Broken Fang Fossorial

bryverine

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Apr 18, 2012
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Hello, I previously believed my P. muticus to have a missing chelicerae but have found out tonight that she does indeed have two left.

One is severly disfigured or damaged the other appears to be possibly ok. I see that the damaged one has a broken fang. Her "good side" does not appear to have a fang either.

If you missed my original post:
Last molt: 8/17/16
Post molt feed date: 10/22/16
Feeder: 1 large (very fat) adult female dubia.

It appeared as though she ate it though I haven't found any trace of the dubia. Thenagain she hasn't ever really left boluses outeither.

The molt had been shredded/destroyed so there's no use looking there.

I've scoured the enclosure as much as I can (you know, with most of her home underground and only having peek-a-boo flaps to see things) and haven't found any 'parts'.
Feeding a terrestrial "bug soup" is one thing, but a fossorial? Do I do something as drastic as putting her in less substrate to make sure she eats?

Should I try to throw cut in half or split wax worms or dubia down there? It would quickly make a right mess if it started to decay and I couldn't reach down there to get it.

One more thing to throw in there, if my girl was unable to eat that adult female dubia like I thought she did, should I worry about a little roach colony starting in her enclosure and killing her? :sorry:

Here's her now:
20161204_231509.jpg
Her abdomen looks healthy but certainly not her premolt plumpness.
 

EulersK

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Firstly, I really wouldn't worry about a roach colony in there. The nymphs will very quickly die off without anything to eat or drink... and since they drown in open water, you don't have much to worry about there.

As for the spider, does it only have one missing fang? If so, then just give it an incapacitated smaller roach. Cut the roach square in half, it'll still kick for an hour or two before dying. A gravid dubia may be a bit much for it to take down - frequent small feedings are better than no feedings at all. I see no mention of the species - what are we dealing with, here? I didn't see your original post, so I'm not familiar with the situation.
 

bryverine

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Firstly, I really wouldn't worry about a roach colony in there. The nymphs will very quickly die off without anything to eat or drink... and since they drown in open water, you don't have much to worry about there.

As for the spider, does it only have one missing fang? If so, then just give it an incapacitated smaller roach. Cut the roach square in half, it'll still kick for an hour or two before dying. A gravid dubia may be a bit much for it to take down - frequent small feedings are better than no feedings at all. I see no mention of the species - what are we dealing with, here? I didn't see your original post, so I'm not familiar with the situation.
She is a 6"+ P. muticus.

Being that she is very rarely above ground, I'm not sure if she has both fangs broken. From what I can see, she does not appear to have either though.

I can try to place a split roach at the top of her burrow just to see if she is making it up there and maybe has a fang left. Her burrow entrance is pretty steep though so if something goes down there, I have my doubts about getting it back.
 

EulersK

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Eh, ouch. That's rough. Could you coax her out of her burrow? You know the dried grass trick, yeah? If that doesn't work, I really do think that I'd dig her up to find out. Whether or not she's missing both fangs is pretty crucial information.
 

Chris LXXIX

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Her burrow entrance is pretty steep though so if something goes down there, I have my doubts about getting it back.
I was lucky enough to "rescue" an adult female B.dubia from my Goddess enclosure once. She wasn't hungry at all, and after a couple of hours I've spotted the roach on the surface with the chelicerae mark, but that was an exception I think :-s
 

bryverine

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Eh, ouch. That's rough. Could you coax her out of her burrow? You know the dried grass trick, yeah? If that doesn't work, I really do think that I'd dig her up to find out. Whether or not she's missing both fangs is pretty crucial information.
She seems pretty content to stay in the far reaches of her tunnel which is about 18" long not including the "drop off" to the bottom...

Let's say I get her out by dig or by lure and she is indeed missing both fangs. Do I keep her in a temporary shallow enclosure more like a terrestrial T? Just deep enough for her to go down a few inches, but where I have more surface area than depth to leave out "treats"? I'd hate to have her be so cranky about a bad setup that she wasn't able to molt properly.
 
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Crone Returns

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I think first step would be to see whether or not she has one or no fangs. If she has one fang I think she'll be ok.
She looks plump so is it really that pressing to feed her. If she's plump enough, she should be able to make it to her next molt? If she can cruise into her next molt, then you won't to bother her again.
That's all I can think of.
If you decide she needs food and she's fangless, then you'll have to dig her out.
I hope she makes it.
 

viper69

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She seems pretty content to stay in the far reaches of her tunnel which is about 18" long not including the "drop off" to the bottom...

Let's say I get her out by dig or by lure and she is indeed missing both fangs. Do I keep her in a temporary shallow enclosure more like a terrestrial T? Just deep enough for her to go down a few inches, but where I have more surface area than depth to leave out "treats"? I'd hate to have her be so cranky about a bad setup that she wasn't able to molt properly.
1. Confirm both fangs are missing
2. Keep her in a container that has little substrate (ie not enough to burrow completely, but perhaps enough to dig down a bit below the hide), but provide a hide. Some species will do fine with a hide even if they can't burrow. I have a couple NWs setup like this.

Cricket soup and a fossorial is a bad recipe IMO.

Keep us posted!
 

Blue Jaye

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Instead of cutting a Dubia or making cricket soup try cutting a Dubia open close to the head and squeeze all the innards out. I've had good luck with that. I would maybe go as far as putting the t on paper towels and give it a hide. This would make it lots easier for the t to eat without substrate problems. Keep it dark so the stress is lower. Meaning while it's on paper towels and just a hide. The dark will help make it comfy. Make sure it has a full water dish at all times.
 

Crone Returns

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She seems pretty content to stay in the far reaches of her tunnel which is about 18" long not including the "drop off" to the bottom...

Let's say I get her out by dig or by lure and she is indeed missing both fangs. Do I keep her in a temporary shallow enclosure more like a terrestrial T? Just deep enough for her to go down a few inches, but where I have more surface area than depth to leave out "treats"? I'd hate to have her be so cranky about a bad setup that she wasn't able to molt properly.
Hi.
Have you gotten her out ok? Is she fangless? Please tell us what's happening! Thanks.
 

bryverine

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It's been pretty hectic with class finishing and finals next week and then I need to leave town for a few days. :sorry:

Unfortunately, I have to wait until I get back so I can give her proper attention and not rush things. I think she'll be ok until then as she has a nice full water bowl and a decent abdomen.

I have decided though that I'm going to get her out and put her in a "terrestrial style" setup on a thin(er) bed of substrate with bark buried as a hide...my poor little queen... :(
 

Crone Returns

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It's been pretty hectic with class finishing and finals next week and then I need to leave town for a few days. :sorry:

Unfortunately, I have to wait until I get back so I can give her proper attention and not rush things. I think she'll be ok until then as she has a nice full water bowl and a decent abdomen.

I have decided though that I'm going to get her out and put her in a "terrestrial style" setup on a thin(er) bed of substrate with bark buried as a hide...my poor little queen... :(
Thanks for the update. Fingers crossed for your Queen.
 

bryverine

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Sorry it took so long to update. She looked content and plump enough to wait it out. About a week ago or so, she finally positioned herself where I could see that she has only one broken fang/chelicerae! :astonished:

I saw her near the foot of her burrow yesterday for the first time since I noticed something was up - so I tossed in some food. She's eating a large female dubia as I write this! Wahoo!
 
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bryverine

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One more update, she molted last night... hopefully she has a full set of "teeth" now!
 

bryverine

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So just an update. This appears to still be a problem with her. I have had trouble with her wanting food recently (last few months) and decided to throw in a freshly molted dubia.

It looks like the fang is deformed. Not sure if this is a reoccurring thing with her, but perhaps I'll moisten her sub a bit more?

20180505_203343.jpg 20180505_203244.jpg
 

Greasylake

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I think it's been generally accepted that molting problems in the past can lead to molting problems in the future. I dont know what you think moistening the substrate more would accomplish, but it's a myth that extra humidity helps Ts molt, they're not reptiles. I would say just wait it out, eventually it'll molt right.
 

Dennis Nedry

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Humidity doesn't do much for a T in moulting, but being hydrated does. They will often drink quite a lot right before a moult so maybe she'll suck water out of the substrate
 

bryverine

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I dont know what you think moistening the substrate more would accomplish, but it's a myth that extra humidity helps Ts molt, they're not reptiles.
I was wondering if humidity could help slow the process of hardening for a better/more even "cure". Until someone does a study to measure humidity and hardening times, I can't rule that out!

My thoughts:
If one were to "flash dry" the exoskeleton (while providing moisture to mouth parts to prevent dessication, of course), the tarantula would harden funky. :anxious:

I have it 'New Mexico in drought' dry in there with a water dish she doesn't seem to want (I've found her curled up with the dish nice and full :sorry: ).
 

Dennis Nedry

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I was wondering if humidity could help slow the process of hardening for a better/more even "cure". Until someone does a study to measure humidity and hardening times, I can't rule that out!

My thoughts:
If one were to "flash dry" the exoskeleton (while providing moisture to mouth parts to prevent dessication, of course), the tarantula would harden funky. :anxious:

I have it 'New Mexico in drought' dry in there with a water dish she doesn't seem to want (I've found her curled up with the dish nice and full :sorry: ).
If she's in a deep burrow you might want to wet the lower area of sub, that way she might be more inclined to drink through it. They might live in an environment where the surface is always dry in the wild but given the depth of this species burrows it would probably be more moist towards the end of the burrow so it might be worth a try
 
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