Avic purpurea sling ICU recovery log

sparticus

Arachnoknight
Active Member
Joined
Jun 3, 2023
Messages
255
I haven't seen a lot of positive posts dealing with avics that were in bad shape, so I wanted to post up a detailed diary of exactly what I did with my sling and pics I took along the way to it's recovery.
Avicularia purpurea sling at 0.5"DLS
May 3rd, 2023:
Sling arrives alive from seller. Rehoused into 3"x3"x6" arboreal enclosure. Noticed sling was somewhat frantic in the new enclosure, running around at random and falling. I figured it was slipping from the panicked movement and left it over night to settle in the new space.
May 4th:
Realized sling was not doing well at all.
Symptoms: lethargic, lying on substrate, curled legs, struggling to climb
-Moved it into a smaller vial to keep it from falling while I worked on setting up something as an ICU tank.
*NOT AN APPROPRIATE AVIC ENCLOSURE* I just stuck it in here for a minute to prevent more falls while I set up the ICU tank and to record the concerning behavior.
View attachment 20230504_100739.mp4

ICU set up: I put a small bit of dry sub in the bottom of a 2" tall vial and added a slanted piece of bark. Vent holes on all 4 sides and two more vent holes in the lid. Deep water dish that is more narrow than the legspan of the spider for humidity.
Goals: -rehydrate spider
-I was also concerned it may have fallen in its first day panic and damaged the hairs that help them stick when they climb, so limit space to remove the risk of further injury from falling. Also possible it may have been shipped in premolt and couldn't climb well enough to build a normal web nest.
- get it through a molt alive, by providing an environment as similar to what it would have in its web nest as possible
What I did: •Twice or three times a day I used a syringe and needle to place a drop of water directly in the slings mouth. I did not need to open the enclosure or disturb the sling, I could insert my syringe through the vent holes and place a drop of water directly on the mouthparts. Sometimes it drank and sometimes I think I just made its face wet.
ICU tank:
20230504_132332.jpg 20230504_132459.jpg
May 5th:
No change. I thought the sling was dead this morning, but when I got home after work it had moved slightly. Continued to use syringe to place a drop of water twice or three times daily directly in the slings mouth. 20230505_175030.jpg
May 6th:
Sling was slightly more active, still looked pretty bad. Continued with water in mouth t
View attachment 20230506_135254.mp4
wice daily.
May 9th:
Sling is slightly more active. Have reduced the forced watering to once or twice daily. Offered a pre-killed pinhead cricket. Sling not interested. Sat in a somewhat normal posture on the bark for the first time today! 20230509_210301.jpg
I started offering prey every few days at this point and removing after a couple hours if the sling showed no interest. Abdomen was still quite large, not too concerned about feeding. A few days later the sling started to web on the bark.
May 20th:
Noticed sling drinking on its own from the water dish. Still offering one or two drops of water daily on webbing near where the sling is sitting. Sling accepted a live fruit fly today- not a very hearty meal, but a sign that it might be ready to eat.
May 22nd:
Offered a live adult black soldier fly, which was subsequently eaten! Sling has webbed up the bark pretty well at this point, and spends most of its time sitting there, like a normal arboreal spider. 20230522_204838.jpg
May 25th:
Sling is looking pretty dark, hopefully premolt. At this point I am waiting on a molt in the ICU enclosure before I move it into the bigger enclosure I had originally set up. If the slipping was due to damage to the hairs on the feet I wanted to make sure those were replaced before I put it in a tall enclosure. It has not shown interest again in food, so I stopped offering while waiting for it to molt. 20230525_125846.jpg
May 27th:
Another pic with a tape measure for scale and the sling showing much more normal behavior.
20230527_172853.jpg
At this point I was treating it pretty much like I do my healthy arboreal slings. I drip one or two drops of water on the webbing every two to three days, and keep the water dish full at all times.
June 24th:
Sling molts successfully!
20230624_125325.jpg
I waited for it to harden up for 6 days, and offered it a housefly as it's first post molt meal. It ate!
July 4th:
I moved it into the 3x3x6 acrylic enclosure I had set up for it originally. It started webbing it up that same day, and took a meal later that night. I watched the movement and climbing carefully, and it is normal, with the high step exploring walk that is typical for avics. It has been webbing enthusiastically, and that makes me feel like a fall will be less and less likely. I am pretty confident it is now a normal, healthy sling!

July 7th, 2023
20230707_222557.jpg
 

Ultum4Spiderz

ArachnoGod
Old Timer
Joined
Oct 13, 2011
Messages
6,093
I haven't seen a lot of positive posts dealing with avics that were in bad shape, so I wanted to post up a detailed diary of exactly what I did with my sling and pics I took along the way to it's recovery.
Avicularia purpurea sling at 0.5"DLS
May 3rd, 2023:
Sling arrives alive from seller. Rehoused into 3"x3"x6" arboreal enclosure. Noticed sling was somewhat frantic in the new enclosure, running around at random and falling. I figured it was slipping from the panicked movement and left it over night to settle in the new space.
May 4th:
Realized sling was not doing well at all.
Symptoms: lethargic, lying on substrate, curled legs, struggling to climb
-Moved it into a smaller vial to keep it from falling while I worked on setting up something as an ICU tank.
*NOT AN APPROPRIATE AVIC ENCLOSURE* I just stuck it in here for a minute to prevent more falls while I set up the ICU tank and to record the concerning behavior.
View attachment 449447

ICU set up: I put a small bit of dry sub in the bottom of a 2" tall vial and added a slanted piece of bark. Vent holes on all 4 sides and two more vent holes in the lid. Deep water dish that is more narrow than the legspan of the spider for humidity.
Goals: -rehydrate spider
-I was also concerned it may have fallen in its first day panic and damaged the hairs that help them stick when they climb, so limit space to remove the risk of further injury from falling. Also possible it may have been shipped in premolt and couldn't climb well enough to build a normal web nest.
- get it through a molt alive, by providing an environment as similar to what it would have in its web nest as possible
What I did: •Twice or three times a day I used a syringe and needle to place a drop of water directly in the slings mouth. I did not need to open the enclosure or disturb the sling, I could insert my syringe through the vent holes and place a drop of water directly on the mouthparts. Sometimes it drank and sometimes I think I just made its face wet.
ICU tank:
View attachment 449448 View attachment 449449
May 5th:
No change. I thought the sling was dead this morning, but when I got home after work it had moved slightly. Continued to use syringe to place a drop of water twice or three times daily directly in the slings mouth. View attachment 449450
May 6th:
Sling was slightly more active, still looked pretty bad. Continued with water in mouth t
View attachment 449453
wice daily.
May 9th:
Sling is slightly more active. Have reduced the forced watering to once or twice daily. Offered a pre-killed pinhead cricket. Sling not interested. Sat in a somewhat normal posture on the bark for the first time today! View attachment 449462
I started offering prey every few days at this point and removing after a couple hours if the sling showed no interest. Abdomen was still quite large, not too concerned about feeding. A few days later the sling started to web on the bark.
May 20th:
Noticed sling drinking on its own from the water dish. Still offering one or two drops of water daily on webbing near where the sling is sitting. Sling accepted a live fruit fly today- not a very hearty meal, but a sign that it might be ready to eat.
May 22nd:
Offered a live adult black soldier fly, which was subsequently eaten! Sling has webbed up the bark pretty well at this point, and spends most of its time sitting there, like a normal arboreal spider. View attachment 449469
May 25th:
Sling is looking pretty dark, hopefully premolt. At this point I am waiting on a molt in the ICU enclosure before I move it into the bigger enclosure I had originally set up. If the slipping was due to damage to the hairs on the feet I wanted to make sure those were replaced before I put it in a tall enclosure. It has not shown interest again in food, so I stopped offering while waiting for it to molt. View attachment 449471
May 27th:
Another pic with a tape measure for scale and the sling showing much more normal behavior.
View attachment 449473
At this point I was treating it pretty much like I do my healthy arboreal slings. I drip one or two drops of water on the webbing every two to three days, and keep the water dish full at all times.
June 24th:
Sling molts successfully!
View attachment 449474
I waited for it to harden up for 6 days, and offered it a housefly as it's first post molt meal. It ate!
July 4th:
I moved it into the 3x3x6 acrylic enclosure I had set up for it originally. It started webbing it up that same day, and took a meal later that night. I watched the movement and climbing carefully, and it is normal, with the high step exploring walk that is typical for avics. It has been webbing enthusiastically, and that makes me feel like a fall will be less and less likely. I am pretty confident it is now a normal, healthy sling!
Amazing success story , and a much safer practical example of an icu that actually works . Thanks for sharing!! 😃
 

cooking succs

Arachnopeon
Joined
Jun 11, 2023
Messages
8
Thank you so much for writing this out.

I don't have any T's (yet), but going through an emergency situation with my mantis, there is little to no help available online.

Good job on keeping them alive. I hope your thread will be found in the future next time this happens to someone else!
 

viper69

ArachnoGod
Old Timer
Joined
Dec 8, 2006
Messages
18,735
I haven't seen a lot of positive posts dealing with avics that were in bad shape, so I wanted to post up a detailed diary of exactly what I did with my sling and pics I took along the way to it's recovery.
Avicularia purpurea sling at 0.5"DLS
May 3rd, 2023:
Sling arrives alive from seller. Rehoused into 3"x3"x6" arboreal enclosure. Noticed sling was somewhat frantic in the new enclosure, running around at random and falling. I figured it was slipping from the panicked movement and left it over night to settle in the new space.
May 4th:
Realized sling was not doing well at all.
Symptoms: lethargic, lying on substrate, curled legs, struggling to climb
-Moved it into a smaller vial to keep it from falling while I worked on setting up something as an ICU tank.
*NOT AN APPROPRIATE AVIC ENCLOSURE* I just stuck it in here for a minute to prevent more falls while I set up the ICU tank and to record the concerning behavior.
View attachment 449447

ICU set up: I put a small bit of dry sub in the bottom of a 2" tall vial and added a slanted piece of bark. Vent holes on all 4 sides and two more vent holes in the lid. Deep water dish that is more narrow than the legspan of the spider for humidity.
Goals: -rehydrate spider
-I was also concerned it may have fallen in its first day panic and damaged the hairs that help them stick when they climb, so limit space to remove the risk of further injury from falling. Also possible it may have been shipped in premolt and couldn't climb well enough to build a normal web nest.
- get it through a molt alive, by providing an environment as similar to what it would have in its web nest as possible
What I did: •Twice or three times a day I used a syringe and needle to place a drop of water directly in the slings mouth. I did not need to open the enclosure or disturb the sling, I could insert my syringe through the vent holes and place a drop of water directly on the mouthparts. Sometimes it drank and sometimes I think I just made its face wet.
ICU tank:
View attachment 449448 View attachment 449449
May 5th:
No change. I thought the sling was dead this morning, but when I got home after work it had moved slightly. Continued to use syringe to place a drop of water twice or three times daily directly in the slings mouth. View attachment 449450
May 6th:
Sling was slightly more active, still looked pretty bad. Continued with water in mouth t
View attachment 449453
wice daily.
May 9th:
Sling is slightly more active. Have reduced the forced watering to once or twice daily. Offered a pre-killed pinhead cricket. Sling not interested. Sat in a somewhat normal posture on the bark for the first time today! View attachment 449462
I started offering prey every few days at this point and removing after a couple hours if the sling showed no interest. Abdomen was still quite large, not too concerned about feeding. A few days later the sling started to web on the bark.
May 20th:
Noticed sling drinking on its own from the water dish. Still offering one or two drops of water daily on webbing near where the sling is sitting. Sling accepted a live fruit fly today- not a very hearty meal, but a sign that it might be ready to eat.
May 22nd:
Offered a live adult black soldier fly, which was subsequently eaten! Sling has webbed up the bark pretty well at this point, and spends most of its time sitting there, like a normal arboreal spider. View attachment 449469
May 25th:
Sling is looking pretty dark, hopefully premolt. At this point I am waiting on a molt in the ICU enclosure before I move it into the bigger enclosure I had originally set up. If the slipping was due to damage to the hairs on the feet I wanted to make sure those were replaced before I put it in a tall enclosure. It has not shown interest again in food, so I stopped offering while waiting for it to molt. View attachment 449471
May 27th:
Another pic with a tape measure for scale and the sling showing much more normal behavior.
View attachment 449473
At this point I was treating it pretty much like I do my healthy arboreal slings. I drip one or two drops of water on the webbing every two to three days, and keep the water dish full at all times.
June 24th:
Sling molts successfully!
View attachment 449474
I waited for it to harden up for 6 days, and offered it a housefly as it's first post molt meal. It ate!
July 4th:
I moved it into the 3x3x6 acrylic enclosure I had set up for it originally. It started webbing it up that same day, and took a meal later that night. I watched the movement and climbing carefully, and it is normal, with the high step exploring walk that is typical for avics. It has been webbing enthusiastically, and that makes me feel like a fall will be less and less likely. I am pretty confident it is now a normal, healthy sling!

July 7th, 2023
View attachment 449476
never bet again Mother Nature I say- nice job

a few things

1 falling is a sign of premolt, the setae aren’t damaged due to fall thus preventing climbing

2 can’t say 100% but it sure seems it was dehydrated a bit - something wrong before and/or during shipping. I’ve had this happen myself with plump Avic slings shipped.

3 your second cage- that’s what it should have gone into to begin with

4 your new box - too big for my liking, when they are small, before 2”, I keep Avics in smaller setups to make sure they eat

but with your attentive care it can work
 

sparticus

Arachnoknight
Active Member
Joined
Jun 3, 2023
Messages
255
3 your second cage- that’s what it should have gone into to begin with
I bought it as 3/4", and was expecting it to be a little bit larger, so I wasn't prepared for it to be quite that small. Even after this molt it looks like it's an instar smaller than the other 3/4" slings that came in the same shipment. I've had good success with C. versicolors in set ups around that size- once they get their webbing set up my slings are very well fed. I also habitually give them "lazy water" on the webbing near where they hang out, because I'm not convinced arboreals are always great at finding their water bowls. 😊 But I agree that it's easier to monitor in a smaller space.
I originally thought it maybe was shipped in premolt, but started doubting myself when it took 8 weeks before it molted. It definitely had a very large abdomen on it when it arrived.
 

viper69

ArachnoGod
Old Timer
Joined
Dec 8, 2006
Messages
18,735
I bought it as 3/4", and was expecting it to be a little bit larger, so I wasn't prepared for it to be quite that small. Even after this molt it looks like it's an instar smaller than the other 3/4" slings that came in the same shipment. I've had good success with C. versicolors in set ups around that size- once they get their webbing set up my slings are very well fed. I also habitually give them "lazy water" on the webbing near where they hang out, because I'm not convinced arboreals are always great at finding their water bowls. 😊 But I agree that it's easier to monitor in a smaller space.
I originally thought it maybe was shipped in premolt, but started doubting myself when it took 8 weeks before it molted. It definitely had a very large abdomen on it when it arrived.
They aren’t re H2O- I’ve posted about this extensively
 

sparticus

Arachnoknight
Active Member
Joined
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Messages
255
They aren’t re H2O- I’ve posted about this extensively
Fair enough. Maybe mine are just lazy, and I'm an enabler...:rofl: Would you get up off the couch if you had someone dropping drinks off in your hand?
I have seen quite a few of mine come out to drink in the period before they get ready to molt, and they've never had any stuck molts or health problems, so it seems to be working OK for me so far. I probably (OK, fine...admittedly almost certainly) am going a little overboard, but I figure there would most likely be some condensation on webbing in nature occasionally so it probably won't do any harm. It's not a lot, literally just a couple drops here and there, and it evaporates within a few hours.
 

viper69

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Messages
18,735
Fair enough. Maybe mine are just lazy, and I'm an enabler...:rofl: Would you get up off the couch if you had someone dropping drinks off in your hand?
I have seen quite a few of mine come out to drink in the period before they get ready to molt, and they've never had any stuck molts or health problems, so it seems to be working OK for me so far. I probably (OK, fine...admittedly almost certainly) am going a little overboard, but I figure there would most likely be some condensation on webbing in nature occasionally so it probably won't do any harm. It's not a lot, literally just a couple drops here and there, and it evaporates within a few hours.
No you’re doing the right thing!!!- they “forget” it seems.
I don’t know if they forget, but Avics do their best to avoid touching the sub it’s rather amusing. I think being arboreal is a stronger drive than thirst, who knows- I sure don’t
 

sparticus

Arachnoknight
Active Member
Joined
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Messages
255
Gotcha, I misunderstood. Mine have definitely seemed a little "dumb" about finding their water bowl, but I haven't raised all that many, so my experience is limited. And being new around here I have missed out on what you have already posted- I'm sure many, many times before. 😊
I had previously read your care guide, though, which was super helpful.
 

Mike Withrow

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Joined
Jul 24, 2022
Messages
265
Gotcha, I misunderstood. Mine have definitely seemed a little "dumb" about finding their water bowl, but I haven't raised all that many, so my experience is limited. And being new around here I have missed out on what you have already posted- I'm sure many, many times before. 😊
I had previously read your care guide, though, which was super helpful.
I mean I don't know if this has crossed your mind or not but,I have the water dish for my avic mounted on her cork bark.
Like a inch and a half from the top.......

She has no problem finding it what so ever.
 

FloridaMan

Arachnopeon
Joined
Jul 4, 2023
Messages
5
I’m diving head first into this hobby (bought my first T 2 weeks ago) and so far have seen a ton of info of how to keep a spider happy but not too much in how to handle one that’s already struggling. This was an awesome story and informative thanks for sharing.
 

ladyratri

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Joined
Feb 15, 2022
Messages
608
Maybe I have an odd individual, but my A. purpurea does walk around the sub sometimes when it's exploring. I do the same with drops on the webbing for consistent drinking access, but it has definitely found the water dish...
PXL_20230425_005319811.jpg

Or sometimes checks the ground for food...
PXL_20220923_234517583.jpg

It even did some "nesting" at the base of its cork bark when it was little...I was worried at first, but it was fine 🤷
PXL_20221026_122315111.jpg

The detailed description of the rehab above was really helpful. There's such a specific idea of an "ICU" that is a death trap vs this kind that is a regular enclosure that is smaller for monitoring and optimized for both airflow and keeping the T hydrated, this will be a good thread to link folks to when they are trying to help an ailing sling recover.

So happy you had a good outcome. I tried this with a nearly-dead-on-arrival P. irminia sling and unfortunately did not have such a positive result. 😢
 

sparticus

Arachnoknight
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Joined
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Messages
255
Quick update. I believe that @viper69 was correct that it was some kind partial/internal abdominal rupture due to shipping. The slings were packaged ok inside the vials, but the vials themselves didn't have a lot of padding to keep them from being knocked around during shipping, and that combined with a big abdomen I think was the culprit. After the ICU molt as the abdomen plumped up there was a visible "scar" that I'm pretty sure was evidence of some kind of healed internal wound.
20230708_072809.jpg 20230706_095855.jpg
The sling has just molted again a couple days ago, so I'm hopeful it will be fully healed and the scar will be gone now.
 

viper69

ArachnoGod
Old Timer
Joined
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Messages
18,735
I bought it as 3/4", and was expecting it to be a little bit larger, so I wasn't prepared for it to be quite that small. Even after this molt it looks like it's an instar smaller than the other 3/4" slings that came in the same shipment. I've had good success with C. versicolors in set ups around that size- once they get their webbing set up my slings are very well fed. I also habitually give them "lazy water" on the webbing near where they hang out, because I'm not convinced arboreals are always great at finding their water bowls. 😊 But I agree that it's easier to monitor in a smaller space.
I originally thought it maybe was shipped in premolt, but started doubting myself when it took 8 weeks before it molted. It definitely had a very large abdomen on it when it arrived.
They aren’t- I’ve written this alot for maybe a decade or more 😄

“Lazy”
 

sparticus

Arachnoknight
Active Member
Joined
Jun 3, 2023
Messages
255
Update: Sling (probably more of a juvie now) is healthy and happy, loves to eat, and will be getting an enclosure upgrade after the next molt. Funny to see how tiny it looked in there in the old pics. 😊
20240229_092406.jpg
 
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