Barometric affects on eggsac production; or Under Pressure

cacoseraph

ArachnoGod
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well, we sort of threadjacked the baromolting thread so i decided to start a new one for barosac'ing.

It's not just molts, either. What about eggsacs?

This sounds like a really cool experiment. I wish I had time to participate.
Varden for data on egg sacs if you have any laid just check to see if there was a front or change in the pressure at or withing hours of a sac being made. For us here in Oregon that just means if the rain comes, or it gets hot.
Sacs will be harder to do because we are so set on leaving pregnant mothers alone as much as possible.
Molting though, if I pay attention to my collection no molt gets by me. Sometimes slings molt when I am not paying attention but heck they are so small I dont really take the time to look I am busy waiting for them to grow up.



Umm version Ill have to get back to you I have no clue. Oh man, see I just bought this laptop and I have microsoft works on here....... I strongly dislike works. I have excel at work...... and my job is anything but demanding, so ill have plenty of time to put data onto a excel doc.
It's not just molts, either. What about eggsacs?

This sounds like a really cool experiment. I wish I had time to participate.
Varden for data on egg sacs if you have any laid just check to see if there was a front or change in the pressure at or withing hours of a sac being made. For us here in Oregon that just means if the rain comes, or it gets hot.
Sacs will be harder to do because we are so set on leaving pregnant mothers alone as much as possible.
Molting though, if I pay attention to my collection no molt gets by me. Sometimes slings molt when I am not paying attention but heck they are so small I dont really take the time to look I am busy waiting for them to grow up.



Umm version Ill have to get back to you I have no clue. Oh man, see I just bought this laptop and I have microsoft works on here....... I strongly dislike works. I have excel at work...... and my job is anything but demanding, so ill have plenty of time to put data onto a excel doc.
I believe my original statement was relating to eggsac construction. I do agree that the molting cycle is long and complex, and therefore may not be directly related to changes in pressure.
It does seem to me that I have higher volumes of sacs laid during rainstorms. Of course, I also have them laid when there are no strong weather systems. I do suspect some correlation, because I often have multiple sacs laid on rainy nights. Last Saturday it rained hard at night, and two versicolor laid that night. One female was only bred 5/9/2007, the other was bred 7/06/2006!
All of us that breed spiders should have the eggsac dates recorded, we also should be able to combine that data with barometric data fairly easily (30 min to 3-4 hours of work.) Maybe someone (who loves spreadsheets), would like to petition members for this data.
that spreadsheet lover could probably glean some from the breeding reports, too and then seek out barometric data

ah man, this might be kind of a lot work. would be worth it though if we can push correlation to causation and then optimization :D

edit:

two things:

1) i forgot to say "dirty spreadsheet lovers!"

2) we MASSIVELY hijacked the baromolting thread. maybe we should have a mold split into "Barometric affects on eggsac production" or something liek that?

and speaking of gleaning. i looked through a few species and gleaning might not be the best way to go. i need to know like, "exactly" when the eggsac was produced



also, latency. latency is going to be a mother if we forget about it. latency is defined by me, here, as the time lag between a causative event and its effect.
 

tarantulas.com

Arachnopeon
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Oct 25, 2006
Messages
45
Getting complicated!

How exact should that eggsac data be?
1)Should we start counting when the female spits out the eggs?
2)" " begins the bowl of the sac?

Can we even assume that the trigger to make a sac occurs on the day the sac is laid? Does the egg-laying process get triggered hours, days, or weeks before actual production begins? Do tarantulas have a hormone like oxytocin that stimulates "contractions"? Would anyone volunteer their gravid T for daily hemolymph draws? (I am not serious about that last one)
If anyone is serious about delving deeper we should start as broadly as possible.

Question:
"Does eggsac production, in an artificial environment, have any correlation to changes in weather systems?"

Dr. Ace is correct weather systems are much more complex than simple pressure changes. If the answer to the above question is "Yes", then it may be prudent to look into all of the stimuli associated with storms, that can affect the condition in our houses.
 
Last edited:

cacoseraph

ArachnoGod
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Messages
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How exact should that eggsac data be?
1)Should we start counting when the female spits out the eggs?
2)" " begins the bowl of the sac?

Can we even assume that the trigger to make a sac occurs on the day the sac is laid? Does the egg-laying process get triggered hours, days, or weeks before actual production begins? Do tarantulas have a hormone like oxytocin that stimulates "contractions"? Would anyone volunteer their gravid T for daily hemolymph draws? (I am not serious about that last one)
If anyone is serious about delving deeper we should start as broadly as possible.

Question:
"Does eggsac production, in an artificial environment, have any correlation to changes in weather systems?"

Dr. Ace is correct weather systems are much more complex than simple pressure changes. If the answer to the above question is "Yes", then it may be prudent to look into all of the stimuli associated with storms, that can affect the condition in our houses.
gods science is hard. at work i am just the hands... not the brains.

in answer... no, in response to Question 1)&2)
ok.... i would say... jeezy peezy. i would say from the time her commitment to making an eggsac is irrevocable? now, when *that* is... i don't know. now we need a friggin biologist. i believe they can dig a bowl and then "change their mind". argh. i'm getting too confused. must cogitate.



also, i was kind of thinking about it. there is going to be some massaging that needs to go on. like, until a spider has been mated and generated the eggs no stimulus on the planet can make her make a sac. we might have to like, take stuff like that into account. dang, i hate the real world =P



edit:
also, since tarantulas use deferred reproduction i think there is a like, easier chance for causation from events like pressure changes or something else in a storm. they get to a point where they are essentially *waiting* to be triggered. boy oh boy would i love to get my finger on that trigger :)
 

tarantulas.com

Arachnopeon
Joined
Oct 25, 2006
Messages
45
also, since tarantulas use deferred reproduction i think there is a like, easier chance for causation from events like pressure changes or something else in a storm. they get to a point where they are essentially *waiting* to be triggered. boy oh boy would i love to get my finger on that trigger :)
I think that's the whole crux of the issue. It does seem like they "choose" to drop when it's time. I would love to put the gravid G. pulchras into a pressure cooker until those eggs come right out. (just kidding, but they are really starting to frustrate me)
 

Talkenlate04

ArachnoGod
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Feb 13, 2006
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{D I can picture you taking tanks into a "secret" room and then fiddling with the pressure, then hearing a "ding" like an oven cooker and walking in and coming back with sacs. {D

There are a billion angles to all of this. And like the other thread that we chatted in, I think for now all Ill look for is when the process is started. Ill still observe changes throughout the process, but I am just curious if there is a barometric change that triggers all of it.
Same with molting, does the pressure have to change a lot? Or just get to a target zone.
Ugg its mind boggling, but I think if we start simple we can work to more complicated once we establish and prove a basic theory.
 

chrispy

Arachnosquire
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Jun 3, 2006
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Would the number of storms be a factor or the intensity of those storms.What kind of pressure differences are just on the west coast. Caso is in dry So Cal. Im in rainy Nor. cal w/dry summers. Ryan in portland w/a little summer rain, tarantula.com in Seattle w/constant rain except august. Then there is the east coast w/ serious storms all year. Is there a climate/ region that could be seen as a production zone ,like California's central valley for fruits and veggies,or Hawaii for pinapples. What about lightning ? Lightning storms create a major change, could it help sac production? Could the benifits be created artificially? My brain hurts.
 

Talkenlate04

ArachnoGod
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I have made a small observation that was seen with my last 4 egg sacs now. I am not sure if I am on to anything but it's something I am going to keep my eye out for now.
The Barometric pressure at the start of the bowl of webbing and through out the whole process till roll up for all four was virtually the same between 30.06 and 30.07.
Interesting but proves nothing. I am still happy I have something now to watch out for.
 

versiphil

Arachnopeon
Joined
Jun 12, 2007
Messages
10
as others said, there are many variables.
But there are different variables for different species.

e.g.
B.vagans will begin to build her egg sac when it`s getting drier
G.rosea will do it after having a cold period (about 8 weeks) and then getting warm again, so does pulchra
...
so every species of T`s will begin to build an egg sac, when the variables for their special habitat are best, to have as many grown up of the littles as possible...
I don`t think that pressure could be a variable that matters. Not really, because it changes all day.
 
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