Chilian rose expoting stopped?

[Code Monkey]

Originally posted by Wade
Despite Chip's comments about a "plain brown spider", many are quite attractive and the demand will still exist. As the price goes up, so will the incentives of smugglers and suddenly there's a black market.

Not seeing the demand reaching the point that smuggling would be much of an issue. The G. rosea's primary role in the hobby is the $10-$20 spider that you pick up because it's cheap and large and constantly in stock at your local petstore. Depending on how you take to it, it remains your only spider (e.g. a G. rosea was my brother's first and only T), or it lures you into the larger hobby.

The pet industry needs something in that niche to keep the unintending newbies rolling in and they will find something to replace the G. rosea if they stopped legally exporting them (even more pinktoes and CR zebras is my guess). Newcomers would have no appreciation for what's supposed to be special about G. rosea in such a market.

The only people with any real desire to get G. roseas at that point would be the hardcore hobbyist, and captive breeding can meet that demand easily.

Or so I picture things ...

 

[minax]

Brilliant!

Very well put Wade, I agree totally............With such vision, have you ever considered running for political office? Oops, sorry, you are too honest! I would vote for you if you ran!!

 

[Mendi]

Originally posted by Wade
<snip>

For clues on how to make that happen, we can look at the butterfly farming industry. Many triopical countries including Costa Rica, Malaysia, and New Guinea have encouraged people to go into business raising butterflies. These businesses range from people throwing screens over trees in their back yards to large facilities. The butterflies are sold as dead specimens to collectors world wide, or else as live puapae for incresingly-popular butterfly exibits at museums and zoos. If such an approach could be taken regarding animals in the pet trade, it would be a boon to both collectors around the world as well as the stuggling economies of many nations. For such a program to be successful, a massive adjustment of attitude of the governments, people, and international bodies must take place. How to make THAT happen is the sticking point.

Wade

And they are making unbelievable amounts for many of these butterflies as dried specimens. There are some farm raised Bird Winged butterflies native the PNG bringing in over $250 US for a single specimen that still needs mounting... But to get this done in 3rd world countries took lots of dollars from other countries on schooling and start-up. But it is now saving species of Papilionidae from faced extinction and supplying the collectors with what they need for display and study. I can see where teaching the home population and poor of a country that raising Ts as a farming beneficial insect until they are of a certain age and then selling a crop to pet collectors would be a good thing for all involved

 

[Wade]

Originally posted by Code Monkey
Not seeing the demand reaching the point that smuggling would be much of an issue. The G. rosea's primary role in the hobby is the $10-$20 spider that you pick up because it's cheap and large and constantly in stock at your local petstore.

True enough, at the present time. However, I've seen this senario play out numerous times within the herp trade and I think it's simmilar enough to make a comparison.

A wild caught pet trade staple suddenly becomes unavailable for import. There hasn't been much intrest in breeding the species since they were so cheap before. Prices fluctuate wildly between dealers, some continue to offer them at the same price, while others jack them up ridiculously high. In the short term, the market won't bear the overpriced spiders, but the smart dealers and breeders sit on their stock, wait for the supply to deplete, and work on breeding the ones they have. Then, a few years down the road, when people have forgotten how cheap they used to be, or wishing thy'd gotten them when the had the chance, the dealer suddenly offers the species again, captive bred, at a much higher price. Suddenely, the older, breeder-sized, pre-ban animals become much more valuable. This is happening now with prehensile-tailed skinks right now. Once, wild collected specimens sold for as low as $50, now you'd be hard pressed to find one for less than $750, and captive bred specimens have been offered fo $1500 and up.

I'm not saying G. rosea is ever going to command that kind of price, but many hobbyists who overlook them now will become nostalgic for the red and pink morphs when they dissapear. The really red ones are especially striking, less attractive T's (IMO) are comanding big bucks on the current market. If the availability were limited, I have no doubt that many G. roseas would too.

I don't know if the demand would really result in a real black market in G. rosea alone, but I'm thinking that Chile would likley ban all exports of wildlife, which would surley result in a black market.

Wade

 

[Wade]

Re: Brilliant!

Originally posted by minax
Very well put Wade, I agree totally............With such vision, have you ever considered running for political office? Oops, sorry, you are too honest! I would vote for you if you ran!!

Thanks, but don't hold you breath! =D

Wade

 

[Vys]

CM: I'm a cool kid who can remember when and where I said
'ban' and 'government' whereas you can't.

I don't think they'll pave Chile all together just because they can't get a nickel for its rosey spiders anymore.

Such an observation as Wade mentioned, i.e asking the collectors and seeing their collecting-techniques, seems a rather good ídea, because then at least we'd have an inkling. And if their numbers were dwindling and the collection had a finger in this, then regulate or something. Since educating the masses about the dangers of overcollection is pretty moot then make a blizzard of red tape and make it really cumbersome to mass-export(and import) roseas as is being done today. They're not exactly ivory, so I wonder if a black market which main ingredients were roseas would appear.

 

[Code Monkey]

Originally posted by Wade
True enough, at the present time. However, I've seen this senario play out numerous times within the herp trade and I think it's simmilar enough to make a comparison... Once, wild collected specimens sold for as low as $50, now you'd be hard pressed to find one for less than $750, and captive bred specimens have been offered fo $1500 and up.

Personally, I think this is just evidence that the herp trade is completely insane, but that's probably just my bias speaking

I don't know if the demand would really result in a real black market in G. rosea alone, but I'm thinking that Chile would likley ban all exports of wildlife, which would surley result in a black market.

If Chile simply repeated Peru's mistake you are right in that observation.

 

[MizM]

Simply put, humans are destroying the earth, it's plant inhabitants and it's animal inhabitants. After that, humans will figure out some way to destroy THEMSELVES!

 

[RugbyDave]

Originally posted by MizM
Simply put, humans are destroying the earth, it's plant inhabitants and it's animal inhabitants. After that, humans will figure out some way to destroy THEMSELVES!

uh, did you ever see the movie "Baby Genius" or "Operation Dumbo Drop"? I think we've already set the stage for our own impending destruction, terri my beautiful

peace
dave

 

[MizM]

I concur oh wise one!