not know if she was wild caught or captive bred. Its almost exactly like what I am reading in your thread. I am so upset. Such a pretty tarantula. All the other tarantulas I got in my order are doing great and very healthy. I almost wonder if you can over feed a tarantula? Maybe thats how a blockage happens? But in my case there are so many unanswered questions about the spider that I will never know. I know for sure I did not kill the tarantula. Its setup is like my B auratum and boehmei and they are doing great. I am sorry for your loss and that I now have had a similar situation occur.
FYI, if it was wild caught it was an illegally smuggled tarantula. Almost all B. smithi sold today in the states are captive bred.
 

Hedrus

Arachnopeon
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Dec 12, 2006
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It must have been captive bred then because I got it through a very reputable source. Either way its dead and seemingly for no reason.
 

Anastasia

Arachnoprince
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Real sorry :( , they are truelly beauties
I know I get bit attach to al mine
 
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