Could a potent venom OW bite be fatal to an infant?

gobey

gobey

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So in my years in the hobby I've gotten a good sense for who's who in nasty bites (not from being bitten thank goodness).

And from all my reading I know Tarantulas aren't deadly to humans.

However... Someone posted on Facebook his wife made him get rid of an Indian tarantula that was "pretty fatal to infants". I'm assuming a Poecilotheria.

That got me to thinking... Could it kill a baby? (No I'm not trying to set loose Tarantulas on babies!)

Just curious. We worry about dogs and cats with more potent OW species. I know different circulatory systems and biology probably have a different effect for venom as well.

But does the smaller size and weaker systems of an infant mean these bites that are pretty severe as far as pain and side effects to us... Enough to cause a fatality for an infant?

Just wondering

Especially as I'm looking to move in with my fiance who has a 4 year old and we would eventually like to have our own.
 
A

Arachnomaniac19

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Well, a non-lethal Scolopendra sp. killed an infant, granted the bite placement (head) isn't likely to happen with a T, but I wouldn't doubt it.
 
Chris LXXIX

Chris LXXIX

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If someone think that a P.murinus or a P.ornata (just for throw two example) bite on the neck of a three months baby would be like nothing then clearly someone has no idea of how much potent those venoms are.

It doesn't matter how much almost impossible a scenario like the one I've described is.
 
Chris LXXIX

Chris LXXIX

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Arachnomaniac19 said:
Well, a non-lethal Scolopendra sp. killed an infant, granted the bite placement (head) isn't likely to happen with a T, but I wouldn't doubt it.
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You are talking of the bite occurred, if I'm not wrong, to a Philippines little girl (less than 10 years if I recall well). Yes, the bite was on the head area, not delivered to an adult, and the centipede was a S.subspinipes (or another Asian Scolopendridae).

But another man, in Turkey, died due to complications of a centipede bite effect on his chest. He was adult. Now centipedes venom is completely different from Theraphosidae ones, there other 'stuff' inside involved, so still I keep saying that we don't know.

On the other hand, while no Theraphosidae is even near to the 'potentially lethal' league, we don't know wt. can happen if a badass OW bites an infant.
 
FishermanSteve

FishermanSteve

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If a pokie bite can give a grown man heart palpitations then there is no doubt in my mind it could kill an infant.
 
Sana

Sana

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I know that bites from other venomous but non lethal spiders can be fatal to an infant or an elderly person but not a healthy adult. Based on that and information in bits reports regarding the effects of an OW bite I would err on the side of caution. My brain says that it's logical that an infant that is so much smaller and has a much weaker immune system (is much weaker overall) would be much more likely to die of a bite. That said I have small children and OWs. The tarantulas have been in the same house since the younger one's infancy. The kids are currently 7 and 3 and I'll got another niece on the way who will no doubt spend a ridiculous amount of time her as well. We are extremely cautious about or OWs. Enclosures are triple checked after maintenance to make sure they are properly closed. The kids don't run around that room unattended. They are being taught proper spider etiquette and they help feed the NWs if they want. I'm always happy to take them in to look at the tarantulas. The kids have no need or desire to sneak into the off limits room because they can go in with me any time they want. The biggest concern obviously would be escapes. We haven't had any issues with that or rehouses gone seriously wrong but we are probably even more cautious than the average keeper because of the kids.
 
Andrea82

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Even my five year old who is slightly mentally disabled knows she has to be quiet and calm in the T room. Up to the point she tells me to shush it in case i 'wake the skinnylegs'. Of course, every time she says so, it has me laughing even louder...:D
 
HybridReplicate

HybridReplicate

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The link to the thread that @Andrea82 posted earlier is where you'll want to go. TL;DR: Deadly dose of venom is units/kg, each spider has a finite amount of venom they can excrete, the increase in risk is inversely proportional to the increase in body weight. For this reason the venoms are presumably more dangerous to creatures with lower body weight (e.g. kitties, puppers, human pinkies), although there is variation in venoms by species & varying toxic effects in evenomated species. For safety reasons it is best to assume all little ones are at risk.

There is a retrospective review of tarantula bites in humans & canines that does not include infants but records very mild effects in humans while canines suffer a rapid death. It's not clear if this is due to differences in biology (& therefore drastically different reactions) or simply a matter of increased mass.
 
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Rob1985

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Any bite could be fatal if a person has an allergy and goes into anaphylaxis without epinephrine.
 
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Ungoliant

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Sana said:
We are extremely cautious about or OWs. Enclosures are triple checked after maintenance to make sure they are properly closed. The kids don't run around that room unattended. They are being taught proper spider etiquette and they help feed the NWs if they want.
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If you have small children (or sometimes have them as guests in your home), it wouldn't be a bad idea to put locks on your OW enclosures (or on the cabinet that houses them). This protects your children, your tarantulas, and you from potential liability for bites.

Your kids may be well-behaved, but you never know what might happen when other kids are added to the mix. (Hell, you can't even trust adults not to do something foolish, especially if alcohol is on board.)
 
Chris LXXIX

Chris LXXIX

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Ungoliant said:
If you have small children (or sometimes have them as guests in your home), it wouldn't be a bad idea to put locks on your OW enclosures (or on the cabinet that houses them). This protects your children, your tarantulas, and you from potential liability for bites.

Your kids may be well-behaved, but you never know what might happen when other kids are added to the mix. (Hell, you can't even trust adults not to do something foolish, especially if alcohol is on board.)
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Thank God that Michael Jackson wasn't into OW's Theraphosidae. He always had guests since his 'Neverland Ranch' parking lot was always full of tricycles :eek: <-- Eek!
 
Sana

Sana

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Ungoliant said:
If you have small children (or sometimes have them as guests in your home), it wouldn't be a bad idea to put locks on your OW enclosures (or on the cabinet that houses them). This protects your children, your tarantulas, and you from potential liability for bites.

Your kids may be well-behaved, but you never know what might happen when other kids are added to the mix. (Hell, you can't even trust adults not to do something foolish, especially if alcohol is on board.)
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The room itself can be locked as needed without a problem. The kids haven't managed to defeat the stiff caribeaner clips that I've got on OW enclosures that would be within reach or summit of small hands. The question to that becomes at what age you trust children? My 7 year old is generally an honest kid even if he might get in trouble. He's been around the tarantulas most of his life and I think we have managed to teach him to respect them and their homes by not touching even the enclosure except when he's doing maintenance with me. We've talked about what could happen if one of them bit someone based on bite report info. He works with them often enough that their existence isn't some intriguing taboo thing. On the other hand he's 7. How well does he really understand the potential consequences? It's a hard call rationally and differs with every child.
 
Leila

Leila

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Wait- so if I have a mild allergy ro bee stings, all T bites will affect me similarly?
 
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