Aphonopelma Sp. smithi

jeff1962

Arachnobaron
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I seen a dealer with a spider called Aphonopelma sp. smithi.Its a female,and according to them rare,which it must be because I can't find a picture of it anywhere.I looked in the gallery here and did not see it.Has anyone here heard of this ?if so do you have a pic?I am looking to add to my collection and this sounds interesting.The dealer wants 139.00 for it.
 

AphonopelmaTX

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Search for "Aphonopelma smithi" on Google. I bet it's being sold as "Aphonopelma sp. smithi" because the seller doesn't have a positive ID but thinks it is Aphonopelma smithi. If it is, than it's a typical blonde tarantula from the American southwest, southern California to be more specific, and it resembles Aphonopelma chalcodes or Aphonopelma sp. "Carlsbad Green." Behavior wise they are just like any other Aphonopelma sp.- will either construct their own burrow or dig out one underneath an object in the ground. There is nothing really special about it to warrant a 139 dollar price tag. Calling any tarantula in the USA "rare" is a bit outlandish in my opinion. Sure there can be locations which finding a tarantula is rare, but that doesn't mean a species itself is rare. This is why I do not believe any tarantula in the USA should be sold for more than 20 bucks to another resident of the USA whether it be an adult female, male, or early instar. More often than not they are collected from their natural habitat, labeled with a scientific name that's no better than a guess, then sold for an incredibly high price.

My advice to you is to get as much information as you possible can on these spiders that are being sold for that much money and carefully consider whether or not it is worth 139 dollars. Try asking how many he/ she has "in stock". They can't be too rare if they are constantly being sold on Arachnoboards, right? 139 dollars is what Americans would easily pay for an immature Poecilotheria metallica, not a native blonde/ brown species! :)

- Lonnie
 

LadySharon

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Is it Aphonopelma bicoloratum? They are black and red like B smithis and B bohemi ....

I don't think I can link to the pic (well I can I just don't think it's allowed)

go to http://www.southernspiderworks.com/InvenList.aspx and scroll down (I HOPE I can at least put the website - if not - my apologies)

they are in alphabetical order. The eye icon is a link to pics.

I want one - so I reconized the "aphonopelma" part... and I know it looks kinda like a smithi....

If that's what it is.. it is indeed rare.

- Sharon
 

Drachenjager

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Search for "Aphonopelma smithi" on Google. I bet it's being sold as "Aphonopelma sp. smithi" because the seller doesn't have a positive ID but thinks it is Aphonopelma smithi. If it is, than it's a typical blonde tarantula from the American southwest, southern California to be more specific, and it resembles Aphonopelma chalcodes or Aphonopelma sp. "Carlsbad Green." Behavior wise they are just like any other Aphonopelma sp.- will either construct their own burrow or dig out one underneath an object in the ground. There is nothing really special about it to warrant a 139 dollar price tag. Calling any tarantula in the USA "rare" is a bit outlandish in my opinion. Sure there can be locations which finding a tarantula is rare, but that doesn't mean a species itself is rare. This is why I do not believe any tarantula in the USA should be sold for more than 20 bucks to another resident of the USA whether it be an adult female, male, or early instar. More often than not they are collected from their natural habitat, labeled with a scientific name that's no better than a guess, then sold for an incredibly high price.

My advice to you is to get as much information as you possible can on these spiders that are being sold for that much money and carefully consider whether or not it is worth 139 dollars. Try asking how many he/ she has "in stock". They can't be too rare if they are constantly being sold on Arachnoboards, right? 139 dollars is what Americans would easily pay for an immature Poecilotheria metallica, not a native blonde/ brown species! :)

- Lonnie
what about A. moderatum? those things are pretty rare now in the wild and even more rare in captivity.
Also id like to get p. metallica for 139....last i saw was slings for 200
 

AphonopelmaTX

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what about A. moderatum? those things are pretty rare now in the wild and even more rare in captivity.
Also id like to get p. metallica for 139....last i saw was slings for 200
I'm not too familiar with the populations of A. moderatum down in good 'ol south Texas, but it wouldn't surprise me if it's true that their numbers are dropping, especially in Laredo. I have seen first hand a "shipment" of a couple hundred wild caught A. moderatum and it was sickening to say the least. Come to think of it, I may need to research their distribution outside of Laredo because since you mentioned it, I haven't seen A. moderatum on dealers' price lists in a long time.

If a species of native U.S. tarantula is actually rare, the more reason to not buy them I think.

- Lonnie
 

jeff1962

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Thanks for all your input and advice, I emailed the seller and ask for more info and a pic. I have yet to get a response.If I do I will post it here.Meantime I will probably stick with buying from Southern spider works,till I learn more.They were the first people I have dealt with and was super pleased with both the T's and the service.
 

reptist

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Search for "Aphonopelma smithi" on Google. I bet it's being sold as "Aphonopelma sp. smithi" because the seller doesn't have a positive ID but thinks it is Aphonopelma smithi. If it is, than it's a typical blonde tarantula from the American southwest, southern California to be more specific, and it resembles Aphonopelma chalcodes or Aphonopelma sp. "Carlsbad Green." Behavior wise they are just like any other Aphonopelma sp.- will either construct their own burrow or dig out one underneath an object in the ground. There is nothing really special about it to warrant a 139 dollar price tag. Calling any tarantula in the USA "rare" is a bit outlandish in my opinion. Sure there can be locations which finding a tarantula is rare, but that doesn't mean a species itself is rare. This is why I do not believe any tarantula in the USA should be sold for more than 20 bucks to another resident of the USA whether it be an adult female, male, or early instar. More often than not they are collected from their natural habitat, labeled with a scientific name that's no better than a guess, then sold for an incredibly high price.

My advice to you is to get as much information as you possible can on these spiders that are being sold for that much money and carefully consider whether or not it is worth 139 dollars. Try asking how many he/ she has "in stock". They can't be too rare if they are constantly being sold on Arachnoboards, right? 139 dollars is what Americans would easily pay for an immature Poecilotheria metallica, not a native blonde/ brown species! :)

- Lonnie
For starters, Lonnie, I'm sorry that you seem to think that I am so lacking in knowledge that I would just take wild guesses as to the species I offer, the spider in question is labled as it is because there has yet to be a female of the species described so it is realy the only correct way to post it, let me assure you that I have done my homework here before ever posting her for sale, she was collected w/a now dead male that I positively I.d'd as smithi myself based on the fact that they were collected just off of hwy 152 between Fresno and San Jose which is documented by Andrew Smith as within this species' range, from there I further took measurements of the male when he passed and compared the results to those of smith , I have the exact leg measurements and pat+tib against carapace comparrisons as well as some fair pix of the scopulae covering the distinctive 50% of the metatarsus on leg 4, also congruent w/ smiths description. In the 15 yrs I have been in the hobby I have NEVER seen this species offered for sale, I have asked countless people as well if they have and the answer is always no, make no mistake Lonnie, this spider is deffinately RARE!!!
In the above post your claiming that the spider looks like a "typical Blonde Tarantula" Here are 2 "blonde" tarantulas as well as the carlsbad green which you also compare it too, could you venture a guess at what the spider looks like with the info you have just given the O.P., especialy if that person is somewhat new to the hobby your ramblings could be extremely confusing, I mean look at these spiders, they look nothing alike
Aphonopelma chalcodes
View attachment 64161

Payson Blonde
View attachment 64160

Carlsbad Green
View attachment 64162
As far as behavior goes these 3 species as well as A.smithi are like night and day,and then there are personalities inside the species that can differ as well, man talk about misinformation.........your going to get the guy/girl bit!!!
Now I'll tell you a bit about rare Aphonopelma, A. behlei, enough said!! youve never been hunting for the elusive A behlei I take it, this species is an "open pit burrower" they dig down the side of a usualy 75-100 lb rock and put a small 3" pit directly in the center of the rocks mass and so you have to flip rocks in order to locate 1 and in a day thats usualy all you'll find "1" and you'll have way more than 139.00 worth of work under your belt, and to the O.P. please dont be discouraged toward american species because of what this man/woman says, as you can tell he/she lacks the practicle experience to make most of the statements in his/her post and there is little study behind most of his/her opinions on spiders of the southwest, I'll close w/ a pic. of the real A. sp smithi and I only have one in stock, in case you havent heard they are a RARE species to come across, PEACE B.

Aphonopelma sp. smithi
View attachment 64163
 
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jeff1962

Arachnobaron
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Wow ! Reptist, I really appreciate your response. As you guessed I am new to this hobby.Also thanks for the education on spyders of the southwest.From looking at the pics you posted I am leaning towards the Payson blonde,how are those in captivity? Do they burrow rarley to be seen? I am trying to steer clear of those types,I have an A. semani that I never see.Depending on behavior I will most likley purchase one,as well as something else before it gets to cold here in the great white north to ship.
 

AR-Tarantula

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Not to mix it up more, but I have to concur with Lonnie. One important thing to take into consideration when talking about North American Aphonopelma is the very slip-shod manner in which most species were described. Smith's (and Chamberlin's as well) work is a mess - they typically relied upon single specimens for descriptions, used bogus, meaningless characters. Take a look at some of Tom Prentice's work and you will see what is wrong with Smith's and Chamberlin's descriptions. Since Smith did not use series of specimens to define species, you are basing a species identity on the characteristcs of one individual - that does not take into consideration local variation.

A good example is A. hentzi versus A. wichitanum. The characters used to define A. wichitanum are pretty much useless for ID-ing one in the field. If you look at large series of specimens across the range of hentzi and wichitanum you will see that they are in fact the same species (no one has published this yet). They are also genetically identical (we have run the genetics here in Arkansas). But until someone corrects it in the literature they can still be sold as different species, even though they are the same. That is why I am really leary of "newly discovered, unnamed" Aphonopelma species - most probably aren't new, just variants of an already existing species.
 

GoTerps

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Hi Lonnie,

I have seen first hand a "shipment" of a couple hundred wild caught A. moderatum and it was sickening to say the least. Come to think of it, I may need to research their distribution outside of Laredo because since you mentioned it, I haven't seen A. moderatum on dealers' price lists in a long time.
- Lonnie
And I know for a fact that in years past, one individual alone "harvested" over 2,000 adult female "A. moderatum" from one general area for the pet trade :(

Eric
 

Stan Schultz

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... Calling any tarantula in the USA "rare" is a bit outlandish in my opinion. Sure there can be locations which finding a tarantula is rare, but that doesn't mean a species itself is rare. This is why I do not believe any tarantula in the USA should be sold for more than 20 bucks to another resident of the USA whether it be an adult female, male, or early instar. More often than not they are collected from their natural habitat, labeled with a scientific name that's no better than a guess, then sold for an incredibly high price. ...
Ahhhh! The voice of reason in a troubled world.
 

reptist

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Payson blonde

Wow ! Reptist, I really appreciate your response. As you guessed I am new to this hobby.Also thanks for the education on spyders of the southwest.From looking at the pics you posted I am leaning towards the Payson blonde,how are those in captivity? Do they burrow rarley to be seen? I am trying to steer clear of those types,I have an A. semani that I never see.Depending on behavior I will most likley purchase one,as well as something else before it gets to cold here in the great white north to ship.
The Payson Blondes are an open pit burrower, but I've found that if you just offer a hide they will use it just as well, Here is how I house them and I have hatched 2 sacs this year, the mothers rarely used any hide at all and neither seemed overly stressed or tried eating the sac. PEACE B.

View attachment 64178
View attachment 64179
View attachment 64180
 
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Drachenjager

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I'm not too familiar with the populations of A. moderatum down in good 'ol south Texas, but it wouldn't surprise me if it's true that their numbers are dropping, especially in Laredo. I have seen first hand a "shipment" of a couple hundred wild caught A. moderatum and it was sickening to say the least. Come to think of it, I may need to research their distribution outside of Laredo because since you mentioned it, I haven't seen A. moderatum on dealers' price lists in a long time.

If a species of native U.S. tarantula is actually rare, the more reason to not buy them I think.

- Lonnie
only if WC.
I am trying to breed them ...well get them to breed in captivity anyway lol
but darn they grow slow...not that they have far to go since they are a small one but hey
 
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